The Late Great Urantia Revelation

[Aimiel]

...but then he put it in the hands of humans, not only to write it, but also to interpret it...and that messed everything up.

It is designed to be understood by everyone who comes to it as a child. Those who try to put a spin on it or invent imaginary gods to replace it have their reward: a false god that doesn't exist.

Not so sure about that. Humans had a lot more to do with that than god did.

God designed not just The Bible, but the men who wrote it. He didn't make any mistakes in It.

The UB isn't editing the bible...it fills in the blanks, clarifies, and corrects.

You've just described the job of an editor. :duh:

The UB makes god appealing again.

It is not God who is described in it's pages.

That doesn't sound like satan to me.

Wow! How subtle is that?

Genesis 3:1
Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

What sounds like satan is making a caricature out of god...like most believers do.

Imagery is how we communicate. Words, it's been estimated, make known less than about 40% of what we're actually trying to communicate. Everyone has their own 'interpretation' of anything and everything they read. God designed His Word so that He could be found by reading It and by seeking Him with all of one's heart.

That's because the bible is so perfectly clear that it spawned a brazilian religions, right?

Thank God for diversity. This world would be pretty boring if we all looked just like you, thought just like you and were all on our way to hell in a hand-basket, ignoring everyone who warned us to watch out for the cliff that's just around the corner.

For a world that's constantly changing? Even god could foresee that meaning changes with time.

I don't believe that He ever will change a single Word in The Holy Scriptures, but had what He wanted in Them written down so that They could be read by everyone, and They are eternal, and unchanging, just like He is.

If they look at you...and see someone they don't want to be...you've lost them.

Christ is the only example. If you're looking at me, you've missed The Gospel.

 

[freelight]

The bestowals of The Creator Sons...........

The bestowals of The Creator Sons...........

Aimiel, can you not answer my question, or did you just not read it?

Who do you think Jesus was when He was with the Father before the foundation of the Earth?

Considering the fact that the name Jesus (Yeshua) was his given name at His incarnation, you couldn't possibly believe His name was Jesus (literally) when He was with the Father before the foundation of the Earth?

When the Urantia Book speaks of "Michael" it is speaking of our Creator Son - not a created archangel (which you are confusing the Name Michael with due to gross misinterpretation of the original Hebrew and Greek). That subject is covered in another topic in which many literalist went off like a bottle rocket.

So again, in case you, missed it: Who do you think Jesus was when He was with the Father before the foundation of the Earth? Who was it that incarnated? Have you ever asked yourself that? What was His Name?

The issue of the identity of Michael has been addressed elsewhere, as comparing the traditional view of he being only an 'archangel', while the UB identifies Jesus as being 'Michael', or "Christ Michael' being our Creator-Son, of the order of Michael (The Creator Sons) - these Sons are known as 'Michaels'. See Creator Sons. One has to look at all the parallels between the traditional Michael (seen only as an archangel) or being the pre-existent Christ (as held by some SDA & JW's) and the UB view,- seeing all designations and their correlaries.

The title of 'Michael' and its meaning well fits 'Jesus' as a Creator-Son, being 'he who is like God', for Creator-Sons are representatives of 'God' and are verily the God over their local universes, achieving full sovereignty after their 7 bestowals). One must see the 'bigger picture' here to have a 'cosmic comprehension' of the this Revelation. (origination, heirarchy, relationships).

Nevertheless the Christology of the UB resonates with a traditional/orthodox understanding of the humanity/divinity merger of Jesus, for Michael of Nebadon did 'incarnate' (have his 7th and final 'bestowal' here on this planet) and in this mystery of the 'incarnation' God did indeed dwell among men 'in the flesh', yet the details of this differ in some respects than the traditional view. The lordship and divinity of Jesus is truly honored by the UB! , yet his incorporation and integration as a true human (Son of Man/Son of God) is also a part of his nature, having taken such on. The 'bestowal' of Jesus on Urantia is therefore an event of supreme import, whereby he completed his full experiential round of creature-Creator experience and triumphed having returned to the 'right hand of the Father' earning full sovereignty over his creation.

