The Trinity

[Rosenritter]

1 Samuel: 12. 20. And Samuel said unto the people, Fear not: ye have done all this wickedness: yet turn not aside from following the LORD, but serve the LORD with all your heart; 21. And turn ye not aside: for then should ye go after vain things, which cannot profit nor deliver; for they are vain. 22. For the LORD will not forsake his people for his great name's sake: because it hath pleased the LORD to make you his people. 23. Moreover as for me, God forbid that I should sin against the LORD in ceasing to pray for you: but I will teach you the good and the right way: 24. Only fear the LORD, and serve him in truth with all your heart: for consider how great things he hath done for you. 25. But if ye shall still do wickedly, ye shall be consumed, both ye and your king.


Good works are a product of effectual faith for all, not just those vainly proclaiming their own salvation to be secure.

Ezekiel 33:13-16 KJV
(13) When I shall say to the righteous, that he shall surely live; if he trust to his own righteousness, and commit iniquity, all his righteousnesses shall not be remembered; but for his iniquity that he hath committed, he shall die for it.

(14) Again, when I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; if he turn from his sin, and do that which is lawful and right;
(15) If the wicked restore the pledge, give again that he had robbed, walk in the statutes of life, without committing iniquity; he shall surely live, he shall not die.
(16) None of his sins that he hath committed shall be mentioned unto him: he hath done that which is lawful and right; he shall surely live.

I understand the God speaking to be the same as Jesus Christ, so as he is the same yesterday, today, and forever, I would think that this should be applicable. Faith and belief requires action, and action is ineffectual without faith and belief.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Luke 3:7-9 KJV
(7) Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
(8) Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
(9) And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Maybe there's disagreement about this point because of a different misunderstanding. If one thinks of "belief" as a binary off-on switch it's going to affect your thinking one way, but perhaps it's more fuzzy than that. Like the "I believe, help mine unbelief" maybe fledgling faith and belief needs action for it to be able to blossom instead of wither. Seedling belief might perish if not exercised, like the miscast seed from the parable of the sower.

So if one can be "believing" and "unbelieving" at the same time (in degrees or aspects) it is our actions that we use to decide for us what we actually become. Thus they would be both intertwined, and if we attempt to separate them from each other we'll have inevitable objections because our model was flawed.

@popsthebuilder, @lifeisgood, neither of you are saying that true belief produces bad fruit, or that one can demand eternal life from God because of achievement, correct? There must be a synthesis here that we can agree upon.

I indeed agree with what you have stated.

Acquisition of reward nor negation of punishment are true motives, but of greed and fear respectively.

 

[Stevo1]

Those who helped lay the foundation, you are not one of them.

So you can't answer my questions either, well if you lived up to your name then you would be able to. Your foundation are built on murdering Jesus Christ does his life mean nothing to you. it meant a lot to the apostles and disciples as they lay there life down for him and the father to give life to others. Love your enemies Jesus said how many people in this world can do that how many people would be perscuted if they did. Jesus did it and because of this evil world was put on that cross and he knew he would because the devil has many twisted round his finger. I hope one day you will see it. God loves us all and would loves us all to turn to him, be like his son instead of killing him everyday of our lives saying he had to die. Jesus dying on a cross hasn't saved me but his life has given me hope that I will be if I do the will of God everyday and try to keep the temptations of this world away and live more for God.

 

[Stevo1]

Another rejecter of Jesus Christ and His finished/completed work on the Cross of Calvary.

Please read John 17, Jesus had finished his works then and explained what he had done for his father, what he was sent to do. He only went on the cross for our sakes to show us how evil people can be when they have the devil inside them how we can forget what good people can do for us and then betray them in a second. He suffered that for us as a example because we have to do the same but if God had intervened then he would have been said to have been favourable to his son and not us.God never left himself open to the devil but it was a cruel death one that would have hurt God to have seen it but he knew it already because he let it be known to the prophets before hand what they would do. So you may think the work on the cross was finished but that was not the works of God.

 

[glorydaz]

Please read John 17, Jesus had finished his works then and explained what he had done for his father, what he was sent to do. He only went on the cross for our sakes to show us how evil people can be when they have the devil inside them how we can forget what good people can do for us and then betray them in a second. He suffered that for us as a example because we have to do the same but if God had intervened then he would have been said to have been favourable to his son and not us.God never left himself open to the devil but it was a cruel death one that would have hurt God to have seen it but he knew it already because he let it be known to the prophets before hand what they would do. So you may think the work on the cross was finished but that was not the works of God.

:kookoo:

 

[God's Truth]

So you can't answer my questions either, well if you lived up to your name then you would be able to. Your foundation are built on murdering Jesus Christ does his life mean nothing to you. it meant a lot to the apostles and disciples as they lay there life down for him and the father to give life to others. Love your enemies Jesus said how many people in this world can do that how many people would be perscuted if they did. Jesus did it and because of this evil world was put on that cross and he knew he would because the devil has many twisted round his finger. I hope one day you will see it. God loves us all and would loves us all to turn to him, be like his son instead of killing him everyday of our lives saying he had to die. Jesus dying on a cross hasn't saved me but his life has given me hope that I will be if I do the will of God everyday and try to keep the temptations of this world away and live more for God.

