Theology Club: Repent and be Baptized...for the Remission of Sins

[way 2 go]

Here is what the Lord Jesus said to the Jews of the Old Testament who lived under the law:

"Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life" (Jn.5:24).​

what did god say to king Saul

1Sa 28:16 And Samuel said, "Why then do you ask me, since the LORD has turned from you and become your enemy?

 

[way 2 go]

I said I'm not buying your false modesty bit. I think that comes quite naturally...nothing at all to do with your "honesty". In the same way, the Pharisees honestly thought they were holy and righteous and they put on a good act. Such a good act that they fooled even themselves.

But, with this I will have to bow out of this conversation because it will only go downhill from here. I'm not out to attack your character, Jerry. I just don't like the way you "play".

Jerry can't think outside his box and it is a small box with limited responses

Then after being cleansed from our sins then we are to keep ourselves holy by ceasing from sinning:

Paul used king David as an example of a Jew who lived under the law but yet he was saved apart from works:

David had works
:sherlock:
David was shown an instance of grace for sins of which there was
was no sacrifice for.

 

[heir]

At 1 John 1:9 we are told to confess (acknowledge) our sins and then "the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanseth us from all sin" (1 Jn.1:7).

Then after being cleansed from our sins then we are to keep ourselves holy by ceasing from sinning:

:vomit: Yet another pathetic testimony from JS that we have sins in need of forgiveness and unrighteousness in need of being cleansed contrary to that which Paul writes.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

-DELETED-

I hope you're talking about yourself?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

:vomit: Yet another pathetic testimony from JS that we have sins in need of forgiveness and unrighteousness in need of being cleansed contrary to that which Paul writes.

So what do you make of Paul's words here?:

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God" (2 Cor.7:1).​

It certainly seems that Paul thought that we played a part in regard to "perfecting holiness." And we can understand that is true by what Paul said here:

"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service" (Ro.12:1).​

I think that you fail to distinguish between a Christain's "standing" before God (sitting together with Christ in heaven) and a Christian's "walk" upon the earth. Things which differ are not the same.

 

[patrick jane]

At 1 John 1:9 we are told to confess (acknowledge) our sins and then "the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanseth us from all sin" (1 Jn.1:7).

Then after being cleansed from our sins then we are to keep ourselves holy by ceasing from sinning:

"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service" (Ro.12:1).​

Paul is just sayin' that it makes sense to live clean and holy; it's our reasonable service, not a commandment Jere. can i call you Jere ?

 

[patrick jane]

I hope you're talking about yourself?

:rotfl:

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Paul is just sayin' that it makes sense to live clean and holy; it's our reasonable service, not a commandment Jere.

So are you denying that these words of Paul are not speaking of "commandments" which are given to us, commandments from the Lord Jesus?:

"For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus. For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication: That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour; Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God: That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified. For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness" (1 Thess.4:2-7).​

You may think that living holy is not a commandment but Paul would not agree with you.

If you want to call me something then why not my name which is Jerry?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Paul used king David as an example of a Jew who lived under the law but yet he was saved apart from works:

"What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin" (Ro.4:1-8).​

Yep, and David will receive it at the second coming on the day of atonement.

The Body has it now.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Yep, and David will receive it at the second coming on the day of atonement.

No, David had it then, as witnessed by his own words:

"But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered" (Ro.4:5-7).​

Do you honestly think that David's faith was not counted as righteousness while he walked the earth but it will be at the second coming?

That makes no sense.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

No, David had it then, as witnessed by his own words:

"But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered" (Ro.4:5-7).​

Do you honestly think that David's faith was not counted as righteousness while he walked the earth but it will be at the second coming?

That makes no sense.

David was a prophet.

 

[Tambora]

At this present time, there is only one gospel that saves into the BOC.

The question is whether there will come a time in the future when the BOC is complete, and then salvation saves into something other than the BOC?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

At this present time, there is only one gospel that saves into the BOC.

The question is whether there will come a time in the future when the BOC is complete, and then salvation saves into something other than the BOC?

Indeed, sister Whombora.

I believe the next to be filled up is the 144,000. The little flock made up part of that number.

 

[Danoh]

No, David had it then, as witnessed by his own words:

"But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered" (Ro.4:5-7).​

Do you honestly think that David's faith was not counted as righteousness while he walked the earth but it will be at the second coming?

That makes no sense.

Rip David's words out of their context, people; see if you too do not end up at your own notion.

Fact is, David having lived under the Law; his words were in the sense of that scene in the movie "A Bronx Tale," where that precious little Roman Catholic boy expresses his joy and relief at being able to confess his sins and by that, being able to start over free of his misdeeds as a child, from the previous week.

The understandings of a child are precious.

In an adult, however; especially one who would that others kow-tow to his every attempt to rule over their faith - not so!

 

[heir]

So what do you make of Paul's words here?:

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God" (2 Cor.7:1).​

It's not that we are in need of forgiveness of sins! We are ALREADY FORGIVEN ALL TRESPASSES!

Colossians 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

When will you get that through your head?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

It's not that we are in need of forgiveness of sins! We are ALREADY FORGIVEN ALL TRESPASSES!

Colossians 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

When will you get that through your head?

Yes, sister.

It's ironic that the 2 Cor passage Jerry quoted is actually about religion.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

David was a prophet.

So what?

That does not change the fact that even though he lived under the law he was saved apart from works:

"But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered" (Ro.4:5-7).​

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

So what?

That does not change the fact that even though he lived under the law he was saved apart from works:

"But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered" (Ro.4:5-7).​

I disagree with you.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Yes, sister.

It's ironic that the 2 Cor passage Jerry quoted is actually about religion.

So it has nothing to do with the lives we live as Christians?:

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God" (2 Cor.7:1).​

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

So it has nothing to do with the lives we live as Christians?:

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God" (2 Cor.7:1).​

It is about our lives, but it specifically about religion making us filthy.