ECT MAD is error perfected.

[csuguy]

Go ahead and pile on your ignorance.

Jesus also HAND PICKED Paul apart from the TWELVE. But you think that you should still follow the teaching of the TWELVE Israelites UNDER THE LAW.

Paul was specially picked in his own way as well - but not in opposition to the twelve whom Christ has previously picked and trained to carry on his ministry.

As for the law -

Matthew 5:17-19 “Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. 18 For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not [h]the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever [j]keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.


Romans 3:31 Do we then nullify [w]the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.​

Do you follow Matthew 23:1-3? I'll bet not.

With the establishment of the New Covenant, a new priesthood was established. As such, the Pharisees lack any authority - if indeed any pharisees even still exist today. Here he was advising them as Jews under the Old Covenant. Likewise, things like animal-sacrifices were put away with the New Covenant. This has nothing to do with Paul but everything to do with Christ establishing the New Covenant - which he did with his death, resurrection, and ascension well before Paul entered the scene.

Paul most certainly did claim just that. The old "Christ divided" taken complete out of context won't fool me.

Provide the scripture that demonstrates that Paul explicitly claimed to have received a new Gospel in opposition to that given to the disciples. The only difference between Paul and the 12 was their primary audience - but both recognized the need to reach jew and gentile.

Nobody but Paul declares the dispensation of the grace of God.

They all teach that salvation is made available through Christ's redeeming sacrifice. Or do you mean something else here?

Actually this illustration was NOT a personal attack but a clear demonstration that you have trouble accepting the TRUTH, even when it was CLEARLY and REPEATED shown to you. You're doing it again.

Actually it was - but whatever you gotta tell yourself to feel better. I have no shame in the discussion concerning that interesting problem - it is not a simple problem and has stumped many well educated men and women - including many mathematicians. It is highly un-intuitive. Furthermore - I demonstrated a tenacity to seek the truth regardless of what others say, demanding a proper reasoning for the matter. I also demonstrated humility by immediately acknowledging that I was wrong once a proper explanation was provided that satisfied me.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Paul was an example for new believers who like Paul had not walked with Christ as the 12 had.

It was important that men see that Christ can speak to them as He did to Paul.

Has Christ spoken to you?

for what happened to Paul must happen to you if you follow the example of Paul.

Do you live like Paul?

LA

Do you seek to make any sense?

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Do you seek to make any sense?

It would not make sense to a non-Christian.


LA

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

It would not make sense to a non-Christian.


LA

So, you're saying, you don't understand it?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Well I'm not a tent maker living in the Middle-east.

Christ spoke DIRECTLY to Paul. Paul could QUOTE the exact words that Christ SPOKE to him (word for word).

No, Christ does NOT speak to us that way.

But I do follow Paul as he follows Christ. I follow Christ THIS WAY. The way that is CURRENT. Not as a Jew under the Law as the TWELVE were.

AMEN Brother!

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

How do you know Jesus has not spoken to me like He spoke to Paul.

Not in the same words, but He has.

and He has spoken to many many others since Paul.

You assume that Paul learnt only through Jesus speaking to Him as He did at the first.

Paul spent much time in the word of God after he already knew a great deal of it, but it required revelation on the word, not necessitating a personal appearance of the Lord.

When Paul said he did not learn the gospel from men, he did learn much about the gospel through men from the Lord.

Paul was an example remember.

Act 13:1 Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.
Act 13:2 As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them.
Act 13:3 And when they had fasted and prayed, and laid their hands on them, they sent them away.
Act 13:4 So they, being sent forth by the Holy Ghost, departed unto Seleucia; and from thence they sailed to Cyprus.


LA

Did Christ speak to you "Audibly?" Yes or no? I say; NO.

 

[john w]

You do reject Christ and the disciples if you think that their teachings don't apply to you. It is utter foolishness to say that a new Gospel was ushered in with Paul out of nowhere in place of the ministry that Jesus entrusted to the 12 to carry out - the 12 whom he handpicked and trained, and who received the HS.

You mean that "Gospel" that Judas, one of the "handpicked and trained" 12, was told to preach?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

CSUGUY, dump the "goofy hat," it's distracting! Looks like
a "New-Age dunce cap!"

 

[csuguy]

You mean that "Gospel" that Judas, one of the "handpicked and trained" 12, was told to preach?

Judas had to fall away as a matter of prophecy; his fall says nothing of the ministry carried out by the others.

 

[musterion]

The hat is too small for your melon, truth be told. I own two fedoras and would never wear them that small, and if I'm mistaken that looks like it's more supposed to be a cowboy hat, which would make it waaaaay too small.

 

[csuguy]

The hat is too small for your melon, truth be told. I own two fedoras and would never wear them that small, and if I'm mistaken that looks like it's more supposed to be a cowboy hat, which would make it waaaaay too small.

Yes - its a cowboy hat from a bar I wore the one night Hats have never really suited me. I'll get around to switching out the image at some point - but honestly its not important to me.

 

[Doom]

csuguy is a man of many hats, none of which fit properly

 

[musterion]

That's good. A nice high-crown fedora would suit you much better, like an Akubra.

 

[heir]

The gentiles are saved, not by Israel's fall but by those 'restored survivors of Israel' who brought to us the Good News!
Peace on Earth! Goodwill to (all) men!


PJ

vs.

Romans 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

 

[heir]

MAD is silly, among other reasons, since it rejects the disciples - the one's Jesus handpicked to train during his ministry so that they could continue his ministry after he ascended.
MAD tosses them out because it is convenient for their theology to ignore what they said as if it is restricted to Israel -

Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:

Matthew 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

nevermind that the gentiles have been grafted onto Israel and thereby are partakers in the promises given to them.

not us

They are effectively tossing Jesus' entire ministry out the window as if it didn't apply to them.

Matthew 15:24 KJV, Romans 15:8 KJV

They cannot rightly be called Christians - aka followers of Christ.

1 Corinthians 4:15-16 KJV, 1 Corinthians 11:1 KJV

 

[heir]

Mid Acts is the wrong point in time.

The age of grace started on the day of Pentecost with the giving of the gift of the Holy spirit, Acts 2:1-4

1 Timothy 1:13-16 KJV

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Do you?

No.

Do you? You claimed to.

Be honest.

 

[john w]

Judas had to fall away as a matter of prophecy; his fall says nothing of the ministry carried out by the others.

I did not ask that. You "argued:"


"You do reject Christ and the disciples if you think that their teachings don't apply to you. It is utter foolishness to say that a new Gospel was ushered in with Paul out of nowhere in place of the ministry that Jesus entrusted to the 12 to carry out - the 12 whom he handpicked and trained, and who received the HS."-you


I asked:

You mean that "Gospel" that Judas, one of the "handpicked and trained" 12, was told to preach?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

You mean that "Gospel" that Judas, one of the "handpicked and trained" 12, was told to preach?

Where did you learn this utter foolishness? Dr. Breen?

 

[john w]

Where did you learn this utter foolishness? Dr. Breen?

From Hilda Mae, Rev. Hobart Tucker's "disciple-ette."