ECT How alone is Grace alone salvation?

[musterion]

The reformed hate the idea of once saved always saved, or eternal security (the way non-Calvinists define it) because it implies the person must know they are what the Reformed think of as Elect...something which they do not believe can be infallibly known this side of death. It's a form of presumption to claim E.S....more Roman baggage they never dumped.

That is also why they rely on works to prove their hoped for election, and hate those who say works have nothing to do with it. Yes, they give much lip service to "faith alone" but it's just that, lip service. Lordship Salvation proves this.

 

[glorydaz]

In verse 8 James says what the essential thing is:

"Yes indeed, it is good when you obey the royal law as found in the Scriptures: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” (James 2:8)

If this were even possible, then Jesus didn't need to come. People can claim to love their neighbor as they do themselves, but is it possible?

Is it possible to be perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect?

Well, people can claim that "perfect" doesn't actually mean perfect. People can claim all sorts of things, but until the love of God has been shed abroad on our heart by the Holy Spirit, we only fool ourselves when we claim either of those.

Romans 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.​

 

[Nang]

Nang,

I looked back through the posts and you have received [MENTION=13959]meshak[/MENTION] 's likes. I am utterly shamed and my error has been exposed. We all know how "biblically accurate" (I'm dodging lightning as I type this) Meshak is. I'm regretful I didn't see it.

# Congratulations on a job well undone

I take note, and I hope others will also notice, that your posts almost always name posters in your continual attempt and delight, to divide them from each other.

Why?

Why is your first priority to cause division?

 

[Nang]

The reformed hate the idea of once saved always saved, or eternal security (the way non-Calvinists define it) because it implies the person must know they are what the Reformed think of as Elect...something which they do not believe can be infallibly known this side of death. It's a form of presumption to claim E.S....more Roman baggage they never dumped.

Bah . . what a :dunce:

That is also why they rely on works to prove their hoped for election, and hate those who say works have nothing to do with it. Yes, they give much lip service to "faith alone" but it's just that, lip service. Lordship Salvation proves this.

Bah . . . what ignorance of Christian church history. :dunce:

 

[glorydaz]

Your error is considering repentance and obedience to be human good works

Rather, both should be recognized as being fruits of the Holy Spirit.

Christians will evidence the presence of the indwelling Holy Spirit by repenting of sin, and will choose to serve the righteousness of God through practicing a holy and obedient lifestyle . . not motivated to earn merit with God, but to bring glory to God.

Anyone who denies the importance of repentance and obedience, and refuses to manifest any fruits of the Holy Spirit, is denying God His due.

You're contradicting yourself, and taking credit as though they were your "fruits".

And why aren't they listed under the fruit of the Spirit?
Where is repentance and obedience on this list?

Galatians 5:22-23
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.​

 

[Nang]

Publically, I need to thank you and I think this thread appropriate:

The Lord Jesus Christ has taught me, through you 1) To cherish His name more than commonly (good reminder for all of us) 2) that you nor I can stop Jesus from shining and resting in Him is a good place to be (Mary/Martha parable/real-life lesson). Mary was obnoxious I think you taught me that. She chose the better thing. Thank you for teaching me that. 3) Grace is grace, and I cannot earn it. Again. That had to be Christ in you, frankly. He is the fruit. I've seen Him in you. I couldn't remember if I said this publically before, but the debt remains outstanding and the confrontation of it left an indelible impression on my soul. Let me know where to send the check, but lest your reward be only earthly, thanks. If not, at least you could invest it for me in both heavenly and earthly stocks. -Lon

If John W is truly filled with the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ, and loves all the Elect children redeemed by the Lord Jesus Christ, AS CHRIST TRULY LOVES THOSE HE DIED FOR, and if John W possesses a power of a saving witness of such Gospel . . does he continually and unrepentantly produce such a hateful, filthy mouth, mind, and heart that curses and condemns faithful Christians day in and day out?

I fear you have been deceived by a spirit, not from the Savior. . .

A good tree does not produce rotten fruit. John W posts only rottenness exclusively.

 

[Nang]

If this were even possible, then Jesus didn't need to come. People can claim to love their neighbor as they do themselves, but is it possible?

Is it possible to be perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect?

Well, people can claim that "perfect" doesn't actually mean perfect. People can claim all sorts of things, but until the love of God has been shed abroad on our heart by the Holy Spirit, we only fool ourselves when we claim either of those.

Romans 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.​

MADists do not show love or kindness or respect to any but only those of their cult . . and it is not the love produced by the Holy Spirit by any stretch of the imagination or Scriptural standard.

 

[Nang]

Any soul, who fails to manifest the fruit of the Spirit as listed, prove to be unrepentant, unsaved, and still disobedient.