The honor given to Jesus is maximized thru his ordeal of becoming one of us, and his love intensified as one who can relate to mortals in their trials and sufferings. The Incarnation therefore is the act of divine love descending directly into humanity, touching every fiber of its heart, every dimension of experience, recognizing and unleashing its full potential in the divine will.


pj

 

[JWStipple]

It is designed to be understood by everyone who comes to it as a child. Those who try to put a spin on it or invent imaginary gods to replace it have their reward: a false god that doesn't exist.

Your spin is that you don't put a spin on it...just like everyone else. Sheesh...that takes care of every god out there. Good job!

God designed not just The Bible, but the men who wrote it. He didn't make any mistakes in It.

And the source of your information is...uh...what now? The bible, right?

You've just described the job of an editor.

Or someone with a brain.

It is not God who is described in it's pages.

Ahhh...so a decent, loving, merciful god isn't real then, eh? Darn. Well...folks are usually attracted to a god that is like themselves.

Imagery is how we communicate.

So...let me get this straight: god created us; he knows how we communicate; he wants to communicate with us...but there are no pictures in the bible?

Good point.

Words, it's been estimated, make known less than about 40% of what we're actually trying to communicate. Everyone has their own 'interpretation' of anything and everything they read. God designed His Word so that He could be found by reading It and by seeking Him with all of one's heart.

And who gets to decide when they've found god?

Thank God for diversity. This world would be pretty boring if we all looked just like you, thought just like you and were all on our way to hell in a hand-basket, ignoring everyone who warned us to watch out for the cliff that's just around the corner.

Well...an imaginary cliff, anyway...to match their imaginary god, no doubt.

I don't believe that He ever will change a single Word in The Holy Scriptures, but had what He wanted in Them written down so that They could be read by everyone, and They are eternal, and unchanging, just like He is.

Well...let's forget about all the translations, eh? And all the contexts, eh? And all the different people reading them, eh? And the interpretations, eh? In fact...let's just throw ALL of reality out the window...okay?

Christ is the only example. If you're looking at me, you've missed The Gospel.

I see...it's the ol', "Do as I say, not as I do!" thang, eh? You're a fallible human, presenting your spin on something that cannot be proven to even exist...and I'm supposed to regard your interpretation as "gospel"...when there are much more attractive and sensible options out there...presented by folks with more credibility than you have?

Well, no thanks. I think I'll fight for god's honor instead.

 

[One Truth]

Excellent, freelight.

120:4.2 But make no mistake; Christ Michael, while truly a dual-origin being, was not a double personality. He was not God in association with man but, rather, God incarnate in man. And he was always just that combined being. The only progressive factor in such a nonunderstandable relationship was the progressive self-conscious realization and recognition (by the human mind) of this fact of being God and man.

120:4.3 Christ Michael did not progressively become God. God did not, at some vital moment in the earth life of Jesus, become man. Jesus was God and man—always and even forevermore. And this God and this man were, and now are, one, even as the Paradise Trinity of three beings is in reality one Deity.

120:4.4 Never lose sight of the fact that the supreme spiritual purpose of the Michael bestowal was to enhance the revelation of God.

122:8.2 In just the same manner as all babies before that day and since have come into the world, the promised child was born; and on the eighth day, according to the Jewish practice, he was circumcised and formally named Joshua (Jesus).

OT

 

[Aimiel]

Ahhh...so a decent, loving, merciful god isn't real then, eh? Darn. Well...folks are usually attracted to a god that is like themselves.

I guess that explains your attraction to the deceiver.

I see...it's the ol', "Do as I say, not as I do!" thang, eh? You're a fallible human, presenting your spin on something that cannot be proven to even exist...and I'm supposed to regard your interpretation as "gospel"...when there are much more attractive and sensible options out there...presented by folks with more credibility than you have?

Well, no thanks. I think I'll fight for god's honor instead.

The god of the UB or The God of The Bible?

 

[Caino]

Time line of rebellion as relates to Genesis 6:4

"The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown."​

500,000 BC "The prince of this world" arrives, he is the resident "son of God", to all intents and purposes our administrative leader in a chain of authority reaching all the way back to the Father.


