ECT Two Bodies of Believers in the NT

[heir]

Heir, share with me again your understanding of why Paul brought up the Lord's Supper; I just saw something there I'd not seen before.

Or pm it, if you believe you need to.

Thanks.

I've run out of time for now, but will be back later with it.

 

[Danoh]

GO, you posted in your post #36 that...

The English translations of that verse have caused a lot of heretical doctrines.
The word ὀρθοτομέω means "to make straight and smooth, to handle aright, to teach the truth directly and correctly", not split it up into what you want to apply to you and what you don't want to apply to you.

Do you not see that requires having to both note, and respect, not only those things that are the same, but also, those that differ?

That is exactly what Paul does in 2 Tim. 2:15's surrounding passages.

Reread your own words. You have just said as much, unaware that you have.

 

[Danoh]

I've run out of time for now, but will be back later with it.

Til then.

 

[jamie]

LOL...um...no and neither are you!

The entire NT was written by Hebrews for Hebrews in the context of Hebrew culture and from a Hebrew perspective.

Those who try to understand the scriptures from any other perspective fail. Even Paul was a Hebrew of Hebrews.

...circumcised the eighth day of the stock of Israel of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of the Hebrews; concerning the law, a Pharisee... (Philippians 3:5 NKJV)​

Paul was a Hebrew rabbi but like the other apostles did not understand scripture until the Holy Spirit opened his mind to understand.

I doubt that Paul ever even imagined there would exist a book called the New Testament. Paul taught from the Hebrew scriptures from a Hebrew perspective even though he was a natural born Roman citizen. Paul testified he never taught against Jewish law, never taught against God's Temple and never taught insurrection (Acts 25:8).

So who is a legitimate Hebrew?

Paul explained, "Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham." (Galatians 3:7)

For those who claim they are not a Hebrew, I understand and I agree.

 

[patrick jane]

The entire NT was written by Hebrews for Hebrews in the context of Hebrew culture and from a Hebrew perspective.

Those who try to understand the scriptures from any other perspective fail. Even Paul was a Hebrew of Hebrews.

...circumcised the eighth day of the stock of Israel of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of the Hebrews; concerning the law, a Pharisee... (Philippians 3:5 NKJV)​

Paul was a Hebrew rabbi but like the other apostles did not understand scripture until the Holy Spirit opened his mind to understand.

I doubt that Paul ever even imagined there would exist a book called the New Testament. Paul taught from the Hebrew scriptures from a Hebrew perspective even though he was a natural born Roman citizen. Paul testified he never taught against Jewish law, never taught against God's Temple and never taught insurrection (Acts 25:8).

So who is a legitimate Hebrew?

Paul explained, "Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham." (Galatians 3:7)

For those who claim they are not a Hebrew, I understand and I agree.

Romans 11:13 KJV -

 

[patrick jane]

I get to believe all of the Bible, while you have to struggle, twist, stretch and wrest things that differ in your failed attempt to force them to say the same thing which you know they don't. It would be more excellent for you to approve them believing they mean what they say, as they say it and to whom they say it.

Excellent !!!

 

[genuineoriginal]

It means what it says.

It doesn't say what you think it says.

I get to believe all of the Bible,

You get to believe none of the Bible applies to you except for 23.89% of the New Testament.

That is wrongly splitting apart the truth.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Romans 11:13 KJV -

Here is the main message to the Gentiles in that passage:

Romans 11:19-21 19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in. 20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.​

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

I cannot in good conscience mix them together.

 

[heir]

The entire NT was written by Hebrews for Hebrews in the context of Hebrew culture and from a Hebrew perspective.

Romans 11:13 KJV, Ephesians 2:11-12 KJV

Those who try to understand the scriptures from any other perspective fail. Even Paul was a Hebrew of Hebrews.

That has nothing to do with who we are in the BoC 1 Corinthians 12:13 KJV, Galatians 3:28 KJV

...circumcised the eighth day of the stock of Israel of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of the Hebrews; concerning the law, a Pharisee... (Philippians 3:5 NKJV)​

Again, nothing to do with who he is in the BoC Philippians 3:8 KJV

Paul was a Hebrew rabbi but like the other apostles did not understand scripture until the Holy Spirit opened his mind to understand.

