Reconciled to God while enemies !

[beloved57]

2 Cor 5:17-19

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

There's a reconciled world, a world of individuals who were reconciled to God, not by their faith or repentance, or baptism, nor anything they did, but solely by Jesus Christ, which means His Person and Work on their behalf. He reconciled this world to God in His very own Person !

Now exactly what world is this ? Is it everyone without exception ? Absolutely not, but its a world that is in Christ, for God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself. There's a world of people God had Chosen for Himself in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him[Christ] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

God was in [the sphere of] Christ, reconciling the world unto himself,

This reconciliation did not occur outside of the sphere of Christ !

 

[Nanja]

2 Cor 5:17-19

¹⁷ Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.


¹⁸ And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;


¹⁹ To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

There's a reconciled world, a world of individuals who were reconciled to God, not by their faith or repentance, or baptism, nor anything they did, but solely by Jesus Christ, which means His Person and Work on their behalf. He reconciled this world to God in His very own Person !

Now exactly what world is this ? Is it everyone without exception ? Absolutely not, but its a world that is in Christ, for God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself. Theres a world of people God had Chosen for Himself in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4

⁴ According as he hath chosen us in him[Christ] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

God was in [the sphere of] Christ, reconciling the world unto himself,

This reconciliation did not occur outside of the sphere of Christ !

Amen ! Those Chosen in Christ, His Seed Is. 53:10, were placed in the sphere of Christ by God before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:4; an Elect World that was Chosen in Him to have forgiveness of sins Eph. 1:7, hence they were reconciled to God while being His enemies and unbelievers Rom. 5:9-10. So they were never charged with any sin because He already was made a sin offering for them by His Blood even from Everlasting Is. 53:10.

Rom. 4:6-8

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.


Now we can absolutely know that this reconciliation 2 Cor. 5:17-19 did not occur for all without exception, because many were always outside of the sphere of Christ, and will continue in the lusts of their father the devil John 8:44 and pay the wages for their sins Ro. 6:23a in the lake of fire Rev. 21:8.

 

[beloved57]

Amen ! Those Chosen in Christ, His Seed Is. 53:10, were placed in the sphere of Christ by God before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:4; an Elect World that was Chosen in Him to have forgiveness of sins Eph. 1:7, hence they were reconciled to God while being His enemies and unbelievers Rom. 5:9-10. So they were never charged with any sin because He already was made a sin offering for them by His Blood even from Everlasting Is. 53:10.

Rom. 4:6-8

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.


Now we can absolutely know that this reconciliation 2 Cor. 5:17-19 did not occur for all without exception, because many were always outside of the sphere of Christ, and will continue in the lusts of their father the devil John 8:44 and pay the wages for their sins Ro. 6:23a in the lake of fire Rev. 21:8.

Amen Sister !

 

[ttruscott]

Romans 5:8 While we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
Romans 5:10 For if, while we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son...
At the time Christ died for you, were you yet a sinner? Were you HIS enemy? You supposedly did not exist yet! And if you existed in HIS mind as HIS enemy and then were created as HIS enemy then GOD creates evil people from HIS own fiat, no intermediary cause at all, a blasphemy too objectionable to be countenanced for one moment.

According to pre-conception theology, at the foundation of the world well before His death you were indeed HIS sinful enemy by your own free will decision to rebel against HIM, without any twisting, reinterpretations or theological wonders. Seems that Paul might have thought so too.

 

[beloved57]

Romans 5:8 While we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
Romans 5:10 For if, while we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son...
At the time Christ died for you, were you yet a sinner? Were you HIS enemy? You supposedly did not exist yet! And if you existed in HIS mind as HIS enemy and then were created as HIS enemy then GOD creates evil people from HIS own fiat, no intermediary cause at all, a blasphemy too objectionable to be countenanced for one moment.

According to pre-conception theology, at the foundation of the world well before His death you were indeed HIS sinful enemy by your own free will decision to rebel against HIM, without any twisting, reinterpretations or theological wonders. Seems that Paul might have thought so too.

Rabbit trail !

 

[Truster]

Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.


