The Late Great Urantia Revelation

[Lon]

I ask myself the same question and the truth is that had I been a thoroughly indoctrinated Jew, maybe a Pharisee or member of the Sanhedrin, prior to the spirt birth I may well have hated Jesus myself. I was always annoyed and uncomfortable with the term "born again"... until I was born again.


I'm somewhat sympathetic with the Jewish people. They had been faithfully taught that keeping Gods statutes which are found in their scriptures is the way of salvation. Nowhere in all of the history of the Israelites were they interpreting God having a Son in heaven who was coming down to be a voluntary sacrifice to pay a sin debt! That's been forced into their scriptures by atonement theorists.

I'm not Jewish. I simply knew and know that the God of Israel is the only God. So does the Urantia, btw, they didn't start a new rendition of God, they just reinvented, literally, the parts they didn't like or thought were inappropriate. I did the opposite: I wrested with God, like Jacob, I didn't rewrite and edit Him. That would be a god in MY image. This is the difference. Like I said, I know you'll not listen, but I'll say again: The Urantia asks nothing of me. It is a book of philosophizing.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Still waiting for you to explain this?

"This completely ignores everything the Bible says regarding the Jews alive during Jesus' earthly ministry..."

Why should I? I don't cast pearls before swine, nor give what is holy to the dogs.

 

[Caino]

Why should I? I don't cast pearls before swine, nor give what is holy to the dogs.

You made a claim which you cant defend. Now you are backed into a corner. I'm not your enemy, your pride is your enemy.

 

[Caino]

I'm not Jewish. I simply knew and know that the God of Israel is the only God. So does the Urantia, btw, they didn't start a new rendition of God, they just reinvented, literally, the parts they didn't like or thought were inappropriate. I did the opposite: I wrested with God, like Jacob, I didn't rewrite and edit Him. That would be a god in MY image. This is the difference. Like I said, I know you'll not listen, but I'll say again: The Urantia asks nothing of me. It is a book of philosophizing.

But the concept of God does grow throughout the scriptures. Jesus was the greatest revelation of the Lord God of Israel. In the actual records of the Son of God on earth he recounted this for the apostles. While you may not believe he said this and claim Sadler invented it, is the point being made true?


142:3.9 Never before had the apostles been so shocked as they were upon hearing this recounting of the growth of the concept of God in the Jewish minds of previous generations; they were too bewildered to ask questions. As they sat before Jesus in silence, the Master continued: “And you would have known these truths had you read the Scriptures. Have you not read in Samuel where it says: `And the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel, so much so that he moved David against them, saying, go number Israel and Judah'? And this was not strange because in the days of Samuel the children of Abraham really believed that Yahweh created both good and evil. But when a later writer narrated these events, subsequent to the enlargement of the Jewish concept of the nature of God, he did not dare attribute evil to Yahweh; therefore he said: `And Satan stood up against Israel and provoked David to number Israel.' Cannot you discern that such records in the Scriptures clearly show how the concept of the nature of God continued to grow from one generation to another?

142:3.10 “Again should you have discerned the growth of the understanding of divine law in perfect keeping with these enlarging concepts of divinity. When the children of Israel came out of Egypt in the days before the enlarged revelation of Yahweh, they had ten commandments which served as their law right up to the times when they were encamped before Sinai. And these ten commandments were:

“1. You shall worship no other god, for the Lord is a jealous God.
“2. You shall not make molten gods.
“3. You shall not neglect to keep the feast of unleavened bread.
“4. Of all the males of men or cattle, the first-born are mine, says the Lord.
“5. Six days you may work, but on the seventh day you shall rest.
“6. You shall not fail to observe the feast of the first fruits and the feast of the ingathering at the end of the year.
“7. You shall not offer the blood of any sacrifice with leavened bread.
“8. The sacrifice of the feast of the Passover shall not be left until morning.
“9. The first of the first fruits of the ground you shall bring to the house of the Lord your God.
“10. You shall not seethe a kid in its mother's milk.