I doubt that Paul ever even imagined there would exist a book called the New Testament. Paul taught from the Hebrew scriptures from a Hebrew perspective even though he was a natural born Roman citizen.

Not everything Paul taught was from the OT. Get your facts straight Ephesians 3:1-9 KJV

Paul testified he never taught against Jewish law, never taught against God's Temple and never taught insurrection (Acts 25:8).

He taught the righteousness of God without it Acts 13:39 KJV, Romans 3:21-22 KJV

So who is a legitimate Hebrew?

Paul explained, "Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham." (Galatians 3:7)

This had to do with those to whom Paul was first sent (Acts 13:26 KJV) not you or me (Ephesians 2:11-12 KJV). And even still in the Body~ 2 Corinthians 5:14-17 KJV!

For those who claim they are not a Hebrew, I understand and I agree.

I'm not and you're not. So why did you bring it up?

 

[heir]

Here is the main message to the Gentiles in that passage:

Romans 11:19-21 19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in. 20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.​

The Romans had a standing in the olive tree by faith (faith in the gospel of God Romans 1:1-4 KJV). It was a faith praised by Paul (Romans 1:8 KJV) but it was not the mutual faith of them and Paul (Romans 1:12 KJV). These (at least one that Paul points out to use as an example) were resting in the law making their boast of God (Romans 2:17 KJV) and the tree was coming down (so to speak). Israel had fallen (Romans 11:11 KJV) and these Romans needed to continue in the goodness of God or they too would be cut off (Romans 11:22 KJV).

There was only one way to continue in the goodness of God and that was to be established into the Body of Christ by Paul's my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ according to the revelation of the mystery which was kept secret since the world began, but now (at that time) was made manifest (Romans 16:25-27 KJV). That's why Paul "longed to see" them (Romans 1:11 KJV). He was "ready to preach the gospel to you that are in Rome also" (Romans 1:15-17 KJV! And all through the Acts period, we see Paul gathering the remnant into the Body.

 

[heir]

I cannot in good conscience mix them together.

Neither can I as God is not the author of confusion. Mixing them would make Him so as they aren't saying the same thing to the same people. Those who deny things that differ either can't read sixth grade English and/or don't want to believe what the Bible says.

 

[musterion]

The main cause of division: failure to personally realize Ephesians 3:9-10. Right division, as we call it, is the only doctrinal antidote.

 

[heir]

I have actually done the opposite, and studied how the teachings of Jesus, Paul, Peter, James, and John all work together.

Matthew 12:31-32 vs. 1 Timothy 1:13-16 KJV

Acts 2:38 KJV vs. 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV, Ephesians 1:13-14 KJV, Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV

James 2:20 KJV vs. Titus 3:5 KJV

1 John 1:9 KJV vs. Colossians 2:13 KJV

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Made up. Standard fare....cliche.



What a mess.....It's time, to clear the fog, again, on this "You are dividing Christians!!!!!!" smoke screen, jazz.

Kiddies like GO, learn, through repetition. Thus, let's forget the "Patty Cake, Patty Cake" jazz, and "cut to the chase," so to speak, GO. We are all busy men, and women. It's time for my annual vent.....


The Holy Bible refers to "the church of the living God" as "the pillar and ground of the truth"(1 Timothy 3:15 KJV). "...thy word is truth."(John 17:17 KJV)

So, if anyone where to split, divide, a "church", just what would be the basis/justification of the split? One half(or whatever) sides with the truth, rightly divided(2 Timothy 2:15 KJV), the other half sides with error, not "sound doctrine", as preached by our apostle Paul(not Peter, not "the 12"), in this "dispensation of the grace of God"(yes, "dispensation" is a scriptural, biblical word, and a good one, at that(1 Cor. 9:17 KJV; Eph. 1:10 KJV, Eph.3:2 KJV; Col. 1:25 KJV). This, like arguing, is to be embraced-it is a good thing. This is one of the harshest "truths", realities, to accept for babes in Christ(1 Cor. 3 KJV), the sheep: the secrecy of so many Christians, when it comes to "whom are you following?"