*About five hundred thousand years ago and concurrent with the appearance of the six colored or Sangik races, Caligastia, the Planetary Prince, arrived on Urantia. There were almost one-half billion primitive human beings on earth at the time of the Prince's arrival, and they were well scattered over Europe, Asia, and Africa. The Prince's headquarters, established in Mesopotamia, was at about the center of world population.


300,000 BC our prince, "Prince Caligastia", was swept up in the Lucifer rebellion.

THE CALIGASTIA BETRAYAL​

67:1.1 For three hundred thousand years Caligastia had been in charge of Urantia when Satan, Lucifer's assistant, made one of his periodic inspection calls. And when Satan arrived on the planet, his appearance in no way resembled your caricatures of his nefarious majesty. He was, and still is, a Lanonandek Son of great brilliance. "And no marvel, for Satan himself is a brilliant creature of light."

67:1.2 In the course of this inspection Satan informed Caligastia of Lucifer's then proposed "Declaration of Liberty," and as we now know, the Prince agreed to betray the planet upon the announcement of the rebellion. The loyal universe personalities look with peculiar disdain upon Prince Caligastia because of this premeditated betrayal of trust. The Creator Son voiced this contempt when he said: "You are like your leader, Lucifer, and you have sinfully perpetuated his iniquity. He was a falsifier from the beginning of his self-exaltation because he abode not in the truth."

Who were "the sons of God" that mated with the daughters of men?

THE PRINCE'S STAFF​

66:2.1 The Planetary Prince of Urantia was not sent out on his mission alone but was accompanied by the usual corps of assistants and administrative helpers.

66:2.2 At the head of this group was Daligastia, the associate-assistant of the Planetary Prince. Daligastia was also a secondary Lanonandek Son, being number 319,407 of that order. He ranked as an assistant at the time of his assignment as Caligastia's associate.

66:2.3 The planetary staff included a large number of angelic co-operators and a host of other celestial beings assigned to advance the interests and promote the welfare of the human races. But from your standpoint the most interesting group of all were the corporeal members of the Prince's staff—sometimes referred to as the Caligastia one hundred.

66:2.4 These one hundred rematerialized members of the Prince's staff were chosen by Caligastia from over 785,000 ascendant citizens of Jerusem who volunteered for embarkation on the Urantia adventure. Each one of the chosen one hundred was from a different planet, and none of them were from Urantia.

66:2.5 These Jerusemite volunteers were brought by seraphic transport direct from the system capital to Urantia, and upon arrival they were held enseraphimed until they could be provided with personality forms of the dual nature of special planetary service, literal bodies consisting of flesh and blood but also attuned to the life circuits of the system.

66:2.6 Sometime before the arrival of these one hundred Jerusem citizens, the two supervising Life Carriers resident on Urantia, having previously perfected their plans, petitioned Jerusem and Edentia for permission to transplant the life plasm of one hundred selected survivors of the Andon and Fonta stock into the material bodies to be projected for the corporeal members of the Prince's staff. The request was granted on Jerusem and approved on Edentia.

66:2.7 Accordingly, fifty males and fifty females of the Andon and Fonta posterity, representing the survival of the best strains of that unique race, were chosen by the Life Carriers. With one or two exceptions these Andonite contributors to the advancement of the race were strangers to one another. They were assembled from widely separated places by co-ordinated Thought Adjuster direction and seraphic guidance at the threshold of the planetary headquarters of the Prince. Here the one hundred human subjects were given into the hands of the highly skilled volunteer commission from Avalon, who directed the material extraction of a portion of the life plasm of these Andon descendants. This living material was then transferred to the material bodies constructed for the use of the one hundred Jerusemite members of the Prince's staff. Meantime, these newly arrived citizens of the system capital were held in the sleep of seraphic transport.

66:2.8 These transactions, together with the literal creation of special bodies for the Caligastia one hundred, gave origin to numerous legends, many of which subsequently became confused with the later traditions concerning the planetary installation of Adam and Eve.

66:2.9 The entire transaction of repersonalization, from the time of the arrival of the seraphic transports bearing the one hundred Jerusem volunteers until they became conscious, threefold beings of the realm, consumed exactly ten days.

