Mid Acts Disponsationalism

[Clete]

The Bible says the Law is good.

I didn't say it wasn't good. The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil was good too but it also had a ministry of death. Genesis 2:17

Paul said the Law is not a cause of death. Sin is, not the Law.

Paul said explicitly that he would not have known sin if not for the Law and that the Law was against us.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire. For apart from the law sin was dead. 9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was to bring life, I found to bring death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it killed me. 12 Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.

Colossians 2:14 having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.​

The great commandment in the Law is to love God. And the second that is like it is to love your neighbor. The entire Law is about love of God and your neighbor.

Two commandments that you cannot follow.

It was right to love God before the Law. It was right to love your neighbor before the Law. Right is not right because the Law says to do it. Evil is not evil because the Law prohibits it. Quite the reverse! You DO NOT need the Law! You need God! For the law kills but the Spirit brings life!

2 Cor. 3:4 And we have such trust through Christ toward God. 5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God, 6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

7 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.​

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Tambora]

The Bible says the Law is good. Paul said the Law is not a cause of death. Sin is, not the Law.

The great commandment in the Law is to love God. And the second that is like it is to love your neighbor. The entire Law is about love of God and your neighbor.

1 Corinthians 15 KJV
(56) The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

 

[Danoh]

It says to love God and to love your neighbor but that is not is not what its "about".

The Law's ministry is death, not life. Romans 7

Resting in Him,
Clete

Exactly!

The Law says to love God and to love your neighbor within a setting similar in nature to that of telling a child not to eat from the cookie jar as doing so will spoil [take captive] its appetite.

What does the little tyke do because its sin in Adam in its members revives to rebel against said commandment?

The little tyke dies to obeying. Instead; transgressing said commandment.

Romans 3:

19. Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
20. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Romans 5:

12. Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
13. [For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam’s transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

Though prior to the giving of the Law sin was not imputed because there was no Law to impute it, nevertheless, all had sinned in Adam, and so, death passed upon all men, as evidence that all have sinned, in Adam.

20. Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:

The Law's introduction into this already worst case scenario, only magnifying its reality further.

This towards the intent:

21. That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[Clete]

The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil

1. The Tree is the ministry of death. Gen 2:17
2. Do not partake of the Tree. Gen. 2:17
3. In the day you partake of the Tree, you will die. Gen. 2:17
4. By the Tree is the knowledge of sin. Gen. 3:22
5. The Tree brought the offense. Rom. 5:17
6. The Tree’s curse died on the cross. Rom 5:18-19
7. The Tree of Life is in the new heaven, but not the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. Ezek. 31:15; Rev. 22:14

The Law

1. The law is the ministry of death. 2 Cor. 3:7
2. Do not partake of the law. Rom. 7:6; 10:4
3. In the day you partake of the law, you will die. Rom. 7:9
4. By the law is the knowledge of sin. Rom. 3:20; 7:7
5. The law made the offense abound. Rom. 5:20
6. The law was nailed to the cross. Col. 2:13-14, 16
7. The Law of the Spirit is in the new heaven, but not the Law of Death. Rom. 8:2; 7:6

Resting in Him,
Clete

P.S. Thank you Bob Enyart!

 

[Jacob]

I didn't say it wasn't good. The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil was good too but it also had a ministry of death. Genesis 2:17


Paul said explicitly that he would not have known sin if not for the Law and that the Law was against us.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire. For apart from the law sin was dead. 9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was to bring life, I found to bring death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it killed me. 12 Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.

Colossians 2:14 having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.​

Two commandments that you cannot follow.

It was right to love God before the Law. It was right to love your neighbor before the Law. Right is not right because the Law says to do it. Evil is not evil because the Law prohibits it. Quite the reverse! You DO NOT need the Law! You need God! For the law kills but the Spirit brings life!

2 Cor. 3:4 And we have such trust through Christ toward God. 5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God, 6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

7 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.​

Resting in Him,
Clete

The Law is not bad Clete, even if it is against you.

Eating from that tree was disobedience. It has nothing to do with the Law.

Do you remember what Jesus said about the Law and these two commandments?

 

[Jacob]

1 Corinthians 15 KJV
(56) The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

Do you know what this verse means?

 

[glorydaz]

Do you know what this verse means?

