Church and believers are not to judge, God and Christ will judge.

[Right Divider]

I want to know what "you" believe. Is loving God a work or not? Can we be saved by faith without loving God.

Based on what you are saying I would conclude that we do not have to love God, it's "not required" according to you. If it's not required then we don't have to do it.

That is what the Bible says.

Can anyone say, "I don't love God" but I will still have eternal life because I am saved through faith?

I don't think anyone that is saved does not love God, but it is not a requirement per the Bible.

You've lost yourself in the wonderland of hypotheticals.

Come back to earth Dave.

Ephesians 2:8 For by [God's] grace you are saved through [your] faith [in Christ]; and that not of yourselves: it [salvation] is the gift of God: 9 Not of [your] works, lest any man should boast.

Is faith in Ephesians a work?

No. You're becoming just as bad as you were in the flat earth thread.

Rom 4:5 (AKJV/PCE)​

(4:5) But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.​

Does works here mean "Jewish ceremonial law" only and not the Ten Commandments?

The Ten Commandments are simply a distillation of the whole law.

Do you think that they are somehow disconnected?

 

[DFT_Dave]

What Jesus taught

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

This was the message to both Jews and Gentiles.

Jesus nullifies ceremonial law because he was the Lamb of God, no more lambs or sacrifices needed, which is why the Temple was destroyed. Jesus did not nullify the Ten Commandments because through it we know what sin is. What sin is will never change, but the means of salvation is no longer through the sacrifice of lambs on the alter in the temple but in the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross. Do we have to obey the Ten Commandments as Christians?

Romans 6:1 Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

If we are not to continue in sin then I think that means we should be living by the ten commandments.

--Dave

 

[Right Divider]

What Jesus taught

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

This is EXACTLY what happens when you TRY to take a passage excluded from the REST of scripture.

That is taking it OUT OF CONTEXT.

Jesus was born under the law and taught Israel the need to keep the law. It's just that simple.

Mark 16:16 (AKJV/PCE)​

(16:16) He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.​

Jesus said that THEY CANNOT be saved without being baptized.

If we are not to continue in sin then I think that means we should be living by the ten commandments.

The ten commandments were NOT given to gentiles.
The body of Christ is NOT under the law nor the ten C.

Exod 31:12-17 (AKJV/PCE)​

(31:12) ¶ And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, (31:13) Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it [is] a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that [ye] may know that I [am] the LORD that doth sanctify you. (31:14) Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it [is] holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth [any] work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. (31:15) Six days may work be done; but in the seventh [is] the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth [any] work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. (31:16) Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, [for] a perpetual covenant. (31:17) It [is] a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.​

Again I'll say, this thread is starting to sound just like you in the flat earth thread.

 

[Nick M]

The body of Christ is NOT under the law nor the ten C.

Or heaven would be empty.

 

[DFT_Dave]

The ten commandments were NOT given to gentiles. The body of Christ is NOT under the law nor the ten C.

Paul said the Gentiles have the law written on their heart and will be judged by it.
Romans 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another 16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Mark 16:16 (AKJV/PCE)(16:16) He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Jesus said that THEY CANNOT be saved without being baptized.

Paul believed in baptism.
Galatians 3:26 For you are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Colossians 2:11-15 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also you are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

Faith is not a work. We are not saved by baptism, but Jesus taught baptism and so did all of his disciples including Paul.

P.S. Baptism is not in the Mosaic Law, so when Jesus says to be baptized he is not saying you are saved thought faith and works of the law.

--Dave

 

[Nick M]

Romans 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another 16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

This proves you are wrong. He said the 10 Commandments were not given to us, and that is correct.

Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Colossians 2:11-15 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also you are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

There is a transition that is carried out in Acts of the Apostles. Peter baptized with water in chapter 10. And he also didn’t know any better at the time. Paul says we are baptized by the Holy Spirit into Christ and that is what he’s referring to.

 

[Right Divider]

Paul said the Gentiles have the law written on their heart and will be judged by it.
Romans 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another 16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

It's so cute when your response has nothing to do with what I said.

None of that has anything to do with the 10 commandments.

Your "point" has no point.

Again, READ THE BIBLE.

