ECT Tet and IP: so what's the bottom line, really?
- Thread starter musterion
- Start date
TweetyBird
New member
When Jesus said that, Judas was still His apostle :readthis:
Judas was disqualified :banned:
Yeah, and beside the point.
It's obvious from Acts 1 that it was incumbent on the eleven to replace Judas according to prophecy.
The Lord Jesus meant what He said concerning the twelve thrones in the 'regeneration/palingenesia'.
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
What's funny to me is all these supposed right wing conservatives are now parroting Hillary who also refuses to own her track record.:chuckle:
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
So was Dan.
TweetyBird
New member
Not until later. Jesus even sent Judas, the apostle, to heal people and cast out demons.
Matt 10
1 And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease. 2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother; 3 Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphæus, and Lebbæus, whose surname was Thaddæus; 4 Simon the Canaanite, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.
TweetyBird
New member
Which 12 do you think they are? Some doubted He had risen from the dead, still yet at His ascension.
TweetyBird
New member
Dan was not an apostle :doh:
These twelve minus Judas, plus Matthias:
Mat 10:2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother;
Mat 10:3 Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Lebbaeus, whose surname was Thaddaeus;
Mat 10:4 Simon the Canaanite, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.
Right Divider
Body part
Do you have a point? Why not make it?
Judas was replaced.
Not every detail is given in every passage of scripture. In THIS case, Judas was replaced. Read about it in Acts 1.
Right Divider
Body part
:juggle:
There are so many scripture jugglers here on TOL; don't be one of them.
TweetyBird
New member
I didn't say Judas wasn't replaced. I simply stated that when Jesus made the statement, Judas was still one of His apostles, sent with the others to heal people and cast out demons.
Secondly, I was replying in kind to the ridiculous statements by others who think that the 12 apostles are literally going to judge from 12 thrones. Which 12? Paul was also an apostle - the one Jesus chose Himself. Or is he now just personna non grata now that you all have figured out how the end is going to played out? What about the fact that some of the apostles doubted Christ had risen AT HIS ASCENSION? Or did that escape you all?
TweetyBird
New member
Right Divider
Body part
Once again, what is your POINT?
Yes, they will literally sit on thrones, just like Jesus said that they would.
The eleven and the replacement chosen in Acts 1. Is that so hard to follow?
Barnabas was also an apostle. So what?
Acts 14:14 (AKJV/PCE)
(14:14) [Which] when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard [of], they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,
Paul is that other different apostle. He is not one of the 12. The Bible explains "how it all plays out".
Please quote some scripture for that one!
Perhaps you're confusing resurrection and ascension.
TweetyBird
New member
Jesus said many things that are not literal and should not be taken so.
The Scriptures tell us that God/Jesus and the saints are the Judge:
1 Corinthians 4:5
Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
1 Corinthians 6:2
Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
2 Tim 4
1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2 Tim 4
8 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
Hebrews 10:30
For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
Hebrews 12:23
to the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
1 Peter 4:5
who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead.
And Paul makes another one. So which 12 apostles are going to be on thrones?
Barnabas did no miracles, signs and wonders. The sign of an apostle was doing signs and wonders, the miraculous
What other "different apostle"? What does that mean? He did signs and wonders like the other apostles, which was a sign of the apostles of Christ.
Matt 28
16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them. 17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted. 18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20 teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Mark 16
14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen. 15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Thing is, what was hidden from the Twelve by their own hand is not the Mystery only later revealed to Paul; which is a different issue.
After His resurrection, the Lord cleared up what they had failed to understand due to where they looked at things from at times.
Heck, all they had had to do was ask Him what He'd meant.
He never denied them an answer whenever they did ask - because, as He had told them - "it is given you to know..."
They were the very disciples Isaiah had prophesied of in Isaiah 8.
They were that "other nation."
After His resurrection, the Lord cleared up what they had failed to understand due to where they looked at things from at times.
Heck, all they had had to do was ask Him what He'd meant.
He never denied them an answer whenever they did ask - because, as He had told them - "it is given you to know..."
They were the very disciples Isaiah had prophesied of in Isaiah 8.
They were that "other nation."
Danoh, you best stay away from ECT. I highly doubt you're a Bible believing member of the Body of Christ and if you continue your assault here, I'll report you again. Understand?
Right Divider
Body part
Indeed Jesus did, but that does NOT make ALL things "not literal". There is NO reason from the scripture to believe that the 12 thrones were NOT literal.
Some random scriptures prove nothing.
I just old you, but you do not LISTEN to what others post... apparently.
The 12 are the eleven and the replacement.... that is 12.
Paul will NOT be one of those judging the TWELVE TRIBES OF ISRAEL. Paul is that other different apostle for the body of Christ which has NEITHER Jew NOR Greek.
How do you KNOW this? Scripture does NOT tell you this, but it DOES tell you that Barnabas was an apostle.
Acts 14:14 (AKJV/PCE)
(14:14) [Which] when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard [of], they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,
Just read and BELIEVE the Bible! Why do you deny what is PLAIN and CLEAR in the Bible?
Paul is the ONE apostle for the ONE body, whereas Israel had TWELVE apostles for the TWELVE tribes. It ain't rocket surgery.
So what? You still haven't given any reason why this is significant to our discussion here.
Why do you have such a difficult time making your POINT?
TweetyBird
New member
It proves who is doing the judging, and there is no mention of the apostles doing any of it. Revelation says nothing about it either.
There is only one throne in Heaven. The Jews/Israel are going to be judged the same as anyone else, as are the apostles.
Jesus has two bodies?
I believe that was general statement including Barnabas because he was with Paul, not because he was an literal apostle. The "credentials" for an apostle are laid out in Acts 1. Barnabas does not qualify. Only Paul was added by the Lord Himself, specifically.
Acts 13:1
Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.
All of the apostles were chosen to go to the Jews and the Gentiles. Jesus said it to all them, which is recorded not once, but at least three times - Matt 28, Mark 16, and Acts 1. Peter himself, said he was sent to the Gentiles.
Acts 15:7
And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
You are the one who questioned that some of the the apostles doubted at Jesus' ascension. I was providing proof that there were doubters present.