I say, once again, shine some light in the dark "churches." Expose everybody to the light: Psalms 119:105 KJV(trans-dispensational biblical doctrine). Cockroaches scurry when the light is shone on them.

Split, split, split them up, I say. Split, split, and keep splitting. The Lord Jesus Christ came to split. He was, and is, the great divider: Genesis 1:4 KJV; Matthew 10:34 KJV, Mt.25:32 KJV; Luke 12:51 KJV; John 7:43 KJV, John 9:16 KJV, John 10:19 KJV; Acts 13:2 KJV; Romans 1:1 KJV; 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV. A sword divides/separates. The cross divides and separates men and women-it does not unify. Dump the refuse, the garbage in the dumpster. Release the secret agent "all of the Holy Bible is written for my obedience" back into the ecumenical movement, where they belong. Then, and only then, can we truly be said to be in "the body, the church"(Col. 1:18 KJV, Col. 1:24 KJV; Eph. 5:23 KJV), worshiping the LORD God of truth(John 4:24 KJV), and separating the wheat from the chaff(Mt. 3:12 KJV, Luke 3:17 KJV), from within the true church, in this dispensation, and ending "divisions"( Romans 16:17 KJV; 1 Cor. 1:10 KJV, 1 Cor 3:3 KJV, 1 Cor. 11:18 KJV). Let every "church" you join toss you out for being a "divisive, mean spirited, 'un-Christian', intolerant....." "MAD wacko", "modern" "dispie," as their doctrine is new, has never been taught by the "historic" "the church," and all that jazz......who needs to be drugged up, and properly schooled, albeit in a "sweet Christian manner", into obedience of the "church statement of faith." You wouldn't be splitting any churches, because they are not churches. They are "Rodney Kings", "Oprah Winfrey's"-"Can't we all get along's", as they nod their heads in agreement, as passive drones, who will be spoon fed by their 'church' leaders," mutual admiration clubs, religious drain clogs/toilets, flushing Christians' knowledge, and thus acceptance, of the "dispensation of the gospel", "the dispensation of the grace of God", "the dispensation of God", committed to the apostle Paul(1 Cor. 9:17KJV. Eph. 3:2 KJV, Col. 1:25 KJV),"the apostle of the Gentiles"(Romans 11:13 KJV), and thus, their apostle, down the proverbial toilet.

"Soap Box" time: When we have spoken up on these boards, re. the absolute necessity of rightly dividing this word of truth, "Christians" get angry at us. They, obviously being more "spiritual" than us, don't like us. We are "tied to satan...the occult," "gnosticism," they spam/cry. We are "mean spirited...judgmental..intolerant," they wine. I say, please like us(sarcasm is a biblical principle). I want people to like us(vs. Proverbs 29:25 KJV; Mt. 6:2 KJV, Mt. 6:5 KJV; John 5:44 KJV, John 12:43 KJV ; Acts 5:29 KJV; Galatians 1:10 KJV; Eph. 6:6 KJV; Colossians 3:22 KJV; 1 Thel. 2:4 KJV). We will be a good boys, this time, and not be "divisive." If "sound doctrine"(1 Timothy 1:10 KJV; 2 Timothy 4:2-3 KJV; Titus 1:9 KJV, Titus 2:10 KJV), is not important, we plead "guilty as charged."

"But thou hast fully known my doctrine(my note-Paul's doctrine for the body of Christ-Romans-Philemon), manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience..." 2 Tim. 3:10 KJV


Truth, by its nature, is divisive, and the word of truth, rightly divided, more so. Division is what the Lord Jesus Christ brought to the “ecumenical tupperware party.” And that is what we should bring. I love respective members of the boc, despite cries/wines/pines, to the contrary, and that is why I give them the truth, and the word of truth, rightly divided, and then encourage them to survey the Holy Bible, and figure it out for themselves-Acts 17:2 KJV, 11; 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV. However, if you love someone, you tell them the truth, sound doctrine, as scripture reveals it rightly divided, whether they want to hear it or not. Truth must not be sacrificed(compromised) at the altar of today's so-called enlightened, non-judgmental, "tolerant" culture. The apostle Paul perhaps best summed it up when he asked the poignant question:

"Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?" Galatians 4:16 KJV

The LORD God never sacrifices truth for peace, sound doctrine for compromise.

