The Bible says they had wine at the Last Supper
toldailytopic: Is it a sin to drink alcoholic beverages?
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The Bible says they had wine at the Last Supper
elohiym
Well-known member
Did anyone at the last supper become intoxicated to any degree?
Yeah, how much is too much. 2 drinks? 3 drinks? 4 drinks? Is it okay as long as I can still walk? It's just so confusing. :dizzy:
The Bible says they had wine at the Last Supper
elohiym
Well-known member
And that wine was alcoholic.
Do you assume that none of them became intoxicated to any degree? :idunno:
screamin4u2hear
New member
Not to get distracted from the OP or the current flow of the argument, but I have a question about the fermentation process. I don't know much about the process but I believe that the longer you allow something to ferment the stronger the alcoholic content becomes. Is this true? :think:
I have been told that in Jesus time the fermentation process was not as advanced as it is today, therefore the wine of their time was much less potent than the wine of our time. Just curious what peoples' takes are on this opinion.
If the opinion stated above is correct, I know some people who then claim that we should not drink because the "strong drink" of our day is stronger than that of Jesus' day. Aside from this being a moving target... it also doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
lain:
In fact my wife went to Austria around the time of wine harvest and at that time they have a special drink (I can't think of the name). But the alcohol content is VERY LOW because it only fermented for a short time. She said that kind of wine is the MOST common for people to get drunk on. It tastes very much like fresh grape juice and since you cannot tell there is alcohol in it, you become overly intoxicated very easily. :jump: After coming back to the states and visiting several wineries in different places, we learned that this kind of alcoholic drink is actually illegal in the U.S. because it is so easy to get drunk on. Just some food for thought there.
In regards to the OP; I do not think it is a sin to consume alcohol. I do think living a lifestyle dependent (drunkenness) of alcohol is a sin, just like living a lifestyle that is dependent upon anything other than Christ. Anytime we put something in between us and God or we elevate something to the same status as God, it becomes sin.
:cheers:
I have been told that in Jesus time the fermentation process was not as advanced as it is today, therefore the wine of their time was much less potent than the wine of our time. Just curious what peoples' takes are on this opinion.
If the opinion stated above is correct, I know some people who then claim that we should not drink because the "strong drink" of our day is stronger than that of Jesus' day. Aside from this being a moving target... it also doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
lain:In fact my wife went to Austria around the time of wine harvest and at that time they have a special drink (I can't think of the name). But the alcohol content is VERY LOW because it only fermented for a short time. She said that kind of wine is the MOST common for people to get drunk on. It tastes very much like fresh grape juice and since you cannot tell there is alcohol in it, you become overly intoxicated very easily. :jump: After coming back to the states and visiting several wineries in different places, we learned that this kind of alcoholic drink is actually illegal in the U.S. because it is so easy to get drunk on. Just some food for thought there.
In regards to the OP; I do not think it is a sin to consume alcohol. I do think living a lifestyle dependent (drunkenness) of alcohol is a sin, just like living a lifestyle that is dependent upon anything other than Christ. Anytime we put something in between us and God or we elevate something to the same status as God, it becomes sin.
:cheers:
WandererInFog
New member
No. The wines and other fermented beverages would have been as (if not more) potent that what is available today. Even distillation goes back well into the 2nd millenium BC.
The Graphite
New member
DocJohnson
New member
No. There are some, like myself, who have an extremely high tolerance and even immunity to alcohol.
PlastikBuddha
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lucy
New member
Yeah, but the main preservative (someone correct me on this if I am mistaken) was salt, wasn't it, not the fermentation process...
Lucy
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
I can't give you an exact figure...:think:
...but I know it when I can barely see it. :cheers:
If you set your alarm clock to take a drink, you've probably had too much.
If you'd call counting to ten "math" you've probably had too much.
If you think driving your lawn tractor to the liquor store is a sound idea, you've probably had too much.
