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  • #61
    Originally posted by musterion View Post
    Yep. They'll tacitly agree to that much, usually, because they aren't bringing animal sacrifices. But when you show them from their own Bible that no one before Paul preached the death, burial and resurrection of Christ for the sin of all without distinction, without works (there's a reason Paul noted that) and without law, their knives come out. They WILL NOT tolerate it...as a Baptist once told me, "You're trying to take away my [water] baptism!"
    God Himself preached and promised the life, death, and resurrection (victory) of the male Seed over Satan, in Genesis 3:15.

    He just did not quote Paul.

    The gospel promises never change, because God nor His Word ever change. That is the very basis for divine covenant.
    "The immutable God never learned anything and never changed his mind. He knew everything from eternity."

    " The difference between faith and saving faith are the propositions believed."
    Gordon H. Clark

    "If a man be lost, God must not have the blame for it; but if a man be saved, God must have the glory of it."
    Charles Spurgeon

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Nang View Post
      If Abraham is revealed as being the "father" of faith (Romans 4:11-16), then we believers walk in his same steps, and possess the same gift of faith as he.

      If our faith is based upon the propositions of Truth, as revealed to us by the Holy Spirit, of the purpose of the Christ promised, I then contend Abraham was given the same saving spiritual knowledge.

      That is because you made it up, not surveying and studying the book, much less paying attentions to its details, instead, believing your Clavinist/"reformed"(uninformed) "church" SOF, Clavinist books/websites/articles....


      1 Peter 10 KJV

      6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 8 whom having not seen[a] you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls.

      10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, 11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. 12 To them it was revealed that, not to themselves, but to us they were ministering the things which now have been reported to you through those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven—things which angels desire to look into.

      Read it:To them it was revealed that, not to themselves, but to us


      Even the prophets, who did the "revealing," did not "get it all"-Peter's "dispersia" audience "got more" understanding than the prophets had.

      Originally posted by Nang View Post
      MADists teach faith before the Incarnation was blind or only suggestive at best. Or they are teaching works.
      False dichotomy, and a false, satanic charge on your part, against both dispensational and MAD proponents. Your father taught you well.





      Originally posted by Nang View Post
      For example, MAD teaches that .O. T. believers were saved through blessing Israel . . Rahab being heir's latest example. That kind of faith is blind to the promises of the Father of the Christ and it is a form of works.

      Show us one MAD proponent that ever "argued" that:

      O. T. believers were saved through blessing Israel.


      Originally posted by Nang View Post
      I strongly disagree that the gospel that saves souls, has ever changed, because the God of that Everlasting Gospel, reveals the Person of God Himself, immutable.

      You disagree, and you are a mess, and come to that conclusion, because you are clueless as to what the term "gospel" means, and, because you "teach"(loosely employed here) like a kindergartner, assert, that there is just one piece of good news in the bible. Listen, nasty:

      The good news that saves souls, "the gospel that saves souls," 1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV, is not equivalent to the everlasting good news, that "Everlasting Gospel" you cite from Revelation-you made that up. You did that, because you do not study the details of the bible. My evidence? Your "posts." Clueless.

      By your "argument," again, your Saint Judas preached the "good news" of 1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV. And you are proposing to teach us dispensational/MAD proponents, a few thins, Lucy? Have a seat.
      Saint John W

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Nang View Post
        I agree. MAD still advocates a large portion of humanity can only hope and will only be saved by works. By blessing national Israel.
        Show us one MAD proponent, with the quotes, that argued "a large portion of humanity can only hope and will only be saved by.. blessing national Israel."
        Saint John W

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by Nang View Post
          I agree. MAD still advocates a large portion of humanity can only hope and will only be saved by works. By blessing national Israel.
          Show us one MAD proponent, with the quotes, that argued(es) "a large portion of humanity can only hope and will only be saved by.. blessing national Israel."
          Saint John W

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by PneumaPsucheSoma View Post
            No, just trying to keep it light and cordial. Something you don't really understand.