Spilt, split, split………..Keep on splitting, I say.....


"And to make ALL MEN SEE(emphasis mine) what is the fellowship of the mystery…" Eph. 3:9
_______
Vegas has it at 3/1 that I will be accused of "bible chopping/splitting...cherry picking..."

Side bar, LORD God...Take it away, Lord Jesus Christ...

Yeah, G.O. is extremely immature and one of the BIGGEST phonies.
I have the Knucklehead on ignore. He offends me with his phoney
arrogance.

 

[glorydaz]

You get to believe none of the Bible applies to you except for 23.89% of the New Testament.

That is wrongly splitting apart the truth.

I see it more as part applying to us as we were before we became members of the body of Christ, and part to us now (as members).

I can identify with the unbelievers and the religious (Jews)...all before faith came. So, when I read the OT, I understand what it was like for them...I can relate. It's why they say it's all written for us, but it's not all written TO us.

 

[heir]

It doesn't say what you think it says.

I've no trouble with sixth grade English. You?

You get to believe none of the Bible applies to you except for 23.89% of the New Testament.

That is wrongly splitting apart the truth.

You don't get to read someone else's mail and apply it TO yourself. Your neighbor may have gotten registered mail that his wealthy Father left him land. Your reading his mail would not make his inheritance yours, but this is exactly what you and the religious system you come from would have us to believe. They want the blessings of Israel time past and future so much that they have attempted to steal it ignoring to whom it is entitled and ignoring who we are in the Body and the wonderful blessings (Ephesians 1:3 KJV) and inheritance that we in the Body have in Christ (Ephesians 2:6 KJV, Philippians 3:20-21 KJV, Colossians 3:1-4 KJV). This is not to mention the doctrine that was never for our obedience that the religious system wants to chain around our ankles (Galatians 5:1 KJV).

I get to believe ALL (100%) of the Bible, while you and those like you must explain much of it away as not meaning what it says, as it says it and to whom it says it. You are stuck in the MUD and the only way out is salvation and 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV!

 

[Right Divider]

Yes there are and they are addressed in the parable of the ten virgins.

So you think that HALF of the BELIEVERS get locked OUT of the kingdom of heaven?

Try again.

 

[patrick jane]

I've no trouble with sixth grade English. You?


You don't get to read someone else's mail and apply it TO yourself. Your neighbor may have gotten registered mail that his wealthy Father left him land. Your reading his mail would not make his inheritance yours, but this is exactly what you and the religious system you come from would have us to believe. They want the blessings of Israel time past and future so much that they have attempted to steal it ignoring to whom it is entitled and ignoring who we are in the Body and the wonderful blessings (Ephesians 1:3 KJV) and inheritance that we in the Body have in Christ (Ephesians 2:6 KJV, Philippians 3:20-21 KJV, Colossians 3:1-4 KJV). This is not to mention the doctrine that was never for our obedience that the religious system wants to chain around our ankles (Galatians 5:1 KJV).

I get to believe ALL (100%) of the Bible, while you and those like you must explain much of it away as not meaning what it says, as it says it and to whom it says it. You are stuck in the MUD and the only ay out is salvation and 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV!

Excellent explanations - I hope the MAD haters read this.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Matthew 12:31-32 vs. 1 Timothy 1:13-16 KJV

Acts 2:38 KJV vs. 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV, Ephesians 1:13-14 KJV, Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV

James 2:20 KJV vs. Titus 3:5 KJV

1 John 1:9 KJV vs. Colossians 2:13 KJV

Are you claiming that you think the verses contradict each other?