Well, you said it: They are haters, and haters usually lie.
We need to get you a good avatar.
Trump is right to fight for the border wall
- Thread starter Catholic Crusader
- Start date
Well, you said it: They are haters, and haters usually lie.
We need to get you a good avatar.
Kit the Coyote
New member
Never said it didn't just pointed out it is not the best approach.
Kit the Coyote
New member
Kit the Coyote
New member
Good observation, since supposedly more illegals, is entering by airplane now than walking in.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
how does that compare to those who use boats?
hate like this is irrational
the only response to irrational hate is mockery
don't forget the ongoing research towards a working star trek style teleportation device
Kit the Coyote
New member
Right now most is arriving by air on a visa and overstaying. I suspect if the wall were built the amount of boat traffic will increase.
musterion
Well-known member
musterion
Well-known member
View attachment 26675
Two years in and Trump makes Obama look like the war-mongering imperialist he was.
Two years in and Trump makes Obama look like the war-mongering imperialist he was.
Thats an entirely different issue. Those people did not illegally sneak in. That is an administrative & enforcement issue.
WizardofOz
New member
It's simply a rhetorical statement from the rather in-depth article I linked. Is that the only aspect you are choosing to question?
| according to the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration, most of the smuggled marijuana as well as cocaine, heroin, and methamphetamines comes through the 52 legal ports of entry on the border. |
EDIT: Addressed better here
Last edited:
WizardofOz
New member
:doh:
So, you don't even know what a lie is.
Outstanding?
| Analysis Why Comparing the Mexican and Gaza Borders Is Irresistible, but Dangerous The comparison does little more than score political points, and by fanning the already-high level of rhetorical flames, may actually be making matters worse Apples and oranges |
Now, what you so conveniently left out of your own link...
| Experts we reached out to agree that illegal immigration along Egypt’s southern border has indeed significantly dropped in the years after the fence was built and that Johnson's assessment of its costs and timeframe are sound. However, they warn against generalizing that the fence is the sole reason for the drop and raise objections in comparing Israel’s border issues to those in the United States. The success of barriers such as a wall or fence depend on their scale and how heavily guarded they are, said Reece Jones, a political geography professor at the University of Hawai'i-Manoa and who has written about money spent on border security projects and their consequences. On a small scale and with many guards, walls can effectively stop movement, Jones said. But Israel and the United States’ southern borders are significantly different. The Israel-Egypt border fence is about 150 miles. The U.S.-Mexico border is nearly 2,000 miles. Terrain conditions and number of agents needed to monitor the border are not comparable either, Jones said. "Most of the Israeli fence goes through open, arid terrain. Easy to access, easy to build, easy to monitor with agents," Jones said. The U.S.-Mexico border, on the other hand, includes very remote, mountainous terrain and spans the length of four states with cities closely intertwined with Mexico. Trump has said that border has 1 million legal border crossings daily, which experts have told us include people traveling back and forth for school, work and shopping. Investment in high-tech features such as drones, robots and sensors is also crucial for border security, not just fences, added Elisabeth Vallet, who leads a research team on border walls and is Raoul-Dandurand Chair at the University of Quebec at Montreal. Without those features, people may still go undetected or go around through another border. If illegal entries surge at another border point, then the effectiveness of the fence at one border comes into question, Vallet said. "While the numbers show a dramatic decrease in the number of entries, the amount of credit attributed to the fence is an issue of serious debate in Israel," said Yonatan Jakubowicz, director of research and public relations at the Israeli Immigration Policy Center, an NGO in Israel. Some were skeptical about the fence’s effectiveness when the idea was introduced in 2009, but the barrier received wider support after a terrorist attack on the border road in August 2011, Jakubowicz said. He also said that aside from the fence, additional policies have reduced illegal immigration. The number of illegal border crossings decreased drastically "in an extremely short time" after the implementation of an "Anti-Infiltration Law" in mid 2012, Jakubowicz said. Under the law, individuals caught illegally entering Israel could be detained for up to three years, Jakubowicz said. The number of people illegally crossing Israel’s southern border decreased after the law came into effect, even though the fence was not fully completed, he said. "The fact that people continued to arrive even after the total completion of the fence, with fluctuations, proves that a barrier makes illegal migration more difficult, but not impossible," Jakubowicz said. "Personal interviews and close inspection of migrant diaspora news outlets show that the combination of the fence and the immigration policies are to be attributed to these numbers, and not the fence alone." Our ruling Johnson said Israel cut its illegal immigration rate by "99 percent" by constructing a 143-mile fence along its southern border. Israeli government data support Johnson’s statement. However, experts say the fence alone is not responsible for the dramatic decrease in illegal immigration, policies have also deterred illegal border crossings. Border security experts also caution about comparing Israel and the United States’ southern borders -- the U.S.-Mexico border is much longer than the Israel-Egypt border, terrain conditions are different and more agents would be needed to monitor the U.S. border. |
Again, apples and oranges. These are two very different borders.
You're simply a partisan hack who lacks any discernment or objectivity when looking at political issues. :sheep:
A lie is everything you post.
WizardofOz
New member
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
another strawman often encountered:
nobody is proposing a "wall alone"
rather, a wall as an integral part of an improved border security system
not as catchy a meme, i know - i can't envision crowds of trump supporters chanting "build the wall as an integral part of an improved border security system"
nobody is proposing a "wall alone"
rather, a wall as an integral part of an improved border security system
not as catchy a meme, i know - i can't envision crowds of trump supporters chanting "build the wall as an integral part of an improved border security system"
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
i don't need to read any further than this to understand that the article is written for an audience of annabananaheads:
| The cheerful paintings of flowers on the tall metal posts on the Tijuana side of the border fence between the U.S. and Mexico belie the sadness of the Mexican families who have gathered there to exchange whispers, tears, and jokes with relatives on the San Diego side. |
oh, the pathos!
oh, the humanity!
oh, the fact that the article doesn't explain why those poor poor families with their poor poor relatives don't simply cross, legally and visit with each other, why they don't simply relocate to one side of the border or the other to be with each other permanently
ya know, i could do the same thing if i wanted to attract the press - go over to the border and whisper at my foreign friends, weep at the cruelty of a border that keeps us from visiting each other in our homes
or i could just take my enhanced drivers license, answer a half dozen questions to the Canadian custom agent/border guard and drive into this foreign country, respecting its laws, and spend a day drinking my friend's labatts
WizardofOz
New member
It's fair to point out that a wall will not be very effective if people can simply use one of the hundreds of tunnels that already go underneath where any future wall would stand. Given the estimated total cost, it's fair to question the effectiveness of the wall. If a comprehensive plan addressed many of these possible shortcomings then perhaps a plan to build a wall would be more agreeable.
Can I see this improved border security system plan, including the estimated breakdown of cost?
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
another annoyance from the article:
What is the author saying here? That the wall won't stop any smuggling? That the wall won't stop all smuggling?
if the former, it's a lie
if the latter, another strawman
either way, either lazy thinking or deliberate misrepresentation
disappointing for the brookings institute
| Why the wall wouldn’t stop smuggling |
What is the author saying here? That the wall won't stop any smuggling? That the wall won't stop all smuggling?
if the former, it's a lie
if the latter, another strawman
either way, either lazy thinking or deliberate misrepresentation
disappointing for the brookings institute