Do you believe anyone has ever been saved by works, in all of time?
Mid Acts Disponsationalism
- Thread starter Bright Raven
- Start date
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
People had faith and works to remain in the promises, so that they could be saved by grace at the end.
I believe if a person is born again they are saved by grace through faith. That is, a born again believer is saved (already has salvation).
Yep!
Ephesians 2:8-9 Modern English Version (MEV)
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not of yourselves. It is the gift of God,
9 not of works, so that no one should boast.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Members of the Body of Christ already have salvation, indeed.
Amen Brother!
heir
TOL Subscriber
Pretty much, yep. His conversation is void of the gospel of Christ Philippians 1:27 KJV.
That's too bad as I believe this to be coming from the ministry of reconciliation:
Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
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heir
TOL Subscriber
Not true. Those who will be born again are not in the one Body. Their church, gospel, doctrine, day of atonement and inheritance are all different than that of the BoC.
heir
TOL Subscriber
Our apostle Paul never uses the term born again to describe members of the Body of Christ, but a new creature 2 Corinthians 5:17 KJV.
How can anyone deny that Israel had a covenant of works? How can anyone deny that the Jew who refused to follow the Law of Moses was cut off? I mean, even the most cursory reading of nearly any book in the Old Testament or even the Gospels can lead to no other conclusion.
God REQUIRED Jews to follow the Law. It was REQUIRED. Following the Law is what made you a Jew, its what made you a member of God's covenant people. That is not a covenant of grace but a covenant of law. They are not the same thing!
Resting in Him,
Clete
God REQUIRED Jews to follow the Law. It was REQUIRED. Following the Law is what made you a Jew, its what made you a member of God's covenant people. That is not a covenant of grace but a covenant of law. They are not the same thing!
Resting in Him,
Clete
I can deny it! I'd be wrong, but I could deny it.
lifeisgood
New member
Why do we make the Gospel so difficult to understand.
The Gospel of God, OT or NT, has always been Salvation through faith and faith alone in the sacrifice alone.
The OT saints believed the Sacrifice over the Altar (shadow of the Cross) for their salvation.
The NT saints believe the Sacrifice over the Cross (reality of the Altar) for their salvation.
OT saints did their doing because they had faith in the sacrifice over the Altar.
NT saints do their doing because we have faith in the sacrifice over the Cross.
Why is this so difficult to understand?
The 'terminology' we all use OT or NT might be different but the end result is the same.
OT/NT sinner have you heard the Gospel?
OT/NT sinner are you convicted by it?
OT/NT sinner do the doing, believe, and thou shalt be saved.
Yes, I do understand that OT saints did not use the same terminology as we do today, however, the definitions are exactly the same, otherwise, no one in the OT would have been saved.
No one in OT times were saved because they brought the lamb to be slaughtered.
They were saved because they believed that the sacrificed lamb took their placed over the Altar.
Salvation has always been by faith alone, in the sacrifice alone, through the work of the sacrifice alone.
The Gospel of God, OT or NT, has always been Salvation through faith and faith alone in the sacrifice alone.
The OT saints believed the Sacrifice over the Altar (shadow of the Cross) for their salvation.
The NT saints believe the Sacrifice over the Cross (reality of the Altar) for their salvation.
OT saints did their doing because they had faith in the sacrifice over the Altar.
NT saints do their doing because we have faith in the sacrifice over the Cross.
Why is this so difficult to understand?
The 'terminology' we all use OT or NT might be different but the end result is the same.
OT/NT sinner have you heard the Gospel?
OT/NT sinner are you convicted by it?
OT/NT sinner do the doing, believe, and thou shalt be saved.
Yes, I do understand that OT saints did not use the same terminology as we do today, however, the definitions are exactly the same, otherwise, no one in the OT would have been saved.
No one in OT times were saved because they brought the lamb to be slaughtered.
They were saved because they believed that the sacrificed lamb took their placed over the Altar.
Salvation has always been by faith alone, in the sacrifice alone, through the work of the sacrifice alone.
But not per the rabbit hole you wish to lead this down; inadvertently, or otherwise.
Lol, sis - but there goes what you assert about those in Romans 2:17's "Thou art called a Jew," as being a reference to those Gentiles made first; partaker's of Israel's promise, then; members of the Body.
Lol - "There goes ma bey-beh, movin on, down the line...Wonder where...where she is bound?"
heir
TOL Subscriber
No, brother, but keep singing.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Danoh the Great,
The Romans would have been no different than a Jew in a synagogue that Paul visited who believed Paul's message that Jesus is the Christ.
They would have been in the Olive Tree.
But, they still needed the gospel of Christ to enter the Body.
I concur with sister heir, 103.9%.
heir
TOL Subscriber
You're in denial about Mr. Enyart.
I strive for the faith of the gospel, that it may impart grace unto the hearers. Bob doesn't even acknowledge that the gospel of Christ is as Paul declares in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV. He makes no mention of it anywhere in his writings and adds requirements for salvation to what he calls "the gospel". That's what makes him a gospel perverter (a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump). His communication is corrupt. His conversation not becoming the gospel of Christ. He upholds gospel perverters, too(WOTM). He is not in line with God and His will concerning all men. His "ministry" (if he's even saved) will go up in smoke.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
God did not require those under the law to keep the law for salvation:
"Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all" (Ro.4:16).
Perhaps you do not understand that if it takes "works" then it cannot be said to be of grace:
"Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt" (Ro.4:4).
Do you deny that the Jews who lived under the law were saved by "grace"?