Untell, you think you know what others don't, but you don't know what others know. If you want to remain unteachable, then continue on your merry way, but don't, for a minute, think you are a teacher.

 

[Jacob]

Untell, you think you know what others don't, but you don't know what others know. If you want to remain unteachable, then continue on your merry way, but don't, for a minute, think you are a teacher.

I know what the scriptures say. I know that I am not to judge the Law.

 

[Danoh]

I know what the scriptures say. I know that I am not to judge the Law.

You're on the wrong forum - Mid-Acts does not judge the Law anymore than the Apostle Paul did.

That is just your reading into our words from your non Mid-Acts perspective.

I've yet to read a consistent Mid-Actser who denies Romans 3: 31's "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law."

 

[Jacob]

You're on the wrong forum - Mid-Acts does not judge the Law anymore than the Apostle Paul did.

That is just your reading into our words from your non Mid-Acts perspective.

I've yet to read a consistent Mid-Actser who denies Romans 3: 31's "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law."

I have addressed a poster from what I know of scripture and was told by another poster to not think of myself as a teacher. That is what I get for going with what scripture says.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I have addressed a poster from what I know of scripture and was told by another poster to not think of myself as a teacher. That is what I get for going with what scripture says.

TOL has a minimal amount of true teachers. Most are in need of teaching. Some ought not to be teaching their false doctrine.
Perhaps, most shouldn't be.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Heir, Glorydaz, and Tam are a few of the "Good teachers" around here.

 

[Jacob]

TOL has a minimal amount of true teachers. Most are in need of teaching. Some ought not to be teaching their false doctrine.
Perhaps, most shouldn't be.

I have expressed myself without any Ill intent. That is all.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

There's a myriad of posters who are ignorant of the true Gospel, around here.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I have expressed myself without any Ill intent. That is all.

That's fair.

 

[glorydaz]

I have addressed a poster from what I know of scripture and was told by another poster to not think of myself as a teacher. That is what I get for going with what scripture says.

But you don't go with what the scripture says. Clete told you to look in Romans 7 which says just the opposite of what you claimed. Did you look there? If you did, you clearly missed it.....proving you are unteachable.

 

[heir]

I don't recall having started such a thread, nor is there any thread currently in existence on this website. Not that I deny starting the thread. I'm sure I did! The point is that, if I did, it must have been years ago and it has since been wiped from the site.
It clearly hasn't been wiped from your memory though! I must have made quite an impression. Why don't you tell me what your recollection is of what I said before and I'll tell you if I have remained steadfast.

Clete

The premise of the thread was the same as this:

What is the most loving thing you can say to a homo?

You make me sick! I want to vomit when you get near me or my family! You deserve execution you filthy discusting perfert! God is your enemy and so am I! Get away from me! You don't deserve to see God's sun light reflecting off my face!


Or something along those lines.

And no I am not kidding.

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Jacob]

But you don't go with what the scripture says. Clete told you to look in Romans 7 which says just the opposite of what you claimed. Did you look there? If you did, you clearly missed it.....proving you are unteachable.

I looked into this years ago and I have been reading and studying the Bible for years. I have nothing against Clete or any Bible verse, including the ones he posted.

The problems we face in studying and interpreting the Bible are the result of carelessness, reading our own ideas into the text, and not considering every verse in scripture.

 

[glorydaz]

I looked into this years ago and I have been reading and studying the Bible for years. I have nothing against Clete or any Bible verse, including the ones he posted.

The problems we face in studying and interpreting the Bible are the result of carelessness, reading our own ideas into the text, and not considering every verse in scripture.

But, Untell, that is exactly your problem. You are careless when you read a text, and flat out don't see what a verse is saying. You merely jump as quickly as you can to some other verse that may or may not have a thing to do with the first one...or even the question you posed. Why didn't you address the scripture Clete gave you from Romans 7? It was very clear and you did not heed it. I have no doubt your intentions are good....you seem very sincere. But, you simply do not give due diligence to what is being presented to you.

 

[Jacob]

I defended my position with the scripture that supports it from the attack against it that I experienced in the past. I am not against the scripture just what it is being used against, scripture.

You might be well versed in rhetoric, but turning a truth against the person who revealed it is for combat, not teaching.