ECT Has Jesus' authority been usurped by MAD has MAD placed ALL authority in Paul ?

[Nang]

You're incorrect. No one is marginalizing Christ. Everything Christ taught while here on earth is explained through what the Risen Lord revealed to Paul.

Really?

Can you produce the entire Sermon on the Mount with scriptural references matching Paul's teachings?

We must always go back to what Jesus taught while here on earth, but we must look forward in order to understand what He meant.

"Forward" to Paul?

Why?

Are you claiming Paul alone opens up the Scriptures?

Jesus said He would send the Holy Spirit who, with His own authority, would lead believers into all Truth and tell us things to come. John 16:7-15

Jesus never hinted nor predicted the church body would receive the fullness of Truth from an Apostle, by any name.

 

[glorydaz]

Jesus said why call me Lord Lord and do not the things I have commanded you !

Perfect example. Jesus knew why they COULD NOT do as He'd commanded. Man can never accomplish righteousness through his own efforts. Romans 8::3

Jesus was speaking of what only HE could fulfil in us through His death and resurrection....what the law could never do, and what we could never accomplish through our own efforts. Romans 8:3

Luke 6:4648
And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.​

It's through Paul that we are able to understand what/who that "foundation" is.

1 Corinthians 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
​

.

You really do not understand much of what Paul taught.

Paul said to follow Jesus.

Scripture says that Paul taught the faith he once sought to destroy.Paul after he was saved taught the faith of those who were in Christ before Paul.

Peter preached the Gospel of grace JUST like Paul did.

Perhaps it's you that doesn't understand. You have donkeyed down, being stuck in your defensiveness that keeps you from moving forward.

 

[glorydaz]

Really?

Can you produce the entire Sermon on the Mount with scriptural references matching Paul's teachings?




"Forward" to Paul?

Why?

Are you claiming Paul alone opens up the Scriptures?

Jesus said He would send the Holy Spirit who, with His own authority, would lead believers into all Truth and tell us things to come. John 16:7-15

Jesus never hinted nor predicted the church body would receive the fullness of Truth from an Apostle, by any name.

I'm not into teaching kindergarten today, Nang.

 

[Nang]

I'm not into teaching kindergarten today, Nang.

What I thought . . you are unwilling to find the Sermon on the Mount, explained by Paul; nor do you want to try.

Because you know your ways are wrong and that your MAD teachings marginalize the authority of Triune God altogether.

 

[dodge]

You're incorrect. No one is marginalizing Christ. Everything Christ taught while here on earth is explained through what the Risen Lord revealed to Paul. It's for the believer to use scripture to explain scripture. But, if you're so busy being defensive about what the Lord taught while He walked among us, you'll miss what He intends for you to learn from it. We must always go back to what Jesus taught while here on earth, but we must look forward in order to understand what He meant.

Matthew 5:48
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Colossians 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.​

Why would Galatians say that Paul preached the "faith" he once sought to destroy if the gospel of grace was not being preached ? What exactly do you believe Paul was preaching when he preached the faith he once sought to destroy ? The Gospel of grace was being preached before Paul was even saved.

 

[glorydaz]

Why would Galatians say that Paul preached the "faith" he once sought to destroy if the gospel of grace was not being preached ? What exactly do you believe Paul was preaching when he preached the faith he once sought to destroy ? The Gospel of grace was being preached before Paul was even saved.

They had heard about Saul/Paul who had met Jesus on the road to Damascus and assumed it was the same gospel as that which the other apostles were preaching. They had "heard only"....

Gal. 1:23 But they had heard only, That he which persecuted us in times past now preacheth the faith which once he destroyed.​

Paul didn't go to the other apostles to see what they preached. He knew what the Lord had revealed to him, and that's what he proceeded to preach.

GAL. 1:16-17 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood: Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.​

Paul was faithfully preaching what the risen Lord had revealed to him. It was later that he met up with Peter. We know Peter was then taught by Paul his Gospel of Salvation.

Gal. 1:18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.
But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother Now the things which I write unto you, behold, before God, I lie not. Afterwards I came into the regions of Syria and Cilicia; And was unknown by face unto the churches of Judaea which were in Christ:​

 

[glorydaz]

What I thought . . you are unwilling to find the Sermon on the Mount, explained by Paul; nor do you want to try.

