Creation vs. Evolution

[DavisBJ]

When I think of science I think of things that can be tested. I have no idea how someone would think to test macro evolution.

Sounds like something you should spend some time educating yourself on then, before you make more comments on it without understanding whereof you speak.

To conclude macro evolution occurs because micro evolution does would be faulty as well.

I can obviously walk to my neighbor’s house, and then from his house to the next, and so on. Maybe a lot of houses, but I can get from Los Angeles to New York City by walking from house to house. Lots of micro walks gets to the same place as a macro walk.

As for additions and mindless thinking scientific knowledge is not supposed to be such.

I agree, and if you look, I was speaking of reading that nomadic creation account as an accurate literal description. I was not speaking of science.

At what point do you feel I denigrated evolution? I've looked back through this post and near the end I am not doing so and I didn't think I was early on either.

You said:

… But evolution is another falsehood …

Sure nuff sounds like you were once again spouting off about something that you have already admitted you know little about.

I simply point out that there is one God, the God of truth, and that this God is also the God of creation.

You may simply point that out, but that is not the totality of what your post had in it. See my response just above about maligning evolution.

You believe a person can be a Christian and believe in evolution.

I don't "believe" this, I "know" a whole gaggle of them. You could be one too, and keep your belief in the Bible, and your belief in God as well. Your choice.

If you believe in evolution and are a Christian or don't know what Christianity is even, either way, I hope you come to the knowledge of the Savior Jesus Christ and what He as done for you. Knowing this is much better than any science study you could do, evolution or not.

Your final 3 words – “evolution or not” in what you just said really hurts your cause. To me, that says “just buy into the literal Bible story, even if you know some of it is bunk.” I have texts on mathematics, physics, chemistry that I can investigate and confirm every point they claim. But you want me to fully accept what you call the “Word of God” even if it can’t meet the level of correctness of a college textbook?

 

[DavisBJ]

Differential equations.

Probably PDEs.

 

[Jacob]

Sounds like something you should spend some time educating yourself on then, before you make more comments on it without understanding whereof you speak.

I can obviously walk to my neighbor’s house, and then from his house to the next, and so on. Maybe a lot of houses, but I can get from Los Angeles to New York City by walking from house to house. Lots of micro walks gets to the same place as a macro walk.

I agree, and if you look, I was speaking of reading that nomadic creation account as an accurate literal description. I was not speaking of science.

You said:

Sure nuff sounds like you were once again spouting off about something that you have already admitted you know little about.

Do you remember the idea about how studying really money helps you discover that which is counterfeit? A person would not need to study the counterfeit if they know what real money is.

You may simply point that out, but that is not the totality of what your post had in it. See my response just above about maligning evolution.

I don't "believe" this, I "know" a whole gaggle of them. You could be one too, and keep your belief in the Bible, and your belief in God as well. Your choice.

Your final 3 words – “evolution or not” in what you just said really hurts your cause. To me, that says “just buy into the literal Bible story, even if you know some of it is bunk.” I have texts on mathematics, physics, chemistry that I can investigate and confirm every point they claim. But you want me to fully accept what you call the “Word of God” even if it can’t meet the level of correctness of a college textbook?

No. What I mean is that belief in God and Jesus Christ pertains to salvation while belief in evolution or not may not. Accepting evolution may produce a barrier to belief in Christ. But I would rather talk with you about salvation since that is a greater need of yours than whether or not evolution is true.

 

[alwight]

When I think of science I think of things that can be tested. I have no idea how someone would think to test macro evolution. To conclude macro evolution occurs because micro evolution does would be faulty as well.

All I ever used to understand was that there was a process called "evolution", there was no need for "macro" or "micro" just evolution.
These are terms introduced by YE creationists because on the one hand they needed there to be an incredibly rapid period of evolution which didn't involve "kinds" coming or going (a "micro" version). But on the other hand acceptance of a "macro" version is completely incompatible with their doctrinal beliefs, but it has little or no meaning in Darwinian evolution.

It's YECs who make the distinction for doctrinal reasons, not because there is any reason that small steps can't actually lead eventually to very large changes over time, but because for them the distinction simply has to exist, even if there is no obvious reason for any such restriction.
All that really needs to be concluded is that evolution happens, look after the pennies and the pounds (or dollars) will look after themselves. lain:

 

[DavisBJ]

Probably PDEs.