142:3.21 “And then, amidst the thunders and lightnings of Sinai, Moses gave them the new ten commandments, which you will all allow are more worthy utterances to accompany the enlarging Yahweh concepts of Deity. And did you never take notice of these commandments as twice recorded in the Scriptures, that in the first case deliverance from Egypt is assigned as the reason for Sabbath keeping, while in a later record the advancing religious beliefs of our forefathers demanded that this be changed to the recognition of the fact of creation as the reason for Sabbath observance? *

142:3.22 “And then will you remember that once again—in the greater spiritual enlightenment of Isaiah's day—these ten negative commandments were changed into the great and positive law of love, the injunction to love God supremely and your neighbor as yourself. And it is this supreme law of love for God and for man that I also declare to you as constituting the whole duty of man.” UB 1955

 

[JudgeRightly]

You made a claim which you cant defend. Now you are backed into a corner. I'm not your enemy, your pride is your enemy.

I made a claim that I could defend, but choose not to, because it would be a waste of my time and yours. Big difference. I stand by what I said, that the argument you made completely ignores what the Bible says.

Don't forget, you're the one who rejects scripture, not me. My argument comes from scripture that you reject. Thus, it would be pointless for me to make the argument, because you reject the scripture it's based on anyways.

 

[Lon]

But the concept of God does grow throughout the scriptures. Jesus was the greatest revelation of the Lord God of Israel. In the actual records of the Son of God on earth he recounted this for the apostles. While you may not believe he said this and claim Sadler invented it, is the point being made true?


142:3.9 Never before had the apostles been so shocked as they were upon hearing this recounting of the growth of the concept of God in the Jewish minds of previous generations; they were too bewildered to ask questions. As they sat before Jesus in silence, the Master continued: “And you would have known these truths had you read the Scriptures. Have you not read in Samuel where it says: `And the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel, so much so that he moved David against them, saying, go number Israel and Judah'? And this was not strange because in the days of Samuel the children of Abraham really believed that Yahweh created both good and evil. But when a later writer narrated these events, subsequent to the enlargement of the Jewish concept of the nature of God, he did not dare attribute evil to Yahweh; therefore he said: `And Satan stood up against Israel and provoked David to number Israel.' Cannot you discern that such records in the Scriptures clearly show how the concept of the nature of God continued to grow from one generation to another?

142:3.10 “Again should you have discerned the growth of the understanding of divine law in perfect keeping with these enlarging concepts of divinity. When the children of Israel came out of Egypt in the days before the enlarged revelation of Yahweh, they had ten commandments which served as their law right up to the times when they were encamped before Sinai. And these ten commandments were:


142:3.21 “And then, amidst the thunders and lightnings of Sinai, Moses gave them the new ten commandments, which you will all allow are more worthy utterances to accompany the enlarging Yahweh concepts of Deity. And did you never take notice of these commandments as twice recorded in the Scriptures, that in the first case deliverance from Egypt is assigned as the reason for Sabbath keeping, while in a later record the advancing religious beliefs of our forefathers demanded that this be changed to the recognition of the fact of creation as the reason for Sabbath observance? *

142:3.22 “And then will you remember that once again—in the greater spiritual enlightenment of Isaiah's day—these ten negative commandments were changed into the great and positive law of love, the injunction to love God supremely and your neighbor as yourself. And it is this supreme law of love for God and for man that I also declare to you as constituting the whole duty of man.” UB 1955

See? It literally tries to 'teach' me something (wrongly and ineptly) but asks nothing of me at all. Worse? It treats the blood of Jesus and the problem of sin with complete contempt AND embrace of those sins. The UB is demonic, satanic. The Son wrestled in the Garden until great drops of blood fell. The Father's will was that sin would be removed from man and it was incredibly costly and precious. The UB (and you, and FreeL) treat Him with contempt. It is demonic and sinful and embracingly sinful. It is a wickedness.

Hebrews 10:29, Caino. You are under His wrath for this:

Hebrews 10:29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?

Matthew 7:23 "Depart from Me, I NEVER knew you...workers of sin....Evil doers and sayers..." The UB is evil. Pure evil for trampling His blood.

 

[Lon]

You made a claim which you cant defend. Now you are backed into a corner. I'm not your enemy, your pride is your enemy.

