pacifism for true Jesus' followers.

[marhig]

If someone entered my house at night, and in the process of me subduing him, I kill him, I would not be condemned for killing him.

However, if that same person were to enter my house during the day, and I killed them, then what I did was unjustified, and I would be condemned.

However, I do not have the right to kill someone for committing a capital crime. That responsibility falls to the government.

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I'm not talking about self defence and killing them by subduing them, if I had children in my home and a maniac came in I'd do whatever it takes to stop him/her from hurting them. But that's not purposely killing.

I'm talking about taking a person and killing them like you say is right because of the old testament? Could you do it?

And what it they repent?

 

[JudgeRightly]

Not ready for the answer?

Jesus forgave those who crucified him without them repenting, why of we're not to do so?

Again, you don't understand the principle I'm trying to get across to you. Until you understand the principle, I will not tell you why Jesus forgave them.

If you forgive someone without them repenting, you, as a representative of God, are telling them that they don't have to repent, because God does not require repentance.

You make repentance superfluous by forgiving without requiring repentance.

We are supposed to rebuke those who wrong us, and if they repent, then (and only then) we forgive them.

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[Tambora]

So what's the difference between killing a person and murdering them?

One is just per law and one is not just per law.
The law not only allowed just killings, but even commanded just killings.

The law commanded the killing of:
those that commit adultery
those that kill without cause
those that are witches
etc.

Those killings are just.
They are not "murder" because they were not done "without cause".

 

[marhig]

Again, you don't understand the principle I'm trying to get across to you. Until you understand the principle, I will not tell you why Jesus forgave them.

If you forgive someone without them repenting, you, as a representative of God, are telling them that they don't have to repent, because God does not require repentance.

You make repentance superfluous by forgiving without requiring repentance.

We are supposed to rebuke those who wrong us, and if they repent, then (and only then) we forgive them.

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Rebuke them yes, but Jesus forgave those who didn't repent, he forgave those who crucified him. And so did Stephen who followed his example when he was being stoned.

He is our example to follow, and I believe that we can forgive even if others haven't repented. And in my own life i know it works, because if I hadn't forgiven then I would still be hard and bitter, but God gave me the strength to overcome, even though they hadn't repented!

I'm sorry but we'll have to agree to disagree as we're not getting anywhere.

 

[marhig]

One is just per law and one is not just per law.
The law not only allowed just killings, but even commanded just killings.

The law commanded the killing of:
those that commit adultery
those that kill without cause
those that are witches
etc.

Those killings are just.
They are not "murder" because they were not done "without cause".

So your saying that we are ok to kill because it says so in the old testament? Yet you say we are not under the law but under grace? Your beliefs are very confusing!

So could you kill someone who committed adultery?

Hey you could have been a judge in the witch trials!

This thread is unbelievable! I'm off to clean my house.

 

[Tambora]

So your saying that we are ok to kill because it says so in the old testament? Yet you say we are not under the law but under grace? Your beliefs are very confusing!

So could you kill someone who committed adultery?

Hey you could have been a judge in the witch trials!

This thread is unbelievable! I'm off to clean my house.

It's unbelievable that you think GOD commanded men to sin.

 

[JudgeRightly]

One is just per law and one is not just per law.
The law not only allowed just killings, but even commanded just killings.

The law commanded the killing of:
those that commit adultery
those that kill without cause
those that are witches
etc.

Those killings are just.
They are not "murder" because they were not done "without cause".

Check your PMs.

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[JudgeRightly]

Rebuke them yes, but Jesus forgave those who didn't repent, he forgave those who crucified him. And so did Stephen who followed his example when he was being stoned.

He is our example to follow, and I believe that we can forgive even if others haven't repented. And in my own life i know it works, because if I hadn't forgiven then I would still be hard and bitter, but God gave me the strength to overcome, even though they hadn't repented!

I'm sorry but we'll have to agree to disagree as we're not getting anywhere.

You not even recognizing that I'm trying to teach you a principle before we move to different scenarios. It's called a hermeneutic. I cannot and will not move on to scenarios until you can understand and use the tool I'm trying to give you.

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[marhig]

It's unbelievable that you think GOD commanded men to sin.

God did it because of the hardness of their hearts, they didn't walk in the spirit as those who are born of God do now, throughJesus Christ by the grace of God we are not to purposely kill.

To kill someone on purpose is murder. As I said to Jerry, we're getting nowhere, we'll have to agree to disagree and God will be our judge.

Ok I'm off.

 

[JudgeRightly]

So your saying that we are ok to kill because it says so in the old testament? Yet you say we are not under the law but under grace? Your beliefs are very confusing!

So could you kill someone who committed adultery?

If the person had been convicted of adultery, and the government told me that I was the one who they want to kill them, then yes, I would, and gladly.

"The righteous shall rejoice when they see the vengeance!"

Hey you could have been a judge in the witch trials!

This thread is unbelievable! I'm off to clean my house.

https://youtu.be/zrzMhU_4m-g

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[JudgeRightly]

God did it because of the hardness of their hearts, they didn't walk in the spirit as those who are born of God do now, throughJesus Christ by the grace of God we are not to purposely kill.