 

[musterion]

Bah . . what a :dunce:



Bah . . . what ignorance of Christian church history. :dunce:

Why do you post as your wife?

 

[musterion]

MADists do not show love or kindness or respect to any but only those of their cult . . and it is not the love produced by the Holy Spirit by any stretch of the imagination or Scriptural standard.

You didn't answer her questions.

 

[Nang]

Why do you post as your wife?

I am the wife of ReaderHalf. I post as me. I am Nang.

Those who bother to make friends with me privately, can verify that I post the words you see on this site.

My husband ReaderHalf was perma-banned by Knight in 2007, and was so disgusted with such an ignorant display of internet cultism (stupid, ungodly "smack-down,") he has refused since, to EVER post on TOL.

So you do not know what you are talking about . . .

 

[glorydaz]

MADists do not show love or kindness or respect to any but only those of their cult . . and it is not the love produced by the Holy Spirit by any stretch of the imagination or Scriptural standard.

Ha, tough love is the greatest love of all.

Instead of responding to what I said, you turned and pointed your finger at others.

Are you suggesting you manifest more love than others?

 

[glorydaz]

Any soul, who fails to manifest the fruit of the Spirit as listed, prove to be unrepentant, unsaved, and still disobedient.

I can only assume by your evasion that you don't want to admit you made a foolish declaration.

 

[glorydaz]

I am the wife of ReaderHalf. I post as me. I am Nang.

Those who bother to make friends with me privately, can verify that I post the words you see on this site.

My husband ReaderHalf was perma-banned by Knight in 2007, and was so disgusted with such an ignorant display of internet cultism (stupid, ungodly "smack-down,") he has refused since, to EVER post on TOL.

So you do not know what you are talking about . . .

I'm surprised he lets you come on such an ungodly site. What kind of a husband is he? :doh:

 

[Danoh]

MADists do not show love or kindness or respect to any but only those of their cult . . and it is not the love produced by the Holy Spirit by any stretch of the imagination or Scriptural standard.

You conclude your above about the many who hold to one of the various forms of Mid-Acts throughout the world, based on your dealings with one small group on a forum - even all those who hold to one form of Mid-Acts or another on TOL do not treat you as you assert all on here do.

Consider that you are being as one-sided towards all MADs by that, as you are accusing ALL of being towards you.

 

[Lon]

A good tree does not produce rotten fruit. John W posts only rottenness exclusively.

I'm never sure TOL allows for us to see that. John has been abrasive with me. He was abrasive when he told me to honor the Lord Jesus Christ with better distinction than "Jesus." I reminded him that the gospel accounts say "Jesus" all over the place but he reminded me, and not very nicely, that He is "My Lord, Savior, Master, Great God and Savior." He wasn't nice about it. The fruit of the Spirit is Love, Joy, Peace, Patience, Kindness, Goodness, Gentleness, long-suffering, and self-control. Regarding this matter, John W gave me patience, definitely long-suffering through a thread on it with me. John's fruit comes in a hard shell. I understand others cannot crack that kind of fruit. I simply thank him for his fruit, specifically toward me.

 

[Lon]

I fear you have been deceived by a spirit, not from the Savior. . .

A good tree does not produce rotten fruit. John W posts only rottenness exclusively.

I've noticed the difficulty between you and he, Tet and he, Meshak and he. Fruit is hard to see in any of those discussions. Sometimes, I just think TOL allows big horned sheep to bump heads. Goats have horns, sheep have horns, and I'd wonder after a couple of huge battles if the other didn't think 'goat' walking away. :idunno: I'm trying to be gracious to all who have had input into my life. As such, you've bumped my head hard in the past too. In lieu, thank you as well for helping me see clearly in traversing one place toward Reformed theology, for giving me appropriate if hard-headed redirection (like here for instance) and for calling me a brother. I will have to face heat, probably, from the other side now too, but I think love is like that: It takes risks even when it might get heat for it. Love -Lon and thank you also.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

John has been abrasive with me. He was abrasive when he told me to honor the Lord Jesus Christ with better distinction than "Jesus." I reminded him that the gospel accounts say "Jesus" all over the place but he reminded me, and not very nicely, that He is "My Lord, Savior, Master, Great God and Savior." He wasn't nice about it.

Yes, in the narratives the word "Jesus" is used as His name. But when referring to Him outside of the narratives this is how He should be addressed by Christians:

"For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ" (Phil.3:20).​

Please consider His words here:

"Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am" (Jn.13:13).​

 

[Tambora]

MADists do not show love or kindness or respect to any but only those of their cult

False.

 

[Tambora]

I take great comfort that my sin is no longer in my account, but His.

-Lon

AMEN!