All for whom Christ died, have been reconciled to God, by His death alone, not by their obedience, not by their faith, not by their repentance, but even while they were being enemies, unbelievers, children of wrath as others BY NATURE, now if this be the case, their being reconciled, they cannot be under condemnation and wrath as others Jn 3:18,36 even while being unbelievers !

You see, they cannot be both condemned and under wrath as enemies and reconciled to God as enemies at the same time !

For years you have been insisting that man is justified "in eternity past" and that you were never under condemnation. You seem to have changed your mind on this. You now say that man was once an enemy and as such was under condemnation and wrath.

 

[ttruscott]

Rabbit trail !

Knee jerk !

 

[God's Truth]

We were reconciled to God while enemies means we didn't have to get circumcised in the flesh before Jesus would save us.


Ephesians 2:11 Therefore remember that formerly you who are Gentiles in the flesh and called uncircumcised by the so-called circumcision (that done in the body by human hands)— 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.

Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,

 

[Truster]

For years you have been insisting that man is justified "in eternity past" and that you were never under condemnation. You seem to have changed your mind on this. You now say that man was once an enemy and as such was under condemnation and wrath.

No answer to this or the question about grace.

 

[beloved57]

Enemies of God by nature

All of Gods Elect, Sheep are by nature like all others enemies of God Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Col 1:21

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

Eph 2:2-3

2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

However the huge difference is, Gods Elect even in this sinful condition, they have been Justified, washed in the Blood of Christ and are clothed with His righteousness, whereas the non elect are not, they are under Gods condemnation and wrath !

 

[Nanja]

Enemies of God by nature

All of Gods Elect, Sheep are by nature like all others enemies of God Rom 5:10

¹⁰ For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Col 1:21

²¹ And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

Eph 2:2-3

² Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:


³ Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

However the huge difference is, Gods Elect even in this sinful condition, they have been Justified, washed in the Blood of Christ and are clothed with His righteousness, whereas the non elect are not, they are under Gods condemnation and wrath !

Amen ! Both the children of the devil and the Elect Children of God are born with the same wicked nature of the devil.

But the difference is that God's Elect Children have been reconciled to Him by Christ's Blood Heb. 7:22; Rev. 13:8 on their behalf objectively from Everlasting Rom. 5:9-10, even while being His enemies and unbelievers, which ensures that they all shall be quickened, reconciled subjectively, made Spiritually Alive [New Birth] in Time. So for them Christ is made a Quickening Spirit [makes them Live Spiritually] 1 Cor. 15:45, and they all [the Elect] shall be saved by His Life Rom. 5:10 !

Rom. 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

 

[beloved57]

Amen ! Both the children of the devil and the Elect Children of God are born with the same wicked nature of the devil.

But the difference is that God's Elect Children have been reconciled to Him by Christ's Blood Heb. 7:22; Rev. 13:8 on their behalf objectively from Everlasting Rom. 5:9-10, even while being His enemies and unbelievers, which ensures that they all shall be quickened, reconciled subjectively, made Spiritually Alive [New Birth] in Time. So for them Christ is made a Quickening Spirit [makes them Live Spiritually] 1 Cor. 15:45, and they all [the Elect] shall be saved by His Life Rom. 5:10 !

Rom. 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Well said my Sister !

 

[MennoSota]

It is refreshing to read these posts. I was beginning to lose heart that this site was just a place of pagan trolls. [emoji56] Thanks for blessing me with great, refreshing truths that remind me of my vile nature that is released by the atoning work of Jesus on my behalf. Oh what joy to live in God's amazing grace!

Enemies of God by nature

All of Gods Elect, Sheep are by nature like all others enemies of God Rom 5:10

¹⁰ For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Col 1:21

²¹ And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

Eph 2:2-3

² Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:


³ Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

However the huge difference is, Gods Elect even in this sinful condition, they have been Justified, washed in the Blood of Christ and are clothed with His righteousness, whereas the non elect are not, they are under Gods condemnation and wrath !

Amen ! Both the children of the devil and the Elect Children of God are born with the same wicked nature of the devil.