In response to an off-line inquiry by Untellectual:

From wiki:
In mathematics, a partial differential equation (PDE) is a differential equation that contains unknown multivariable functions and their partial derivatives. (This is in contrast to ordinary differential equations, which deal with functions of a single variable and their derivatives.) PDEs are used to formulate problems involving functions of several variables...

 

[Mark SeaSigh]

BJDavis,

I don't want to play the game anymore, man. I think, once Jesus actually Returns for us, you will then get enough proof!!!

Michael

Yes, and When they See Him, all the Atheists Will Fear.

They will finally Understand, "The Fear of God".

=M=

You can't fear Things you don't believe in. However, when you finally do see things Others tell you do exist, and you don't believe, when you Do See, You Will Fear Even More.

 

[alwight]

Yes, and When they See Him, all the Atheists Will Fear.

They will finally Understand, "The Fear of God".

=M=

You can't fear Things you don't believe in. However, when you finally do see things Others tell you do exist, and you don't believe, when you Do See, You Will Fear Even More.

Currently I'm more fearful of Zeus, I might choose Odin tomorrow, but Saturday is a zero god day for me.

 

[6days]

But you want me to fully accept what you call the “Word of God” even if it can’t meet the level of correctness of a college textbook?

It isnt a matter of 'correctness'.... its a heart matter.*

There are brilliant people, like yourself, who call Gods Word "bunk". But there are also brilliant people that claim the Bible is inerrant...that it is inerrant and historically accurate, that it is the greatest literature ever, etc.*


It might be interesting fun if you want to start a new thread discussing Bible inerrancy.

 

[DavisBJ]

Do you remember the idea about how studying really money helps you discover that which is counterfeit? A person would not need to study the counterfeit if they know what real money is.

Yup, a test for the real “money” is the fossil record, untainted by the corruption of man. Then we compare that to the claims made in a religious creation account passed down millennia ago from a scientifically illiterate nomadic society. That account was as good as the contemporary creation myths, but as Paul says in the New Testament, it is now time to put away childish things. I side with evidence that is agreed on by scientists (many Christian) from all over the word, but you prefer a literalist reading of an ancient myth of uncertain origin that only your own narrow clan of fundamentalists think is absolute truth.

No. What I mean is that belief in God and Jesus Christ pertains to salvation while belief in evolution or not may not. Accepting evolution may produce a barrier to belief in Christ.

Why on earth is accepting the record we see in the rocks a bad thing? It just means you might have to admit that the creation account in Genesis is not a literal history.

But I would rather talk with you about salvation since that is a greater need of yours than whether or not evolution is true.

I have already made it clear, I am not a fan of used-car salesman type tactics. If you want me to ignore the very first pages of “God’s Word” and jump to the end, then let’s quit the pretense and rip Genesis out of the Bible. You OK with that?

 

[Mark SeaSigh]

Right, but if you see Zeus coming Down from Mount Olympus on a Cloud out of the Sky, I bet that Would Scare you Pretty Good.

=M=

Which is my Main Point in what I Said, "The Unknown has more of an Ability to Strike Fear in the Heart of Man, than the Known".

Of course, if God Does come back, I'm sure I'll be running around in Circles too, just Given the Power and Might that He Will Probably Descend in.

 

[Hedshaker]

Yes, and When they See Him, all the Atheists Will Fear.

They will finally Understand, "The Fear of God".

=M=

You can't fear Things you don't believe in. However, when you finally do see things Others tell you do exist, and you don't believe, when you Do See, You Will Fear Even More.

Do you see the point of Alwights post? All these threats are something to be expected. We are going to be so sorry when the second coming eventually arrives. Man are we going to suffer for our disbelief after we're dead.

Yet there's no recompense for you if it turns out you've been believing in the wrong God, even though the dilemma is exactly the same.

 

[alwight]

It isnt a matter of 'correctness'.... its a heart matter.*

There are brilliant people, like yourself, who call Gods Word "bunk". But there are also brilliant people that claim the Bible is inerrant...that it is inerrant and historically accurate, that it is the greatest literature ever, etc.*


It might be interesting fun if you want to start a new thread discussing Bible inerrancy.

The words you call "God's Word" are your conclusion and belief perhaps but other people who don't agree are not somehow bound by your faith in them.