THE CALIGASTIA ONE HUNDRED AFTER REBELLION​

67:4.1 When the final roll was called, the corporeal members of the Prince's staff were found to have aligned themselves as follows: Van and his entire court of co-ordination had remained loyal. Ang and three members of the food council had survived. The board of animal husbandry were all swept into rebellion as were all of the animal-conquest advisers. Fad and five members of the educational faculty were saved. Nod and all of the commission on industry and trade joined Caligastia. Hap and the entire college of revealed religion remained loyal with Van and his noble band. Lut and the whole board of health were lost. The council of art and science remained loyal in its entirety, but Tut and the commission on tribal government all went astray. Thus were forty out of the one hundred saved, later to be transferred to Jerusem, where they resumed their Paradise journey.

67:4.2 The sixty members of the planetary staff who went into rebellion chose Nod as their leader. They worked wholeheartedly for the rebel Prince but soon discovered that they were deprived of the sustenance of the system life circuits. They awakened to the fact that they had been degraded to the status of mortal beings. They were indeed superhuman but, at the same time, material and mortal. In an effort to increase their numbers, Daligastia ordered immediate resort to sexual reproduction, knowing full well that the original sixty and their forty-four modified Andonite associates were doomed to suffer extinction by death, sooner or later. After the fall of Dalamatia the disloyal staff migrated to the north and the east. Their descendants were long known as the Nodites, and their dwelling place as "land of Nod."

67:4.3 The presence of these extraordinary supermen and superwomen, stranded by rebellion and presently mating with the sons and daughters of earth, easily gave origin to those traditional stories of the gods coming down to mate with mortals. And thus originated the thousand and one legends of a mythical nature, but founded on the facts of the postrebellion days, which later found a place in the folk tales and traditions of the various peoples whose ancestors had participated in these contacts with the Nodites and their descendants.

67:4.4 The staff rebels, deprived of spiritual sustenance, eventually died a natural death. And much of the subsequent idolatry of the human races grew out of the desire to perpetuate the memory of these highly honored beings of the days of Caligastia.

67:4.5 When the staff of one hundred came to Urantia, they were temporarily detached from their Thought Adjusters. Immediately upon the arrival of the Melchizedek receivers the loyal personalities (except Van) were returned to Jerusem and were reunited with their waiting Adjusters. We know not the fate of the sixty staff rebels; their Adjusters still tarry on Jerusem. Matters will undoubtedly rest as they now are until the entire Lucifer rebellion is finally adjudicated and the fate of all participants decreed.

67:4.6 It was very difficult for such beings as angels and midwayers to conceive of brilliant and trusted rulers like Caligastia and Daligastia going astray—committing traitorous sin. Those beings who fell into sin—they did not deliberately or premeditatedly enter upon rebellion—were misled by their superiors, deceived by their trusted leaders. It was likewise easy to win the support of the primitive-minded evolutionary mortals.

67:4.7 The vast majority of all human and superhuman beings who were victims of the Lucifer rebellion on Jerusem and the various misled planets have long since heartily repented of their folly; and we truly believe that all such sincere penitents will in some manner be rehabilitated and restored to some phase of universe service when the Ancients of Days finally complete the



Caino

 

[Caino]

The earth was already populated when Adam & Eve came. The evidence can be found in the fragmented creation story of Genesis.

Cain said to the LORD, “My punishment is more than I can bear. 14 Today you are driving me from the land, and I will be hidden from your presence; I will be a restless wanderer on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me.”

15 But the LORD said to him, “Not so[e]; anyone who kills Cain will suffer vengeance seven times over.” Then the LORD put a mark on Cain so that no one who found him would kill him. 16 So Cain went out from the LORD’s presence and lived in the land of Nod,[f] east of Eden. ​

Caino

 

[JWStipple]

I guess that explains your attraction to the deceiver.

Well...if the deceiver is merciful, loving, consistent, compassionate, understanding, honorable, intelligent...all worthwhile attributes / characteristics...yeah, that would explain the attraction there, wouldn't it?

Compare that to bible-god...vain, petty, jealous, angry, vindictive, capricious, arbitrary, dishonest, impulsive...are you saying that's why you're attracted to that, because that mirrors your own character?

Fair 'nuff, then.

The god of the UB or The God of The Bible?