So instead of grasping his point, you treat the subject and him with childish reverse psychology. If you are this inept? Forgiven. If you really understood his 'casting pearls' statement, it was to not throw something at another's feet (like the PRECIOUS blood of Jesus), for it to be trampled. Things that are sacred are TOO sacred to lay to such contempt. "If" you didn't get it before, you should now.

 

[Caino]

See? It literally tries to 'teach' me something (wrongly and ineptly) but asks nothing of me at all. Worse? It treats the blood of Jesus and the problem of sin with complete contempt AND embrace of those sins. The UB is demonic, satanic. The Son wrestled in the Garden until great drops of blood fell. The Father's will was that sin would be removed from man and it was incredibly costly and precious. The UB (and you, and FreeL) treat Him with contempt. It is demonic and sinful and embracingly sinful. It is a wickedness.

Hebrews 10:29, Caino. You are under His wrath for this:

Hebrews 10:29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace?

Matthew 7:23 "Depart from Me, I NEVER knew you...workers of sin....Evil doers and sayers..." The UB is evil. Pure evil for trampling His blood.

Bizarre! Its almost like you had a response to a different topic and never read my post which had nothing to do with sacrifices and sin!?

 

[Caino]

So instead of grasping his point, you treat the subject and him with childish reverse psychology. If you are this inept? Forgiven. If you really understood his 'casting pearls' statement, it was to not throw something at another's feet (like the PRECIOUS blood of Jesus), for it to be trampled. Things that are sacred are TOO sacred to lay to such contempt. "If" you didn't get it before, you should now.

At least I'm defending my faith with quotes and willing to take the constant abuse on TOL and for years. I could ask why I cast my pearls before hateful Christians??? One thread, one member among thousands?

 

[Caino]

THE POSITIVE NATURE OF JESUS' RELIGION​

159:5.1 At Philadelphia, where James was working, Jesus taught the disciples about the positive nature of the gospel of the kingdom. When, in the course of his remarks, he intimated that some parts of the Scripture were more truth-containing than others and admonished his hearers to feed their souls upon the best of the spiritual food, James interrupted the Master, asking: “Would you be good enough, Master, to suggest to us how we may choose the better passages from the Scriptures for our personal edification?” And Jesus replied: “Yes, James, when you read the Scriptures look for those eternally true and divinely beautiful teachings, such as:

“Create in me a clean heart, O Lord.
“The Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want.
“You should love your neighbor as yourself.
“For I, the Lord your God, will hold your right hand, saying, fear not; I will help you.
“Neither shall the nations learn war any more.”

159:5.7 And this is illustrative of the way Jesus, day by day, appropriated the cream of the Hebrew scriptures for the instruction of his followers and for inclusion in the teachings of the new gospel of the kingdom. Other religions had suggested the thought of the nearness of God to man, but Jesus made the care of God for man like the solicitude of a loving father for the welfare of his dependent children and then made this teaching the cornerstone of his religion. And thus did the doctrine of the fatherhood of God make imperative the practice of the brotherhood of man. The worship of God and the service of man became the sum and substance of his religion. Jesus took the best of the Jewish religion and translated it to a worthy setting in the new teachings of the gospel of the kingdom." UB 1955

 

[Lon]

At least I'm defending my faith with quotes and willing to take the constant abuse on TOL and for years. I could ask why I cast my pearls before hateful Christians??? One thread, one member among thousands?

YOU know your book tramples the Bible. I believe you knew it before you ever started this thread. This isn't a Urantia website. I'm still perplexed Knight ever said 'yes' to this thread. It tramples Christianity all day and night in the most abusive and hateful ways. It is beyond me that he allowed it, but it reminds me of Joshua 9 where Gibeon tricked Israel with lies and subterfuge, and then they were stuck for the rest of their lives with the bargain they struck. There were, however, repercussions for Gibeonites. There are for you also. You knew and know and yet remain here as a thorn, on purpose.

 

[Lon]

Bizarre! Its almost like you had a response to a different topic and never read my post which had nothing to do with sacrifices and sin!?