To kill someone on purpose is murder. As I said to Jerry, we're getting nowhere, we'll have to agree to disagree and God will be our judge.

Ok I'm off.

So God, in the old testament told people to sin? See what happens when you don't know and understand the entire story of the Bible, and only use part of it to support your beliefs?

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[Tambora]

Check your PMs.

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Done.

Exodus 22:18 KJV
(18) Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.

Was GOD telling them to sin?

 

[marhig]

So God, in the old testament told people to sin? See what happens when you don't know and understand the entire story of the Bible, and only use part of it to support your beliefs?

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What I meant by that was that the people didn't have the holy spirit, they were still in their flesh and not walking in the spirit. So they lived as so.

Those born of God walk in the spirit, and the Spirit convicts us in our hearts of our sins each day and helps us to overcome.

Just by saying that you could kill someone because the government says so tells me you are wrong. Because those who belong to God put God first, and I believe that God does not condone those who belong to him purposely killing another once we walk in the spirit!

Also, you say kill and murder are different, so why in the 10 commandments did God day thou shalt not kill? He said kill not murder?

 

[marhig]

Done.

Exodus 22:18 KJV
(18) Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.

Was GOD telling them to sin?

As I said, you'd be a perfect judge in the witch trials!

You do realise that many executed as witches were innocent don't you?

 

[marhig]

So God, in the old testament told people to sin? See what happens when you don't know and understand the entire story of the Bible, and only use part of it to support your beliefs?

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Matthew 5

For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach*them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceedthe righteousness*of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Jesus said that we are not to break the 10 commandments or teach others to do so and one of those commandments is "thou shalt not kill"

 

[JudgeRightly]

What I meant by that was that the people didn't have the holy spirit, they were still in their flesh and not walking in the spirit. So they lived as so.

They were God's people, not gentiles.

Those born of God walk in the spirit, and the Spirit convicts us in our hearts of our sins each day and helps us to overcome.

Just by saying that you could kill someone because the government says so tells me you are wrong.

How? God gave the government to punish criminals. If the government, having such authority, tells me that they want me to be the one to execute a convicted capital criminal, then I will gladly and wholeheartedly be the one to execute them, for it is JUSTICE.

Because those who belong to God put God first, and I believe that God does not condone those who belong to him purposely killing another once we walk in the spirit!

If God were to come to you right now, and tell you to execute the murderer and rapist, would you do it?

Also, you say kill and murder are different,

Correct.

so why in the 10 commandments did God day thou shalt not kill?

He didn't.

He said kill not murder?

No. I addressed this above, but I think you missed it.

The Hebrew word used in Exodus 20:13 is ratsatch. It literally means "murder."
https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?t=kjv&strongs=h7523

"Thou shall not kill" is an incorrect translation, which, sadly, was how it was written in the KJV.

Copyright Bob Enyart, Kgov.com

Copyright Bob Enyart, Kgov.com

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[JudgeRightly]

As I said, you'd be a perfect judge in the witch trials!

You do realise that many executed as witches were innocent don't you?

Let me guess, you think that we shouldn't put people to death because there would be innocent people caught up in the ones who were executed?

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[meshak]

Let me guess, you think that we shouldn't put people to death because there would be innocent people caught up in the ones who were executed?

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I really don't want to reply to your posts because you really don't care what we have to say, but I am doing it for the public.

If the world decides to execute the criminals let them. His followers should not get involved in making decisions.

 

[JudgeRightly]

I really don't want to reply to your posts because you really don't care what we have to say, but I am doing it for the public.

If there is anyone who doesn't want to hear what her opponent says, it's you, Meshak.

If I didn't really care what you said, I wouldn't address each of your points with lengthy replies.

Meshak, if someone is wrong about a subject, and they don't know it, but strongly defend their side, is it wrong to tell them that they're wrong and why?

If the world decides to execute the criminals let them. His followers should not get involved in making decisions.

God's people should be the ONLY ones making such decisions, (see my thread on what a Christian government would look like here) as we are the only ones who know right from wrong. We are to be salt and light in the world, showing the world the difference between good and evil, telling them to repent of their sins because if they don't, they WILL spend the rest of eternity apart from their Creator who loves them enough to send His son to die for them.

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[meshak]

If there is anyone who doesn't want to hear what her opponent says, it's you, Meshak.

If I didn't really care what you said, I wouldn't address each of your points with lengthy replies.

Meshak, if someone is wrong about a subject, and they don't know it, but strongly defend their side, is it wrong to tell them that they're wrong and why?



God's people should be the ONLY ones making such decisions, (see my thread on what a Christian government would look like here) as we are the only ones who know right from wrong. We are to be salt and light in the world, showing the world the difference between good and evil, telling them to repent of their sins because if they don't, they WILL spend the rest of eternity apart from their Creator who loves them enough to send His son to die for them.

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I am not interested in your reply or your excuses. I just did that to inform the public.

good day.