I said you did not help lay the foundation.

 

[Stevo1]

I said you did not help lay the foundation.

All Gods true people lay the foundation when they speak the word of God in truth, and speak about Christ, as he is the rock, the cornerstone, and we have the foundation of the prophets, and we share the seed with others when we share the gospel and speak the word of God.

 

[marhig]

Jesus wasn't dead before he died.

Jesus was alive and is still alive, no matter what your stubbornness says.

Ah well, I've explained what I mean, and you don't seem to understand me, so I'll leave it there.

 

[God's Truth]

Ah well, I've explained what I mean, and you don't seem to understand me, so I'll leave it there.

I understand you and you are still wrong.

 

[God's Truth]

All Gods true people lay the foundation when they speak the word of God in truth, and speak about Christ, as he is the rock, the cornerstone, and we have the foundation of the prophets, and we share the seed with others when we share the gospel and speak the word of God.

The foundation was laid by the prophets and apostles and Jesus Christ himself as Chief Cornerstone.

The foundation has been laid.

You are NOT laying the foundation, the foundation that has been laid a long time ago.

Ephesians 2:20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

1 Corinthians 3:11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ.

 

[Stevo1]

The foundation was laid by the prophets and apostles and Jesus Christ himself as Chief Cornerstone.

The foundation has been laid.

You are NOT laying the foundation, the foundation that has been laid a long time ago.

Ephesians 2:20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

1 Corinthians 3:11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ.

So you believe the prophets are dead then and cannot come back in you and me?
We are only a vessel in wish God chooses to use and the spirits will visit. Why do we pray who helps us when we ask for help who does God send so that the foundation that the prophets laid down can be laid down in us. How can Jesus help us if the foundation are not laid down in us

 

[popsthebuilder]

So you believe the prophets are dead then and cannot come back in you and me?
We are only a vessel in wish God chooses to use and the spirits will visit. Why do we pray who helps us when we ask for help who does God send so that the foundation that the prophets laid down can be laid down in us. How can Jesus help us if the foundation are not laid down in us

What is in the believer is built on the foundation already laid by GOD through Christ and the Holy Spirit. The believer is built up plumb and straight due to the perfect foundation it rests on, not in itself which is proven unstable on any other foundation.

It is minor word differences that are causing confusion.

peace

 

[Stevo1]

What is in the believer is built on the foundation already laid by GOD through Christ and the Holy Spirit. The believer is built up plumb and straight due to the perfect foundation it rests on, not in itself which is proven unstable on any other foundation.

It is minor word differences that are causing confusion.

peace

Yes that is right, as long as that foundation is true. There are many false foundations, one's that the ground has not been dug deep enough and foundations that have been right, but then built on with the wrong teacher.
When I said about the foundation built in us, i mean that we have to have faith and believe, and once we have that, then Christ can build.

But what about the people who do not believe and have not that faith yet but want to know? Does that mean they are lost? Well they are for now but who will guide them to the truth. God will, and he will use you, me, and all those who he can trust to do the job well, as long as that person is willing to pay the price and do his will. But first he must survey, see what that ground needs, in most cases the rubbish has to go and that means digging deep right down until those foundation can go in, and that is a very hard thing to do. But with the right tool and time it can be done. And that right tool is the Holy Spirit.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Yes that is right, as long as that foundation is true. There are many false foundations, one's that the ground has not been dug deep enough and foundations that have been right, but then built on with the wrong teacher.
When I said about the foundation built in us, i mean that we have to have faith and believe, and once we have that, then Christ can build.

But what about the people who do not believe and have not that faith yet but want to know? Does that mean they are lost? Well they are for now but who will guide them to the truth. God will, and he will use you, me, and all those who he can trust to do the job well, as long as that person is willing to pay the price and do his will. But first he must survey, see what that ground needs, in most cases the rubbish has to go and that means digging deep right down until those foundation can go in, and that is a very hard thing to do. But with the right tool and time it can be done. And that right tool is the Holy Spirit.

The price had been paid friend.

There is no payment to be made or that can be made on our part upon knowing about GOD and the free gift of salvation. We are to give ourselves freely and happily to the will and cause of GOD. That just isn't synonymous with paying a price to me. Perhaps you could clarify more.

Christ/the Holy Spirit is sustinantce and life; knowing such should bring at very least, the desire to turn away from those earthly things one deems needed for sustenance according to the carnal mind.

Further;

You go back to the topic of the very ground; no doubt referring to self, but self isn't even part of the equation or foundation and surely shouldn't be equated to the dirt which the very foundation rests upon or is set in. Though Jesus did die physically, the Christ, nor the Holy Spirit, nor GOD almighty, has ever died, nor ever will.

Still only minor confusion, yet still; the things of GOD are not contrary to one another, but are the same, and truth is in no way synonymous with confusion or the promotion there of.



peace

 

[Stevo1]

The price had been paid friend.