An honorable god...not a vain, petty, capricious, arbitrary, impulsive one. If the UB god and bible-god are not the same god being presented through two different filters...then I'll go with the UB god, thanks.

 

[Aimiel]

The earth was already populated when Adam & Eve came. The evidence can be found in the fragmented creation story of Genesis.

The fact that there were others on the earth at that time doesn't mean anything, other than the probability that God created more humans than just Adam and Eve. They were just the first. It seems implied... since Adam and Eve aren't stated to have had any daughters.

 

[Aimiel]

Compare that to bible-god...vain, petty, jealous, angry, vindictive, capricious, arbitrary, dishonest, impulsive...

I don't see that in The Holy Scriptures; so I guess it depends on one's perspective.

An honorable god...not a vain, petty, capricious, arbitrary, impulsive one. If the UB god and bible-god are not the same god being presented through two different filters...then I'll go with the UB god, thanks.

Your choice. All your false god will give you on judgment day is a good belly-laugh, as you see that he is a toothless defeated dog, compared to other angels, whereas The One True God would give you eternal life. Your selection will be clear to you one day, let's just hope it happens before it's eternally too late.

 

[JWStipple]

I don't see that in The Holy Scriptures; so I guess it depends on one's perspective.

Sheesh...god himself says he is a jealous god. And he most certainly has an anger-management problem, destroying civilizations with a flood. You've bought into the narrative hook, line, and sinker so completely that you'll let god off the hook for ANYTHING...simply because he's god.

So, yes, it certainly does depend on one's perspective.

Your choice. All your false god will give you on judgment day is a good belly-laugh, as you see that he is a toothless defeated dog, compared to other angels, whereas The One True God would give you eternal life.

Lol...they're the same god, Aimiel...seen through different filters. But, of course, each has his own filter. You're in charge of yours...that's your right...your obligation...your destiny.

Your selection will be clear to you one day, let's just hope it happens before it's eternally too late.

It will never be too late, Aimiel. You've just bought into a narrative that makes sense to you...because of your own character. You've created god in your own image. But, hey, don't worry about it...everyone else does the same thing.

 

[Aimiel]

Sheesh...god himself says he is a jealous god. And he most certainly has an anger-management problem, destroying civilizations with a flood. You've bought into the narrative hook, line, and sinker so completely that you'll let god off the hook for ANYTHING...simply because he's god.

I don't purport to judge God; and don't see anything that He needs to be 'let off the hook' for. Not having an understanding of Him through The Holy Scriptures, all you have is your imaginary picture of Him. He isn't found in your imagination, you have to seek Him with your whole heart.

...they're the same god, Aimiel...seen through different filters.

No, they're not. :rotfl:

It will never be too late, Aimiel.

Jesus said otherwise. You're just too thick to hear Him.

 

[Caino]

The fact that there were others on the earth at that time doesn't mean anything, other than the probability that God created more humans than just Adam and Eve. They were just the first. It seems implied... since Adam and Eve aren't stated to have had any daughters.

That's not the way the story is written, but even you are forced to capitulate and confess the obvious.

The earth is quite old and man was here looooong before Adam and Eve arrived. In fact, the fall or "a fall" had already occurred, the beast was already evil and working against God. Adam & Eve were fully grown adults had been previously instructed in the will of God and spoke the same language as the "crafty beast".


Caino

 

[freelight]

genetics......and all things ET

genetics......and all things ET

67:4.2 The sixty members of the planetary staff who went into rebellion chose Nod as their leader. They worked wholeheartedly for the rebel Prince but soon discovered that they were deprived of the sustenance of the system life circuits. They awakened to the fact that they had been degraded to the status of mortal beings. They were indeed superhuman but, at the same time, material and mortal. In an effort to increase their numbers, Daligastia ordered immediate resort to sexual reproduction, knowing full well that the original sixty and their forty-four modified Andonite associates were doomed to suffer extinction by death, sooner or later. After the fall of Dalamatia the disloyal staff migrated to the north and the east. Their descendants were long known as the Nodites, and their dwelling place as "land of Nod."