It is the ONLY thing I came away from that dismal quote with: How you and that awful book trample the Savior. That and I truly want you to know you are going to stand before Him for the constant attacks. The UB is an abomination and it couldn't be worse if Satan himself stood up and said "you will not surely die..." The UB is the same lie about the consequences of sin. It is Satanic, Caino.

 

[Caino]

It is the ONLY thing I came away from that dismal quote with: How you and that awful book trample the Savior. That and I truly want you to know you are going to stand before Him for the constant attacks. The UB is an abomination and it couldn't be worse if Satan himself stood up and said "you will not surely die..." The UB is the same lie about the consequences of sin. It is Satanic, Caino.

Knight allowed it because of page views and he had a section on "Religion" duh! If you guy's see demons in every closet then you shouldn't have a Religion section on TOL. Plus, my last name is Knight!

"Discuss General Theology, Religions and Denominations, God's Attributes, Predestination and Free Will, Dispensationalism, Eschatology, Philosophy, Origins, Archaeology, Science, World History and other such topics."

The UB only destroys the idolatry of Bible worship and the human errors in the scripture record.


Jesus already addressed your fear based false claims:


24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.

25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:

26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?

27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.

28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

 

[Caino]

YOU know your book tramples the Bible. I believe you knew it before you ever started this thread. This isn't a Urantia website. I'm still perplexed Knight ever said 'yes' to this thread. It tramples Christianity all day and night in the most abusive and hateful ways. It is beyond me that he allowed it, but it reminds me of Joshua 9 where Gibeon tricked Israel with lies and subterfuge, and then they were stuck for the rest of their lives with the bargain they struck. There were, however, repercussions for Gibeonites. There are for you also. You knew and know and yet remain here as a thorn, on purpose.

I think you are jealous of the Urantia Book because it presents a better explanation of world history and a more consistent, realistic concept of Deity.

"In the physical universe we may see the divine beauty, in the intellectual world we may discern eternal truth, but the goodness of God is found only in the spiritual world of personal religious experience. In its true essence, religion is a faith-trust in the goodness of God. God could be great and absolute, somehow even intelligent and personal, in philosophy, but in religion God must also be moral; he must be good. Man might fear a great God, but he trusts and loves only a good God. This goodness of God is a part of the personality of God, and its full revelation appears only in the personal religious experience of the believing sons of God." UB 1955

 

[Lon]

Knight allowed it because of page views and he had a section on "Religion" duh! If you guy's see demons in every closet then you shouldn't have a Religion section on TOL. Plus, my last name is Knight!

"Discuss General Theology, Religions and Denominations, God's Attributes, Predestination and Free Will, Dispensationalism, Eschatology, Philosophy, Origins, Archaeology, Science, World History and other such topics."

The UB only destroys the idolatry of Bible worship and the human errors in the scripture record.

Er, attacks, like Don Quixote attacking the windmills of his mind. Destroy? In your little head BUT attacking God IS what Satan does. You cannot have it both ways.

Jesus already addressed your fear based false claims:


24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.

25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:

26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?

27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.

28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

Thus, you are not for us, but against us by your own admission. You yourself just said you are attacking, Caino. Of course I see demons when God is attacked, every time. Satan is a liar and the UB is full of lies. The reason His blood washes us, however barbaric (because you literally do not grasp the severity), is because Sin is an incredible evil and kills us. God had to, and did do something desperate, out of love, to save us. ANYTHING AND/OR ANYONE that attacks Him is Satanic (from the Father of lies)! You have to stand before Him on judgement day for this, Caino.

 

[Lon]

I think you are jealous of the Urantia Book because it presents a better explanation of world history and a more consistent, realistic concept of Deity.

I'm Jealous for God and ANYTHING that attacks Him. Your book isn't remotely worthy of anything from anybody AND doesn't demand that kind of devotion from its own text anyway. It isn't as well-thought-out as you imagine and is the work of amateurs.

"In the physical universe we may see the divine beauty, in the intellectual world we may discern eternal truth, but the goodness of God is found only in the spiritual world of personal religious experience.

Said every Samaritan, LDS, and Urantian dupe....

