On the omniscience of God

Leatherneck

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@Leatherneck did the entire city of Jerusalem, all Judea, and the whole literal region around the Jordan river come out to John as he was baptizing people?

Then Jerusalem, all Judea, and all the region around the Jordan went out to him - Matthew 3:5 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew3:5&version=NKJV

Or is the verse saying that there were many people who came from Jerusalem, Judea, and the region around the Jordan to be baptized?
Obviously it means many people. Who is speaking in Matthew 3:5 and who is speaking in Malachi 3:6 ?
 

Tambora

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@Leatherneck did the entire city of Jerusalem, all Judea, and the whole literal region around the Jordan river come out to John as he was baptizing people?

Then Jerusalem, all Judea, and all the region around the Jordan went out to him - Matthew 3:5 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew3:5&version=NKJV

Or is the verse saying that there were many people who came from Jerusalem, Judea, and the region around the Jordan to be baptized?
Yeppers.
This could be a problem with how people approach scripture.
Perhaps they shouldn't be thinking that each word, phrase, and sentence is supposed to be precise in every little detail, but that it is speaking common language.
Even today our common language usage would be (when the sidewalks are paced during a Christmas parade) "The whole town watched the Christmas parade".
 

Leatherneck

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And then it says, "Therefore you sons of Jacob are not consumed."

“Behold, I send My messenger, And he will prepare the way before Me. And the Lord, whom you seek, Will suddenly come to His temple, Even the Messenger of the covenant, In whom you delight. Behold, He is coming,” Says the Lord of hosts.“But who can endure the day of His coming? And who can stand when He appears? For He is like a refiner’s fire And like launderers’ soap.He will sit as a refiner and a purifier of silver; He will purify the sons of Levi, And purge them as gold and silver, That they may offer to the Lord An offering in righteousness.“Then the offering of Judah and Jerusalem Will be pleasant to the Lord, As in the days of old, As in former years.And I will come near you for judgment; I will be a swift witness Against sorcerers, Against adulterers, Against perjurers, Against those who exploit wage earners and widows and orphans, And against those who turn away an alien— Because they do not fear Me,” Says the Lord of hosts.“For I am the Lord, I do not change; Therefore you are not consumed, O sons of Jacob.Yet from the days of your fathers You have gone away from My ordinances And have not kept them. Return to Me, and I will return to you,” Says the Lord of hosts. “But you said, ‘In what way shall we return?’ - Malachi 3:1-7 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Malachi3:1-7&version=NKJV

The entire chapter so far is talking about God not changing his righteous standards.



Clearly there are at least two: one the correct way by using the context to determine what it's referring to, and one the incorrect way, by just taking it completely out of context and insisting that it means woodenly literally that God does not change in any way whatsoever, despite countless other scriptures that show that He DOES change, ESPECIALLY verses dealing with His incarnation.



Yes, I know what it says. Stamping your foot and repeating yourself isn't going to convince me that you're right.



Actually, what it says is that God is righteous, and THAT's the reason that the sons of Jacob are not consumed.

His standard is consistent. He does not change in that way.

This is what happens when you rip a verse out of context, which I have provided above in this post.



You're lagging behind in the conversation. I've now addressed this twice, once in this post, and once previously.
I am not lagging I still believe God does not change because He said He does not change. God said it , I believe it, and that settles it.
 

JudgeRightly

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You sure jammed a whole lot in that verse that it does NOT say.

That's what it means, LN, whether it says it explicitly or not.

I change not therefore. The reason they weren’t consumed is that God does not change.Why aren’t the sons of Jacob consumed ? That would because as God said “I change not”.

You missed the semicolon. It's a new part of the sentence.
 

Derf

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I am not lagging I still believe God does not change because He said He does not change. God said it , I believe it, and that settles it.
When God said it, was He saying it before He said it, or only during the time He said it? What about after God said it? Is God continually in the process of saying "I change not"? What about before he made anyone else? Who was God speaking to when He was continuously saying "I change not"? If God is always and has always and will always be saying "I change not", how does He have the time to say anything else?
 

Leatherneck

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When God said it, was He saying it before He said it, or only during the time He said it? What about after God said it? Is God continually in the process of saying "I change not"? What about before he made anyone else? Who was God speaking to when He was continuously saying "I change not"? If God is always and has always and will always be saying "I change not", how does He have the time to say anything else?
I would believe as God He only had to say it once.
 

Leatherneck

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No, you don't.



Clearly, you don't.
That's what it means, LN, whether it says it explicitly or not.



You missed the semicolon. It's a new part of the sentence.
Lol, the semi colon Locks in “ I change not”by separating “I change not” from not consumed. Their not consumed because God does not change.English 101.a semi colon is used to join two independent clauses. Use a semicolon to join two related independent clauses. I change not/ not consumed. It isn’t rocket science.
 

Derf

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Lol, the semi colon Locks in “ I change not”by separating “I change not” from not consumed. Their not consumed because God does not change.English 101.a semi colon is used to join two independent clauses. Use a semicolon to join two related independent clauses. I change not/ not consumed. It isn’t rocket science.
That’s what JR was trying to tell you. The two parts are related. God says he will not change in this way: “that I would consume you after I promised not to consume you.”
 

Leatherneck

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Well, God did say to “get wisdom”.
philosophy is’t wisdom according to scripture, but it is a good way to become confused and ruined to God’s wisdom.
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Col 2:8 - Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
 

JudgeRightly

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Of course they are related God did not consume them because He does NOT change.

Just because God cannot change in ONE way doesn't mean He cannot change in ANY way.

Jesus (God) became a man. That's a change.
Jesus (God) increased in wisdom. That's a change.
Jesus (God) humbled Himself and became obedient. That's a change.

That's three examples FROM SCRIPTURE that show God changing in DRASTIC and UNDENIABLE WAYS, LN!

So either God was lying, OR God did not mean "I change not [at all]."

God didn't lie, therefore, God is not immutable.
 
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