Exod 31:12-17 (AKJV/PCE)​

(31:12) ¶ And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, (31:13) Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it [is] a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that [ye] may know that I [am] the LORD that doth sanctify you. (31:14) Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it [is] holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth [any] work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. (31:15) Six days may work be done; but in the seventh [is] the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth [any] work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. (31:16) Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, [for] a perpetual covenant. (31:17) It [is] a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.​

To whom does God tell Moses to speak?
To whom was the sabbath given.

Paul believed in baptism.
Galatians 3:26 For you are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Colossians 2:11-15 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also you are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

Water baptism is NOT a burial.

Faith is not a work.

Duh

We are not saved by baptism,

When we become part of the body of Christ was are BAPTIZED BY THE SPIRIT (i.e., no water).

1Cor 12:13 (AKJV/PCE)​

(12:13) For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether [we be] Jews or Gentiles, whether [we be] bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.​

but Jesus taught baptism

Jesus taught THE LAW.

Here are some other things that Jesus taught:

Matt 10:5 (AKJV/PCE)​

(10:5) These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into [any] city of the Samaritans enter ye not:​

​

Matt 15:24 (AKJV/PCE)​

(15:24) But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.​

​

Mark 6:7-8 (AKJV/PCE)​

(6:7) ¶ And he called [unto him] the twelve, and began to send them forth by two and two; and gave them power over unclean spirits; (6:8) And commanded them that they should take nothing for [their] journey, save a staff only; no scrip, no bread, no money in [their] purse: ​

and so did all of his disciples including Paul.

You're lost and confused.

P.S. Baptism is not in the Mosaic Law,

Yes, it is.

Exod 29:4 (AKJV/PCE)​

(29:4) And Aaron and his sons thou shalt bring unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and shalt wash them with water. ​

​

Lev 14:8-9 (AKJV/PCE)​

(14:8) And he that is to be cleansed shall wash his clothes, and shave off all his hair, and wash himself in water, that he may be clean: and after that he shall come into the camp, and shall tarry abroad out of his tent seven days. (14:9) But it shall be on the seventh day, that he shall shave all his hair off his head and his beard and his eyebrows, even all his hair he shall shave off: and he shall wash his clothes, also he shall wash his flesh in water, and he shall be clean.​

​

Lev 16:24 (AKJV/PCE)​

(16:24) And he shall wash his flesh with water in the holy place, and put on his garments, and come forth, and offer his burnt offering, and the burnt offering of the people, and make an atonement for himself, and for the people.​

This is why Hebrews says this:

Heb 6:2 (AKJV/PCE)​

(6:2) Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.​

so when Jesus says to be baptized he is not say you are saved thought faith and works of the law.

Jesus was a minister of the circumcision:

Rom 15:8 (AKJV/PCE)​

(15:8) Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises [made] unto the fathers:​

​

The earth is NOT flat Dave.

 

[Nick M]

This proves you are wrong. He said the 10 Commandments were not given to us, and that is correct.

Even street evangelist Ray Comfort says this all the time. It’s a tangent but he points out to atheists “have you noticed your conscious matches the 10 Commandments.?” And actually often they admit it.

 

[DFT_Dave]

This proves you are wrong. He said the 10 Commandments were not given to us, and that is correct.

Does the Gentiles "have not the law" mean the Mosaic law?
If it does then this is how we are to understand Romans 2:14-16

"For when the Gentiles, which have not the law [of Moses], do by nature the things contained in the law [of Moses], these, having not the law [written on stone tablets], are a law unto themselves: 15 Which shew the work of the law [of Moses written on stone tablets are also] written in their hearts."

If we say "the law written on our hearts" is not the Mosaic Law then what law is it? Are the Ten Commandment not moral law?

Written on our hearts does not mean word for word, but in essence, 'the most significant element, quality, or aspect of a thing or person."

Paul says we are baptized by the Holy Spirit into Christ and that is what he’s referring to.

Paul believed in water baptism

Romans 6:3 Know you not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? 4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Galatians 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Colossians 2:11-15 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also you are risen with him through the faith

These verses do not say "baptized by the Holy Spirit". These verses mean baptized in water.

--Dave