Because you know your ways are wrong and that your MAD teachings marginalize the authority of Triune God altogether.

No, I'm unwilling to waste time on your silly games that has nothing to do with my conversation with Dodge.

 

[dodge]

They had heard about Saul/Paul who had met Jesus on the road to Damascus and assumed it was the same gospel as that which the other apostles were preaching. They had "heard only"....

Gal. 1:23 But they had heard only, That he which persecuted us in times past now preacheth the faith which once he destroyed.​

Paul didn't go to the other apostles to see what they preached. He knew what the Lord had revealed to him, and that's what he proceeded to preach.

GAL. 1:16-17 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood: Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.​

Paul was faithfully preaching what the risen Lord had revealed to him. It was later that he met up with Peter. We know Peter was then taught by Paul his Gospel of Salvation.

Gal. 1:18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.
But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother Now the things which I write unto you, behold, before God, I lie not. Afterwards I came into the regions of Syria and Cilicia; And was unknown by face unto the churches of Judaea which were in Christ:​

Looks like YOU still cannot see what Galatians recorded ! Galatians says Paul preached the "faith" he once sought to destroy. So if you read it in context Paul preached what he before had sought to destroy. They (those in the B.O.C.) were preaching the gospel of grace that Paul after being saved preached the faith he once sought to destroy.

See it really is not that hard to understand unless you purposely confuse yourself.

 

[glorydaz]

Looks like YOU still cannot see what Galatians recorded ! Galatians says Paul preached the "faith" he once sought to destroy. So if you read it in context Paul preached what he before had sought to destroy. They (those in the B.O.C.) were preaching the gospel of grace that Paul after being saved preached the faith he once sought to destroy.

See it really is not that hard to understand unless you purposely confuse yourself.

You have ignored how Paul preached what the Lord revealed to him. He didn't go to the other apostles, and the Galatians were only reporting what they had "heard" about it being a common faith. I would appreciate it if you would at least acknowledge that you read that part...since it seems you have tossed it out too quickly.


Show me where you see they were preaching the Gospel of Grace?

Peter says, "Repent and be baptized"....

Do you see "grace" in there. Do you see "faith"?

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.​

Paul says, "By grace, you are saved through faith".

Do you see "Repent and be baptized"?

Eph. 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:​

 

[dodge]

You have ignored how Paul preached what the Lord revealed to him. He didn't go to the other apostles, and the Galatians were only reporting what they had "heard" about it being a common faith. I would appreciate it if you would at least acknowledge that you read that part...since it seems you have tossed it out too quickly.


Show me where you see they were preaching the Gospel of Grace?

Peter says, "Repent and be baptized"....

Do you see "grace" in there. Do you see "faith"?

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.​

Paul says, "By grace, you are saved through faith".

Do you see "Repent and be baptized"?

Eph. 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:​

YOU have ignored how the gospel was revealed to ALL the Apostles as recorded in scripture.

Eph 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

If you deny that the other Apostles were given the gospel of grace by "SPIRIT" you are DENYING the truth of scripture.

 

[glorydaz]

YOU have ignored how the gospel was revealed to ALL the Apostles as recorded in scripture.

Eph 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

If you deny that the other Apostles were given the gospel of grace by "SPIRIT" you are DENYING the truth of scripture.

Did you see the words "IS NOW REVEALED"? It was revealed as the Risen Lord gave Paul revelation by the Spirit, and he passed it on to the others. Paul tells us how that came about and it's recorded in Acts, as well.

Paul had to reprimand Peter for compelling the Gentiles to "repent, be baptized, be circumcised, etc. (works of the law).

Gal. 2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?​

Gal. 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.


Gal. 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.​

 

[dodge]

Did you see the words "IS NOW REVEALED"? It was revealed as the Risen Lord gave Paul revelation by the Spirit, and he passed it on to the others. Paul tells us how that came about and it's recorded in Acts, as well.

Paul had to reprimand Peter for compelling the Gentiles to "repent, be baptized, be circumcised, etc. (works of the law).

Gal. 2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?​

Gal. 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.


Gal. 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.​

Did you "SEE" who the gospel of grace was revealed by ?

Eph 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Post the scripture where Paul rebuked Peter over REPENTANCE or BAPTISM ! I believe you are adding what is not in scripture where Paul rebuked Peter.