In its true essence, religion is a faith-trust in the goodness of God. God could be great and absolute, somehow even intelligent and personal, in philosophy, but in religion God must also be moral; he must be good.

NOT according to YOUR and Dr. Sadler's litmus test. It makes YOU god and Him the one who must jump through YOUR hoops of morality. It literally is what Satan does and did. Lucifer fell, Caino. He thought he was more righteous and deserving than God.

Man might fear a great God, but he trusts and loves only a good God.

",Said Lucifer, the father of lies." Does he believe his own garbage? Likely, but your book literally is everything that caused the father of lies to fall.

This goodness of God is a part of the personality of God, and its full revelation appears only in the personal religious experience of the believing sons of God." UB 1955

I'd wager most Urantians love the book because it allows them to embrace their sin and reject the imagined ones they find in God. Lucifer also placed himself in judgement over God, Caino. I don't know why you don't see it, the UB is a blueprint from Satan and is his story, clear as day.

My reason for hating your book is because, at least in three of your cases, it deludes and drives YOU away from God AS WELL AS attacks the Savior. The Savior can stand up for Himself, but grace is a messenger. Caino, I'm that messenger. Stop and desist working for Satan with his message that God is subpar and you have to 'make one up' or adopt a god of your own making. Satan is ALREADY warring against God. Don't join the mix.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Knight allowed it because of page views and he had a section on "Religion" duh! If you guy's see demons in every closet then you shouldn't have a Religion section on TOL. Plus, my last name is Knight!

Don't get haughty.

Knight is no longer the owner of TOL, and if it were solely up to me, I'd have banned you and locked this thread months ago. But thankfully it's not up to me, and I'd rather see you repent and turn back to the God of the Bible.

We're not going to pave your way to hell, Caino.

 

[Caino]

Don't get haughty.

Knight is no longer the owner of TOL, and if it were solely up to me, I'd have banned you and locked this thread months ago. But thankfully it's not up to me, and I'd rather see you repent and turn back to the God of the Bible.

We're not going to pave your way to hell, Caino.

Its disingenuous to have a forum for Religions if you can’t
handle the discussion of other beliefs.

Hell is a fictional place created by shamans and con artists who have no truth to teach. There is either life or death.
The obsession with salvation is self centered.

 

[Caino]

196:2.1 "Some day a reformation in the Christian church may strike deep enough to get back to the unadulterated religious teachings of Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith. You may preach a religion about Jesus, but, perforce, you must live the religion of Jesus. In the enthusiasm of Pentecost, Peter unintentionally inaugurated a new religion, the religion of the risen and glorified Christ. The Apostle Paul later on transformed this new gospel into Christianity, a religion embodying his own theologic views and portraying his own personal experience with the Jesus of the Damascus road. The gospel of the kingdom is founded on the personal religious experience of the Jesus of Galilee; Christianity is founded almost exclusively on the personal religious experience of the Apostle Paul. Almost the whole of the New Testament is devoted, not to the portrayal of the significant and inspiring religious life of Jesus, but to a discussion of Paul's religious experience and to a portrayal of his personal religious convictions. The only notable exceptions to this statement, aside from certain parts of Matthew, Mark, and Luke, are the Book of Hebrews and the Epistle of James. Even Peter, in his writing, only once reverted to the personal religious life of his Master. The New Testament is a superb Christian document, but it is only meagerly Jesusonian." UB 1955

 

[Caino]

48:6.33 Law is life itself and not the rules of its conduct. Evil is a transgression of law, not a violation of the rules of conduct pertaining to life, which is the law. Falsehood is not a matter of narration technique but something premeditated as a perversion of truth. The creation of new pictures out of old facts, the restatement of parental life in the lives of offspring—these are the artistic triumphs of truth. The shadow of a hair's turning, premeditated for an untrue purpose, the slightest twisting or perversion of that which is principle—these constitute falseness. But the fetish of factualized truth, fossilized truth, the iron band of so-called unchanging truth, holds one blindly in a closed circle of cold fact. One can be technically right as to fact and everlastingly wrong in the truth." UB 1955