            Back to your 'shrooms, Dead Head.
            Put your haseesh down, junkie.
            Saint John W

            Comment


            • #66
              I like this part:

              And notice the gradual change in the message, as Paul boldly states:

              "Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins: And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses." Acts 13:38-39 KJV
              Now why in the world did Paul feel the need to tell these Jews they couldn't be justified by the Law? Didn't all Jews know that? Where did he get the idea that, evidently, Jews did believe they could be justified by the Law?
              "There is one thing worse than going to Hell. That would be going to Hell and having it be a surprise."
              Terence Mc Lean

              [most will be very surprised]


              Everyone who has not believed the Gospel of grace is not saved, no matter what else they believe or do.
              By that measure, how many professing Christians are on their way to the Lake of Fire?

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by Nang View Post
                Noah preceded and fathered Abraham.

                You are just guessing about these holy matters and show you need to do some serious and more careful study.
                I occasionally make mistakes-I was predestined.


                My briiliant article stands, you biblical ignoramous-clueless. Nowhere in Matthew-John, prior to the death, burial, resurrection, did the content of faith, required to be believed, include believing in:

                Death
                Burial
                Reasurrection

                1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV good news

                You cannot show us, can you, nasty one?

                Show us.

                You won't. You're not in my league.
                Saint John W

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Nang View Post
                  The cross was God's means of fulfilling the promise of saving a people through the Seed of the woman, who would rectify and overcome the ramifications of Adam's fall into bondage to sin.

                  The cross can become a superstitious idol.

                  We place our faith in the Man crucified on a cross, but not on the means or event; nor God's timing to provide this blessed salvation.

                  Knowledge of the promised Mediator and Savior, is the basis of grace and faith . . not specific knowledge of Romans practicing crucifixions!
                  Obviously my post was not what the cross done for us. It was what happened at the cross, who was on the cross, the reason He was on the cross, that finished work at the cross. But I did not think I had to spell all that out as I figured that everyone would get what I was talking about when I said the cross. We sure weren't looking to the nameless thieves or anyone else that had been crucified.

                  And I would just add to that as you say "but not the means", while that is true, though He couldn't have died any other way. He fulfilled scripture perfectly. If He had been, for example, choked to death, He would not have fulfilled scripture and therefore I would refer to Him as him with a little "h" because He would not have been the Christ. So, yes, I only put my faith in Him and not the means but the means could not have happened any other way.
                  The greatest hope for America:
                  2Ch 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by john w View Post
                    Put your haseesh down, junkie.
                    You already have all the haseesh, Howard Stern.
                    Ecclesia reformata et semper reformanda secundum verbum Dei
                    “The Church reformed and always reforming, according to the Word of God.”

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by musterion View Post
                      Yep. They'll tacitly agree to that much, usually, because they aren't bringing animal sacrifices. But when you show them from their own Bible that no one before Paul preached the death, burial and resurrection of Christ for the sin of all without distinction, without works (there's a reason Paul noted that) and without law, their knives come out. They WILL NOT tolerate it...as a Baptist once told me, "You're trying to take away my [water] baptism!"
                      And I just challenged nast Naggie, as I've others, to show us, chapter and verse, where the 12(which included her Saint Judas), ever preached, prior to the dbr..
                      .
                      "Hey everyone!!!! Good news!!!! The Master is going to die for our/your sins...be buried,......raised again for your justification!!!! Believe this good news, to be saved/justified!!!!!!!!!!!!"

                      =1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV

                      They cannot. Even the Lord Jesus Christ did not preach this during His earthly ministry, not even revealing until late in His ministry, that He was to die, while, up until this time, the 12, including Judas, were preaching the same good news that He was-"the gospel of the kingdom." Peter tried twice to prevent His death, the very death, that was the basis for his reconciliation, a "pre-req" to justification. And on, and on....