The Apostle Paul taught repentance just like Jesus and ALL the other Apostles, and Paul was water baptized just like Jesus and everyone in scripture who was saved except for the thief on the cross who did not have the opportunity to be baptized.

Act 20:21
testifying to both Jews and Greeks repentance towards God, and faith towards our Lord Jesus Christ.

If you don't need to repent then you don't need to have faith in the Lord Jesus,and without faith in the Lord Jesus there is no salvation.

 

[glorydaz]

Did you "SEE" who the gospel of grace was revealed by ?

And how do you think the Risen Lord gave Paul revelation except through the Spirit? How do you think Peter received that revelation except through Paul's preaching of the justification of faith? Through the Spirit.

Why are you nitpicking about something that should be so obvious? I know? You like to argue.

Eph 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Post the scripture where Paul rebuked Peter over REPENTANCE or BAPTISM ! I believe you are adding what is not in scripture where Paul rebuked Peter.

Read Acts and you'll find it. This information is spread out over several chapters. First, how John's baptism is not the same as the baptism of the Spirit, and then how circumcision was not to be pushed upon the Gentiles, then how Peter informed his followers that they would be saved in the same way as the Gentiles were....by believing unto salvation. It's time you did some of your own homework. When someone gives a man food, he doesn't appreciate it as much as if he has to work for it.

Then, ask yourself why Paul doesn't preach "repent and be baptized". You've just assumed it didn't need to be said anymore because everyone was used to it or something. But, of course, that's not true. It should be all through Paul's letters if it still was being preached.

 

[steko]

Did you "SEE" who the gospel of grace was revealed by ?

Yeah, we knew that.

1Co 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
1Co 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
1Co 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[glorydaz]

The Apostle Paul taught repentance just like Jesus and ALL the other Apostles, and Paul was water baptized just like Jesus and everyone in scripture who was saved except for the thief on the cross who did not have the opportunity to be baptized.

Act 20:21
testifying to both Jews and Greeks repentance towards God, and faith towards our Lord Jesus Christ.

If you don't need to repent then you don't need to have faith in the Lord Jesus,and without faith in the Lord Jesus there is no salvation.

First you have to understand what repentance is. It's a change of mind.


The baptism of repentance was for the Jews. Here's why. They had to accept their works were dead works, and their faith toward God was not enough.

Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,​

The Gentiles didn't need that "baptism of repentance" because they did not believe in God and they had no religion or works.

So, you're wrong. Paul was baptized with John's baptism because he was a Jew.

The only "repentance" Paul talked about was "repentance TOWARD GOD and faith in Jesus Christ. Both Jews and Gentiles need to believe....have faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.


Show me where Paul preached "repent and be baptized". He didn't.

Paul preached believe unto righteousness. Nothing else required or allowed since boasting is excluded by the law of Faith. That's why Paul says he's glad he didn't baptize but only a very few....because man would boast. And they did boast.

 

[musterion]

Dodge,

What was revealed to Paul that God had never revealed to anyone before?

 

[patrick jane]

Dodge,

What was revealed to Paul that God had never revealed to anyone before?

He has no clue, nor does he care

 

[musterion]

Probably not but let's see what he comes up with.

 

[dodge]

First you have to understand what repentance is. It's a change of mind.


The baptism of repentance was for the Jews. Here's why. They had to accept their works were dead works, and their faith toward God was not enough.

Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,​

The Gentiles didn't need that "baptism of repentance" because they did not believe in God and they had no religion or works.

So, you're wrong. Paul was baptized with John's baptism because he was a Jew.

The only "repentance" Paul talked about was "repentance TOWARD GOD and faith in Jesus Christ. Both Jews and Gentiles need to believe....have faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.


Show me where Paul preached "repent and be baptized". He didn't.

Paul preached believe unto righteousness. Nothing else required or allowed since boasting is excluded by the law of Faith. That's why Paul says he's glad he didn't baptize but only a very few....because man would boast. And they did boast.

Paul preached a repentance TOWARDS God. A repentance towards God means a turning from something to turn towards God . Paul was preaching to turn FROM sin and towards God.

Act 20:21
testifying to both Jews and Greeks repentance towards God, and faith towards our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[dodge]

He has no clue, nor does he care

Read my signature YOU have zero clue.