But the difference is that God's Elect Children have been reconciled to Him by Christ's Blood Heb. 7:22; Rev. 13:8 on their behalf objectively from Everlasting Rom. 5:9-10, even while being His enemies and unbelievers, which ensures that they all shall be quickened, reconciled subjectively, made Spiritually Alive [New Birth] in Time. So for them Christ is made a Quickening Spirit [makes them Live Spiritually] 1 Cor. 15:45, and they all [the Elect] shall be saved by His Life Rom. 5:10 !

Rom. 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

 

[God's Truth]

Reconciled while enemies is about the Gentiles who were enemies to God and without Him in the world because they did not come into the covenant, which circumcision was the seal and sign.

Reconciled while enemies means that Jesus saved Gentiles and didn't make them get circumcised first.

 

[beloved57]

Reconciled while enemies is about the Gentiles who were enemies to God and without Him in the world because they did not come into the covenant, which circumcision was the seal and sign.

Reconciled while enemies means that Jesus saved Gentiles and didn't make them get circumcised first.

False statement having nothing to do with Rom 5:10

 

[beloved57]

One of the blessed truths about reconciliation by the death of Christ which men naturally overlook and even ignore is the that being reconciled to God by the death of His Son Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Its relevant with non imputation of sin 2 Cor 5:19

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Thats why when sinners Christ died for are still in nature enemies with God, sinful and ungodly, that's why they are still reconciled to God, because all their sinfulness, disobedience, unbelief, rebellion isn't charged, imputed to them, instead the verdict for them is reconciled to God !

 

[beloved57]

And non imputation of sin which is interrelated to reconciliation, its also interrelated with forgiveness of sins. Paul in his writing to the Romans in Chapt 4:7-8

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

So the reconciled while enemies/unbelievers by the death of Gods Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, they dont have their sins against God imputed to them also they have been forgiven of their iniquities ,

This all the while they are in themselves were enemies.

 

[Nanja]

One of the blessed truths about reconciliation by the death of Christ which men naturally overlook and even ignore is the that being reconciled to by the death of His Son Rom 5:10

10 [FONT="]For if, when we were enemies,[B] we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, [/B]much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Its interrelated with non imputation of sin 2 Cor 5:19

[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][B]19 [/B][/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="]To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Thats why when sinners Christ died for are still in nature enemies with God, sinful and ungodly, that's why they are still reconciled to God, because all their sinfulness, disobedience, unbelief, rebellion isn't charged, imputed to them, instead the verdict for them is reconciled to God ![/FONT]

Amen ! It's a Legally Reconciled World 2 Cor. 5:19; Rom. 5:10 that God commendeth His Love toward Rom. 5:8 because of the Death / Blood of His Son on their behalf.

8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.


Ps. 32:1-2

1 Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.

2 Blessed is the man unto whom the LORD imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.

 

[ttruscott]

Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Romans 5:8 While we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
Romans 5:10 For if, while we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son...

At the time Christ died for you, were you yet (ie still) a sinner? Were you HIS enemy? You supposedly did not exist yet! And if you existed in HIS mind as HIS enemy and then were created as HIS enemy then GOD creates evil people from HIS own fiat, no intermediary cause at all like Adam is supposed to be, a blasphemy too objectionable to be countenanced for one moment.

According to pre-conception theology, at the foundation of the world well before His death you were indeed HIS sinful enemy by your own free will decision to rebel against HIM, without any twisting, reinterpretations or theological wonders. Seems that Paul might have thought so too.

 

[beloved57]

ttru

At the time Christ died for you, were you yet (ie still) a sinner? Were you HIS enemy?

Yes, thats what the verse indicates read it Rom 5:10

And if you existed in HIS mind as HIS enemy

Never heard of that before neither does Rom 5:10 state that.

and then were created as HIS enemy then GOD creates evil people from HIS own fiat, no intermediary cause at all like Adam is supposed to be, a blasphemy too objectionable to be countenanced for one moment.

According to pre-conception theology, at the foundation of the world well before His death you were indeed HIS sinful enemy by your own free will decision to rebel against HIM, without any twisting, reinterpretations or theological wonders. Seems that Paul might have thought so too.

Never heard of none of this before. If you want to know what I believe on this subject please take time to read the thread and ponder the contents of my posts.