67:4.3 The presence of these extraordinary supermen and superwomen, stranded by rebellion and presently mating with the sons and daughters of earth, easily gave origin to those traditional stories of the gods coming down to mate with mortals. And thus originated the thousand and one legends of a mythical nature, but founded on the facts of the postrebellion days, which later found a place in the folk tales and traditions of the various peoples whose ancestors had participated in these contacts with the Nodites and their descendants.


Caino

Yes,...the legends of the 'sons of God' coming into the sons of man, the celestial beings of various orders 'mating' with the native mortals of the realm, all go back to the ancient 'recollections' of such 'intercourse'.

Extra-terrestrial Theology


pj

 

[JWStipple]

I don't purport to judge God; and don't see anything that He needs to be 'let off the hook' for.

Of course you don't. That would be irreverent...disobedient...defiant in the face of the Ultimate Authority Figure. That pushes your fear / guilt / child button.

Not having an understanding of Him through The Holy Scriptures, all you have is your imaginary picture of Him.

If everyone who makes the claim of "understanding" god had the same story, you might have a point. But pretty much every fanatic Christian out there paints a different picture of god...a god that's no better than they are. Judgmental people like judgmental gods...and with god on your side, the psychological picture is complete...perfect justification for your own conceit. It's pride, Aimiel...and it has sucked you in big time. Hook, line, and sinker.

He isn't found in your imagination, you have to seek Him with your whole heart.

So you say I've already found god, then?

No, they're not.

Yes, they are. You're stuck with a paralyzing narrative. But each of us learns only at his own speed. At this point in your life...you're EXACTLY where you need to be.

Jesus said otherwise. You're just too thick to hear Him.

Lol...I'm sure he's telling you what you want to hear.

 

[Caino]

THE FAITH OF JESUS
paper 196​

" Theology may fix, formulate, define, and dogmatize faith, but in the human life of Jesus faith was personal, living, original, spontaneous, and purely spiritual. This faith was not reverence for tradition nor a mere intellectual belief which he held as a sacred creed, but rather a sublime experience and a profound conviction which securely held him. His faith was so real and all-encompassing that it absolutely swept away any spiritual doubts and effectively destroyed every conflicting desire. Nothing was able to tear him away from the spiritual anchorage of this fervent, sublime, and undaunted faith. Even in the face of apparent defeat or in the throes of disappointment and threatening despair, he calmly stood in the divine presence free from fear and fully conscious of spiritual invincibility. Jesus enjoyed the invigorating assurance of the possession of unflinching faith, and in each of life's trying situations he unfailingly exhibited an unquestioning loyalty to the Father's will. And this superb faith was undaunted even by the cruel and crushing threat of an ignominious death."



Caino

 

[Aimiel]

So you say I've already found god, then?

Of course not: I won't lie to you. If you had found Him, you wouldn't have to ask me, and you'd be about trying to share Him with others, rather than trying to pull down someone's beliefs with quips and sarcasm. Those with an experience with God will always stand the tests invented by those who think they have knowledge 'about' God.

At this point in your life...you're EXACTLY where you need to be.

Lol...I'm sure he's telling you what you want to hear.

You know nothing about me, and you're sure of NOTHING. :duh:

 

[JWStipple]

Of course not: I won't lie to you.

then why did you just lie?

If you had found Him, you wouldn't have to ask me...

lol...i'm NOT asking you. you said, essentially, seek and you shall find. well, i sought...and i DID find.

and you'd be about trying to share Him with others, rather than trying to pull down someone's beliefs with quips and sarcasm.

depends on what god tells me. actually...i do try to share...but god told me that the stuff he told me would be waaaaaay over the head of the imprisoned believers. and god was right.

Those with an experience with God will always stand the tests invented by those who think they have knowledge 'about' God.

lol...just like heaven's gate, eh?

You know nothing about me, and you're sure of NOTHING.

i know that you're where you need to be at this point in this life. you're hearing what you want to hear in the way you need to hear it in order to push your "truth" button. sounds eminently human to me.

 

[Aimiel]

:yawn:

 

[Caino]

Jesus said:

"Let the childlike and darkened minds of my people serve their God as Moses directed; it is better that they do,
...
but let us who have seen the light of life no longer approach our Father by the darkness of death.

Let us be free in the knowledge of the truth of our Father's eternal love."

UBp1404