There is no payment to be made or that can be made on our part upon knowing about GOD and the free gift of salvation. We are to give ourselves freely and happily to the will and cause of GOD. That just isn't synonymous with paying a price to me. Perhaps you could clarify more.

Christ/the Holy Spirit is sustinantce and life; knowing such should bring at very least, the desire to turn away from those earthly things one deems needed for sustenance according to the carnal mind.

Further;

You go back to the topic of the very ground; no doubt referring to self, but self isn't even part of the equation or foundation and surely shouldn't be equated to the dirt which the very foundation rests upon or is set in. Though Jesus did die physically, the Christ, nor the Holy Spirit, nor GOD almighty, has ever died, nor ever will.

Still only minor confusion, yet still; the things of GOD are not contrary to one another, but are the same, and truth is in no way synonymous with confusion or the promotion there of.



peace

We have to pay a big price and be willing to lay down our lives for others and become a living sacrifice for God to do his works through.

What is Paul saying about laying the foundation in Corinthians


1 Corinthians 3

3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

And the way the foundation is laid by us speaking the word of God, and planting that seed which is Christ, and then in the right ground, it is able to bury and will grow strong at the hand of God

Paul when he was Saul thought he was doing the work of God, he did have the right foundation but it was built upon by the false church, those how denied Jesus but he really searched deep inside of himself when he met Jesus and he realised the truth.

So when he was speaking to the Corinthians he had to follow what he had been taught and lived it out by the grace of God according to Christ teachings.

 

[popsthebuilder]

We have to pay a big price and be willing to lay down our lives for others and become a living sacrifice for God to do his works through.

What is Paul saying about laying the foundation in Corinthians


1 Corinthians 3

3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

And the way the foundation is laid by us speaking the word of God, and planting that seed which is Christ, and then in the right ground, it is able to bury and will grow strong at the hand of God

Paul when he was Saul thought he was doing the work of God, he did have the right foundation but it was built upon by the false church, those how denied Jesus but he really searched deep inside of himself when he met Jesus and he realised the truth.

So when he was speaking to the Corinthians he had to follow what he had been taught and lived it out by the grace of God according to Christ teachings.

I do not mean that we ate to do nothing in reaction to faith. I mean that the things of the Spirit are sustenance and having them is a blessing and not a curse. It is as if you mean that the law of the Spirit is a burden when you say it costs you something. The gift of faith and salvation is free friend.

That is the gist of what I meant.

 

[Stevo1]

I do not mean that we ate to do nothing in reaction to faith. I mean that the things of the Spirit are sustenance and having them is a blessing and not a curse. It is as if you mean that the law of the Spirit is a burden when you say it costs you something. The gift of faith and salvation is free friend.

That is the gist of what I meant.

It is a burden but the burden is light and is a wonderful thing to do the will of God, he has taken away a much heavier burden that I was living before I met God.

 

[God's Truth]

So you believe the prophets are dead then and cannot come back in you and me?
We are only a vessel in wish God chooses to use and the spirits will visit. Why do we pray who helps us when we ask for help who does God send so that the foundation that the prophets laid down can be laid down in us. How can Jesus help us if the foundation are not laid down in us

This is a strange belief that you you are saying. I don't believe the prophets are dead, but how do you get they come back 'in' us? What spirits visit? We receive the One and only Spirit of God to live in us and help us.

 

[God's Truth]

Yes that is right, as long as that foundation is true. There are many false foundations, one's that the ground has not been dug deep enough and foundations that have been right, but then built on with the wrong teacher.
When I said about the foundation built in us, i mean that we have to have faith and believe, and once we have that, then Christ can build.

But what about the people who do not believe and have not that faith yet but want to know? Does that mean they are lost? Well they are for now but who will guide them to the truth. God will, and he will use you, me, and all those who he can trust to do the job well, as long as that person is willing to pay the price and do his will. But first he must survey, see what that ground needs, in most cases the rubbish has to go and that means digging deep right down until those foundation can go in, and that is a very hard thing to do. But with the right tool and time it can be done. And that right tool is the Holy Spirit.

That is an excellent question that you ask. You say how do we know God's Truth.

I love that question. I will tell you the way to know. Jesus tells us how you can know.

He tells you to search for his teachings and obey them, then he will reveal the truth to you.

 

[God's Truth]

We have to pay a big price and be willing to lay down our lives for others and become a living sacrifice for God to do his works through.

What is Paul saying about laying the foundation in Corinthians


1 Corinthians 3

3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

And the way the foundation is laid by us speaking the word of God, and planting that seed which is Christ, and then in the right ground, it is able to bury and will grow strong at the hand of God

Paul when he was Saul thought he was doing the work of God, he did have the right foundation but it was built upon by the false church, those how denied Jesus but he really searched deep inside of himself when he met Jesus and he realised the truth.

So when he was speaking to the Corinthians he had to follow what he had been taught and lived it out by the grace of God according to Christ teachings.

Paul was an apostle. Don't confuse yourself with being an apostle. There are no more apostles, and they laid the foundation already, with the prophets and Jesus Christ himself.