Mid Acts Disponsationalism

Mid Acts Disponsationalism


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Clete

Truth Smacker
Silver Subscriber
The Law is not bad Clete, even if it is against you.

You already that and I already responded to it.

Eating from that tree was disobedience. It has nothing to do with the Law.
It has everything to do with it but that's a topic for a different thread.

Do you remember what Jesus said about the Law and these two commandments?
Of course I do.

Do you know that God nailed the law to the cross? Why do you suppose He did that? What do you suppose you could possibly say to me that would convince me to take it down again?

Resting in Him,
Clete
 

Clete

Truth Smacker
Silver Subscriber
I looked into this years ago and I have been reading and studying the Bible for years. I have nothing against Clete or any Bible verse, including the ones he posted.

The problems we face in studying and interpreting the Bible are the result of carelessness, reading our own ideas into the text, and not considering every verse in scripture.

The problem isn't reading, studying, interpretation or our intentions. The difficulty comes from one's paradigm. Your paradigm colors every single thing you say, hear or read. Things like disagreements over interpretation or what one considers the plane reading of a text to be are disagreements over secondary issues. The real test of one's doctrine is whether it can withstand a rational (i.e. objective) analysis of its underlying paradigm. A process that most Christians have never done nor has it even occurred to them to do it.

This is a major reason why I am constantly imploring people on this website to make the argument rather than simply stating their position. Opinions are a dime a dozen and so are biblical interpretations that are not accompanied by sound reason.

My advice to you is to not come here expecting to convince anyone of anything but rather use TOL to test your metal. Iron sharpens iron.

Resting in Him,
Clete
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
If you think yourself a "True Believer" and a member of the
Body of Christ, wouldn't it be better to try and share the
Gospel with a homosexual or other sinner?
:up:

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

2 Corinthians 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
 

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
You already that and I already responded to it.


It has everything to do with it but that's a topic for a different thread.


Of course I do.

Do you know that God nailed the law to the cross? Why do you suppose He did that? What do you suppose you could possibly say to me that would convince me to take it down again?

Resting in Him,
Clete

I said the Bible says the Law is good. When you said the Law kills, does this in your mind mean the Law is not good or that the Law is bad? I have pointed out that Paul said the Law is not a cause of death. So these verses need to be understood in context.

Disobedience is wrong, including disobedience to the Law. But the Law did not come until Moses, long after Adam and Eve in the garden of eden.

Colossians 2:13-14 NASB. Yes. See also 1 Timothy 1:8-11 NASB.

So, the Law kills, but the Law is not a cause of death. See Romans 7:7-20 NASB. That is what we need to sort out.

Is it true that the Christian is one who obeys God's commands (in faith)? I believe yes (See Acts 15).

Is it true that what the Law is against God is against? Yes, for it is His (God's) Law (afterall).

The Law points out sin. But it is not the remedy for sin. Romans 8:3 NASB.

See also 1 John 3:4 NASB.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
That God is anyone's enemy right now is wrong on so many levels as the ground was leveled by the cross and it was we that were God's enemies not the other way around!

Romans 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

Romans 5:7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.

Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Romans 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Clete and others who take the same position as he, need to study reconciliation; what it means and what it accomplished!
 

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
The problem isn't reading, studying, interpretation or our intentions. The difficulty comes from one's paradigm. Your paradigm colors every single thing you say, hear or read. Things like disagreements over interpretation or what one considers the plane reading of a text to be are disagreements over secondary issues. The real test of one's doctrine is whether it can withstand a rational (i.e. objective) analysis of its underlying paradigm. A process that most Christians have never done nor has it even occurred to them to do it.

This is a major reason why I am constantly imploring people on this website to make the argument rather than simply stating their position. Opinions are a dime a dozen and so are biblical interpretations that are not accompanied by sound reason.

My advice to you is to not come here expecting to convince anyone of anything but rather use TOL to test your metal. Iron sharpens iron.

Resting in Him,
Clete

I simply would rather state facts (scripture; verses) that are being missed rather than argue opinions.

We need (and should be informed by) all of God's word.
 

Grosnick Marowbe

New member
Hall of Fame
That God is anyone's enemy right now is wrong on so many levels as the ground was leveled by the cross and it was we that were God's enemies not the other way around!

Romans 5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

Romans 5:7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.

Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Romans 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Clete and others who take the same position as he, need to study reconciliation; what it means and what it accomplished!

Amen.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
Clete wrote, "Homos can be saved by the same grace that can save a murders and child molesters and rapists and adulterers. "

How do you know those you listed above aren't already saved?

What is the gospel by which they are saved or can be saved?

Remember, we're talking about what's the nicest thing you can say to those you have labeled, is. We've seen what you believe that to be, but it goes against the word of reconciliation. When do you give anyone good news?
 
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Clete

Truth Smacker
Silver Subscriber
Whether they are saved or not is irrelevant. They are guilty of a crime and aught to be justly punished. And short of that, they and the behavior aught to have a healthy social stigma attached to it so that fewer people will be tempted to commit such crimes and therefore fewer people would be victimized by such crimes. That's the reason why God said to execute people who are guilty of such things so that there would be fewer criminals and fewer victims.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
Whether they are saved or not is irrelevant.
Spoken like a true Entyartite without a word of reconciliation for anyone you deem unfit for the gospel of the grace of God (which is everyone). You've forgotten just why it is we are here and how one is saved.
 

Clete

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Silver Subscriber
Spoken like a true Entyartite without a word of reconciliation for anyone you deem unfit for the gospel of the grace of God (which is everyone). You've forgotten just why it is we are here and how one is saved.

Bob Enyart is directly responsible for more people being saved than anyone else I know and that includes many former homosexuals. He has one of the most effective ministries I've ever come across especially when one considers how small a group of people make up the church he pastors.

You're taking out your butt about things and people you know nothing about.

This conversation is over.
 

Tambora

Get your armor ready!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
they and the behavior aught to have a healthy social stigma attached to it so that fewer people will be tempted to commit such crimes and therefore fewer people would be victimized by such crimes.
I like the way you talk.
:thumb:
 

Danoh

New member
Whether they are saved or not is irrelevant. They are guilty of a crime and aught to be justly punished. And short of that, they and the behavior aught to have a healthy social stigma attached to it so that fewer people will be tempted to commit such crimes and therefore fewer people would be victimized by such crimes. That's the reason why God said to execute people who are guilty of such things so that there would be fewer criminals and fewer victims.

As rampant as they were in Paul's day - way, way worse than even our worst today - I wonder why he focused on getting people saved while speaking of the ways of the lost as just that - their ways and the eternal punishment it would one day result in.

Your bigotry in your ignorance in this is impressive.

I don't like their ways either; but that is the coarse of this screwed up world God has called us to be longsuffering towards without compromising the Cross as it alone is the only solution; not more and more legislation.
 

Tambora

Get your armor ready!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Hold on just a doggone minute.

I think Clete is right on when he says that certain behaviors should be shamed PUBLICLY.
And it has nothing to do with their salvation.
 
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