 

[Mark SeaSigh]

Do you see the point of Alwights post? All these threats are something to be expected. We are going to be so sorry when when the second coming eventually arrives. Man are we going to suffer for our disbelief after we're dead.

Yet there's no recompense for you if it turns out you've been believing in the wrong God, even though the dilemma is exactly the same.

How is saying that People will obviously Fear God's Arrival, A Threat to Atheists?

Do you feel threatened Hedshaker?

I mean, it's not like I'm Asking you to Give Me a PERSONAL DEFINITION OF THE WORD, "NATURE", as you used it in this Sentence, "Nature is all Around Us", or "Nature is What Creates Life from Inorganic Materials".

Or, am I?

=M=

Barbie!!!

Where are you Girl?

I know You are Here Somewhere, in Wait, Just Waiting for me to Post Something about you, Like, "Barbie, does the Cha Cha, while Eating Creationist Cookies".

 

[alwight]

Do you see the point of Alwights post? All these threats are something to be expected. We are going to be so sorry when when the second coming eventually arrives. Man are we going to suffer for our disbelief after we're dead.

Yet there's no recompense for you if it turns out you've been believing in the wrong God, even though the dilemma is exactly the same.

Covering all the godly bases is hard work. :sheep:

 

[DavisBJ]

It isn’t a matter of 'correctness'.... it’s a heart matter.

You actually have a good point. All the time I was an active Christian my belief was supported because of the way it made me feel – as you say, a “heart matter”. But one day I had the realization forced on me that exactly the same things convinces devoted Catholics that Catholicism is the correct way, and Buddhists are similarly convinced of their walk the same way, etc.

Something wrong here, big time. A philosophical approach that proves whatever religion you choose to adopt to be the right one is actually just a placebo. I realized that there is an arbitrator that is not very amenable to molding itself to the whims of one’s desires. It is the real world itself, best understood by science. When I looked there, I found a huge diversity of people that had been a lot faster than I had been at subjecting their beliefs to an impartial outside arbitrator. I love working with so many people who bring such a variety of approaches with them, yet we are in lock-step when we examine how the world really is.

 

[DavisBJ]

Right, but if you see Zeus coming Down from Mount Olympus on a Cloud out of the Sky, I bet that Would Scare you Pretty Good.

=M=

Which is my Main Point in what I Said, "The Unknown has more of an Ability to Strike Fear in the Heart of Man, than the Known".

Of course, if God Does come back, I'm sure I'll be running around in Circles too, just Given the Power and Might that He Will Probably Descend in.

Your caps key has a strange malady of turning on for just the first letter of lots of the ordinary words in your sentences.

 

[Hedshaker]

How is saying that People will obviously Fear God's Arrival, A Threat to Atheists?

Do you feel threatened Hedshaker?

I mean, it's not like I'm Asking you to Give Me a PERSON DEFINITION OF THE WORD, "NATURE", as you used it in this Sentence, "Nature is all Around Us", or "Nature is What Creates Life from Inorganic Materials".

=M=

No fear at all. I'm confident that death means the same whether you're a human being or a blade of grass. Death is as much a part of life on earth as is birth and ageing. The difference is, I accept that reality as it is, warts an all.

 

[Mark SeaSigh]

Covering all the godly bases is hard work. :sheep:

Right, but you can Also see my Point, of How, "If Zeus did Return From Mount Olympus, You would Freak out Seeing Him Arrive".
You will also Fear God, in a Like Way when He Returns. It's not a Threat, like the Evols from my Editions of, "Those Funny things you Atheists Say", If you feel threatened by something, you have to believe in it, My Point is, when you finally do see, and Believe, You will Be Full Of Fear.

Fear Will Abound, Even the Rocks will Scream Out. LOL!!!!

=M=

 

[Mark SeaSigh]

No fear at all. I'm confident that death means the same whether you're a human being or a blade of grass. Death is as much a part of life on earth as is birth and ageing. The difference is, I accept that reality as it is, warts an all.

Would you go as Far As to say that, "It's Part of Nature"?

LOL@U

=M=

 

[The Barbarian]

Your caps key has a strange malady of turning on for just the first letter of lots of the ordinary words in your sentences.

Die honyock besteht auf Großschreibung. Vielleicht ist er zu kanalisieren Horst Wessel.