                      You won't hear a peep out of them, except for perhaps more emotionall pleas/grunts/snorts/mutterings/stock cliches, along the lines of "Just one gospel!!! Cult!!! It all says the same thing!!! One unified message!!!Bible choppers!!! Cherry pickers!!!........................"
                      Saint John W

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by PneumaPsucheSoma View Post
                        You already have all the haseesh, Howard Stern.
                        How about a little pig latin from you Tiny Timothy O., instead of all this so impressive pistos jazz? Please?
                        Saint John W

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by john w View Post
                          How about a little pig latin from you Tiny Timothy O., instead of all this so impressive pistos jazz? Please?
                          How 'bout some faith from you instead of that hope masqerading AS faith so that all your law methodology works are sin.

                          Too bad TOL can't take chemo treatments and rid us of you.
                          Ecclesia reformata et semper reformanda secundum verbum Dei
                          “The Church reformed and always reforming, according to the Word of God.”

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by john w View Post
                            And I just challenged nast Naggie, as I've others, to show us, chapter and verse, where the 12(which included her Saint Judas), ever preached, prior to the dbr..
                            .
                            "Hey everyone!!!! Good news!!!! The Master is going to die for our/your sins...be buried,......raised again for your justification!!!! Believe this good news, to be saved/justified!!!!!!!!!!!!"

                            =1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV

                            They cannot. Even the Lord Jesus Christ did not preach this during His earthly ministry, not even revealing until late in His ministry, that He was to die, while, up until this time, the 12, including Judas, were preaching the same good news that He was-"the gospel of the kingdom." Peter tried twice to prevent His death, the very death, that was the basis for his reconciliation, a "pre-req" to justification. And on, and on....

                            You won't hear a peep out of them, except for perhaps more emotionall pleas/grunts/snorts/mutterings/stock cliches, along the lines of "Just one gospel!!! Cult!!! It all says the same thing!!! One unified message!!!Bible choppers!!! Cherry pickers!!!........................"
                            Just one example: Read Mark 10:33-34
                            "The immutable God never learned anything and never changed his mind. He knew everything from eternity."

                            " The difference between faith and saving faith are the propositions believed."
                            Gordon H. Clark

                            "If a man be lost, God must not have the blame for it; but if a man be saved, God must have the glory of it."
                            Charles Spurgeon

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              The good news of 1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV:

                              Death
                              Burial
                              Resurrection


                              Luke 18 KJV

                              31 Then He took the twelve aside and said to them, “Behold, we are going up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of Man will be accomplished. 32 For He will be delivered to the Gentiles and will be mocked and insulted and spit upon. 33 They will scourge Him and kill Him. And the third day He will rise again.”

                              34 But they understood none of these things; this saying was hidden from them, and they did not know the things which were spoken.


                              No progressive revelation....All were required to believe the same thing!!!!


                              Sure there isn't/they were.

                              "It's not that complicated."-STP
                              Saint John W

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by vfirestormv View Post
                                Obviously my post was not what the cross done for us. It was what happened at the cross, who was on the cross, the reason He was on the cross, that finished work at the cross. But I did not think I had to spell all that out as I figured that everyone would get what I was talking about when I said the cross. We sure weren't looking to the nameless thieves or anyone else that had been crucified.

                                And I would just add to that as you say "but not the means", while that is true, though He couldn't have died any other way. He fulfilled scripture perfectly. If He had been, for example, choked to death, He would not have fulfilled scripture and therefore I would refer to Him as him with a little "h" because He would not have been the Christ. So, yes, I only put my faith in Him and not the means but the means could not have happened any other way.
                                My reply re: the cross, was not to criticize your post, but to ward off some other arguments, that often pop up.

                                MAD does not believe any of us proclaim the gospel if we do not quote I Corinthians 15:1-4, and they have become superstitious about it, and made it a mantra.

                                My point was that the gospel of the dbr permeates all of Holy Scripture.

                                I agree with you that the cross was prophesied; especially in Psalm 22, and fulfilled exactly by Jesus on the cross.

                                I apologize to you if I offended you . . .

                                Nang
                                "The immutable God never learned anything and never changed his mind. He knew everything from eternity."

                                " The difference between faith and saving faith are the propositions believed."
                                Gordon H. Clark

                                "If a man be lost, God must not have the blame for it; but if a man be saved, God must have the glory of it."
                                Charles Spurgeon

                                Comment

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