the church

[Cruciform]

Post the biblical connection between Rome/"Babylon."

B. Metzger & M. Coogan, eds. The Oxford Guide to People & Places of the Bible (Oxford U. Press, 2001):

"In the New Testament, Babylon became the epitome of wickedness and a symbolic name for Rome" (p. 30).​

S. Hahn & C. Mitch, eds. IGNATIUS CATHOLIC STUDY BIBLE: NEW TESTAMENT (Ignatius Press, 2010):

"The letter was written from 'Babylon' (1 Pt. 5:13). This is not a literal reference to the city of that name in lower Mesopotamia, but a figurative reference to Rome, the imperial capital of the Mediterranean world. [1] Mark's presence with Peter at the time of writing (5:13) coheres nicely with this interpretation, for Paul seems to indicate that Mark was in Rome at the time of his first imprisonment in the early 60s (Col. 4:10). [2] Additional support comes from Christian writers who identify Peter, along with Paul, as a cofounder of the Roman Church (St. Irenaeus, Against Heresies 3, 3) and as one who spent the latter years of his life there (St. Jerome, On Illustrious Men, 1). [3] Archaeological evidence has likewise given reason to believe that Peter spent his final days in the capital, for it has convincingly established that the apostle was and is buried on Vatican Hill. [4] Finally, there are parallel uses of 'Babylon' as a pseudonym for Rome in Jewish texts written in early Christian times (4 Ezra 3, 1; 2 Baruch 11, 1; Sibylline Oracles 5, 143)" (P. 448).​

Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+

 

[Cruciform]

The proof is in the pudding.

Post your pudding.

 

[TulipBee]

Circular arguments are bad arguments.

they have been reading too much dizzying doctrines of men. the Roman Catholic Church did not officially canonize the Apocrypha until the Council of Trent (1546 AD). This was in part because the Apocrypha contained material which supported certain Catholic doctrines, such as purgatory, praying for the dead, and the treasury of merit.


The apocrypha does not belong in the Bible because It IS not inspired

 

[TulipBee]

peter got to rome
-
they put his name on the church

holy peter church? how good is that?

 

[chrysostom]

the church teaches:
-that all are redeemed so we might be saved
-that anyone can choose to be saved
-that you have to do the work
-that Jesus is God....
many who depend solely on the bible miss at least one of these important teachings -
that is why we need the church -
that is why Jesus built His church on a rock

 

[Right Divider]

the church teaches:
-that all are redeemed so we might be saved
-that anyone can choose to be saved
-that you have to do the work
-that Jesus is God....
many who depend solely on the bible miss at least one of these important teachings -
that is why we need the church -
that is why Jesus built His church on a rock

Dude, working FOR salvation is a fool's errand. The Bible, through Paul, teaches that we today can be justified first and THEN proceed on to good works.

Titus 3:7-8 (AKJV/PCE)​

(3:7) That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. (3:8) [This is] a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men. ​

Unsaved people always think that God will be impressed with them and their "good works".

 

[chrysostom]

Unsaved people always think that God will be impressed with them and their "good works".

so why are you working so hard?

 

[Right Divider]

so why are you working so hard?

You must be around 11 years old.

How do you know how hard I work?

Get a single clue.... It'll be a start for you...

 

[chrysostom]

You must be around 11 years old.

How do you know how hard I work?

you have 235 posts in this thread warning people about the church -
not to mention the insults -
we call that work -
what do you call it?

 

[Right Divider]

you have 235 posts in this thread warning people about the church -
not to mention the insults -
we call that work -
what do you call it?

It don't call it "working for my salvation".

People like you are easily insulted. Start speaking the truth and you'll see the "insults" diminish dramatically.

 

[chrysostom]

It don't call it "working for my salvation".

so what you do doesn't matter -
what you call it does?

 

[Right Divider]

so what you do doesn't matter -
what you call it does?

Why are you so confused by simple things? You claim to use "common sense" and yet you don't seem to have any.

Paul says that being justified by His grace, we should be careful to do good works.

Doing good work DOES matter, otherwise he would not tell us to BE CAREFUL to do them. Even a child can understand something this simple.

P.S. I do know why you're confused, you're a Roman Catholic.

 

[Cruciform]

[1] Here you have merely engaged in the Straw Man Fallacy. Thus your claim is categorically false.

[2] Your comments are addressed HERE.

[3] Once again, you've merely placed your vast ignorance of all things Catholic on public display.​

 

[TulipBee]

so why are you working so hard?

no need to try hard at all

 

[Cruciform]

Then this must be the case as well:

99% works +
1% grace =
GRACE​

Excellent, then, it's all grace! :thumb:

 

[chrysostom]

the church teaches:
-that all are redeemed so we might be saved
-that anyone can choose to be saved
-that you have to do the work
-that Jesus is God....
many who depend solely on the bible miss at least one of these important teachings -
that is why we need the church -
that is why Jesus built His church on a rock

 

[TulipBee]

Then this must be the case as well:

99% works +
1% grace =
GRACE​

Excellent, then, it's all grace! :thumb:

good thing we dont learn from you. the Catholic Catechism For Adults on page 52 says, "Can you learn to save your soul just by reading the Bible? No, because certain things in the Bible can be misunderstood, and because the Bible does not have everything God taught." Notice that the first part of their answer to "Can you learn to save your soul just by reading the Bible?" is, "No..." However, their own translations of the Bible teaches the opposite. All Scriptural quotations that I will be giving are from Catholic translations. 2 Tim. 3:15-17 says, "And because from thy infancy thou hast known the holy scriptures, which can instruct thee to salvation, by faith which is Christ Jesus. All scripture, inspired of God, is profitable to teach, to reprove, to correct, to instruct in justice, that the man of God may be perfect, furnished to every good work." Thus, the apostle Paul by the inspiration of God, says to Timothy "thou hast known the holy scriptures, which can instruct thee to salvation" and make you "perfect, furnished to every good work."

 

[Right Divider]

the church teaches:
-that all are redeemed so we might be saved
-that anyone can choose to be saved
-that you have to do the work
-that Jesus is God....
many who depend solely on the bible miss at least one of these important teachings -
that is why we need the church -
that is why Jesus built His church on a rock

Quit spamming.

 

[HisServant]

the church teaches:
-that all are redeemed so we might be saved
-that anyone can choose to be saved
-that you have to do the work
-that Jesus is God....
many who depend solely on the bible miss at least one of these important teachings -
that is why we need the church -
that is why Jesus built His church on a rock

The belief that you can work your way to heaven is Heresy!

No surprise from the RCC... it has been heretical since the 3rd century.

 

[TulipBee]

The belief that you can work your way to heaven is Heresy!

No surprise from the RCC... it has been heretical since the 3rd century.

they have lots of sheperds too. Catholics often use the expression, "One fold and one shepherd" to sustain the doctrine of the papacy. (SeeCatholic Catechism For Adults, p. 59, q. 3). They teach that the "one shepherd" is the Pope and the "one fold" represents the Catholic Church. Hear what Jesus said about it:


"I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for his sheep...I am the good shepherd, and I know mine and mine know me, even as the Father knows me and I know the Father; and I lay down my life for my sheep. And other sheep I have that are not of this fold. Them also I must bring and they shall hear my voice, and there shall be one fold and one shepherd." (John 10:11, 14-16).


Jesus is that one good shepherd. If one can understand that one and one equals two, he can understand this. If one is subject to Christ as the one shepherd--that's one. If one is subject to the Pope as the one Shepherd--that's two!