If nobody else at the funeral home gets the joke, you've probably had too much.
And so on...
lain:
lucy
New member
The Bible does not say. If I were Judas, it might have been a good idea! No, seriously, I think we American's have a hard time with alcohol because so many of us abuse it. A missionary who came to my church once reported that in other cultures, beer (i.e. alcohol) is perfectly acceptable for Christians, but coffee and the like, which have caffeine, are totally unacceptable because caffeine is highly addictive. The Bible does not mention caffeine at all. I think the point the Bible makes is when you drink alcohol, do it for medicinal purposes (there is a mention of that, can't remember where, but it is in the New Testament), or as a part of a celebration, (Jesus celebrated at the wedding), but don't make a fool of yourself by overindulging and acting like an idiot or by drinking so as to become an addict; an addiction becomes an idol in this case, since you are putting your drug of choice before God and depending on the drug to "solve" or at least "numb" your problems.
That all being said, No, I do not think it is a sin to drink alcohol responsibly, that is, like you would drink any other beverage. Do you drink water or orange juice or any other beverage until it makes you pass out? You can drink enough water in a short period of time that it will kill you, you know. Use your common sense and you will be ok.
DocJohnson
New member
Somewhat true... if you don't mind jerkey meat and pickled foods. However, salt is also used in the fermentation process because it inhibits the growth of molds and yeast.
lowerlevel
New member
(1Ti 5:23) No longer drink water exclusively, but use a little wine for the sake of your stomach and your frequent ailments.
seems water is not the PERFECT drink as someone previously said...
seems water is not the PERFECT drink as someone previously said...
lowerlevel
New member
But what about
"Is it a sin to drink alcohol in the presence of those who think it is a sin."
OR
"Is it a sin to drink alcohol in the presence of one who struggles with alcoholism"
I think both are situational but the second question is a bit more obvious than the first.
"Is it a sin to drink alcohol in the presence of those who think it is a sin."
OR
"Is it a sin to drink alcohol in the presence of one who struggles with alcoholism"
I think both are situational but the second question is a bit more obvious than the first.
I think it is sinful to over indulge in drinking alcoholic beverages.
I am a teetotaler when it comes to alcoholic beverages, and have been since 1974.
I find it interesting what is written in the Proverbs about wine, I think that all alcoholic beverages would fit this description.
I am a teetotaler when it comes to alcoholic beverages, and have been since 1974.
I find it interesting what is written in the Proverbs about wine, I think that all alcoholic beverages would fit this description.
Proverbs 20:1
Wine is a mocker,
Strong drink is a brawler,
And whoever is led astray by it is not wise.
Does this sound familiar . . .
Proverbs 23:30-35
30 Those who linger long at the wine,
Those who go in search of mixed wine.
31 Do not look on the wine when it is red,
When it sparkles in the cup,
When it swirls around smoothly;
32 At the last it bites like a serpent,
And stings like a viper.
33 Your eyes will see strange things,
And your heart will utter perverse things.
34 Yes, you will be like one who lies down in the midst of the sea,
Or like one who lies at the top of the mast, saying:
35 "They have struck me, but I was not hurt;
They have beaten me, but I did not feel it.
When shall I awake, that I may seek another drink?"
Wine is a mocker,
Strong drink is a brawler,
And whoever is led astray by it is not wise.
Does this sound familiar . . .
Proverbs 23:30-35
30 Those who linger long at the wine,
Those who go in search of mixed wine.
31 Do not look on the wine when it is red,
When it sparkles in the cup,
When it swirls around smoothly;
32 At the last it bites like a serpent,
And stings like a viper.
33 Your eyes will see strange things,
And your heart will utter perverse things.
34 Yes, you will be like one who lies down in the midst of the sea,
Or like one who lies at the top of the mast, saying:
35 "They have struck me, but I was not hurt;
They have beaten me, but I did not feel it.
When shall I awake, that I may seek another drink?"
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