Lol, scholarly thinking in action right before our eyes: thanks for the great example, ignoring what was actually said, pretending the scripture refutes the straw-man you have made up in your mind and attributed to me, and then going on to pretend you understand the scripture. You only made my point for me by posting the verse numbers you have referenced. You did not understand what I said. You immediately assume that because you believe they speak of the Father then they must comply with what you believe: and thus you believe they are speaking of the Father when they use the term Yah, but again, please hear this time: that is only your assumption because so-called scholars have told you it is so, and Paul refutes you and the so-called scholars, if only you and they would hear and understand what Paul says and where he says it. And just as I said of the so-called scholars, you also neither understand nor believe Paul who expounds Yah in his writings by quoting from the Tanach.
Christ name is
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Lol, scholarly thinking in action right before our eyes: thanks for the great example, ignoring what was actually said, pretending the scripture refutes the straw-man you have made up in your mind and attributed to me, and then going on to pretend you understand the scripture. You only made my point for me by posting the verse numbers you have referenced. You did not understand what I said. You immediately assume that because you believe they speak of the Father then they must comply with what you believe: and thus you believe they are speaking of the Father when they use the term Yah, but again, please hear this time: that is only your assumption because so-called scholars have told you it is so, and Paul refutes you and the so-called scholars, if only you and they would hear and understand what Paul says and where he says it. And just as I said of the so-called scholars, you also neither understand nor believe Paul who expounds Yah in his writings by quoting from the Tanach.
Who told you all that it was okay to shorten the Name of the Father to "Yah"? Do you suppose that is what Moses did with the name of the Father? And the Psalmists? And Isaiah? It appears you all have made a faulty assumption concerning the usage of the name Yah in the scripture. Paul explains it and boldly proclaims just WHO exactly Yah is by quoting from various Tanach passages which can really only be understood one way by the contexts. Yah is ever in the bosom of the Father, (at the right hand side).
It does not matter what the "majority of scholars" believe or agree upon when they cannot even agree on the writings of Paul, (and if they actually understood what he says they would already have understood this also).
Psalm 68:1-18
1 Elohim arises, His enemies are scattered: and those who hate Him flee before Him!
2 As smoke is driven away, You drive them away; as wax melts before the fire, the wicked perish before Elohim.
3 But the righteous are glad, they exult before Elohim; and they rejoice with gladness.
4 Sing to Elohim, sing praises to His name: raise up a highway for He Who rides through the deserts, and exult before Him, His name is Yah.
5 A chieftain-leader [stepfather] to orphans, (John 14:18 [ορφανους]) and an Advocate (1 John 2:1) of widows, this is Elohim in His holy habitation.
6 Elohim makes a home for the lonely, (John 14:2) He brings out to prosperity those who are bound with chains: (Isaiah 61:1, Luke 4:18) only the rebellious shall dwell in a dry-arid land.
7 O Elohim, when You went out before Your people, when You stepped through the wilderness: (Pause)
8 The earth shook, and the heavens dropped before Elohim; this Sinai shook before Elohim, the Elohim of Yisrael.
9 You, O Elohim, sent a shower of plenty: You confirmed Your inheritance when it was weary.
10 Your flock dwelt therein, You provided from Your goodness for the poor, O Elohim.
11 YHWH gave the Word, and the women who proclaimed it were a great company.
12 Kings of armies fled in haste, and she who remained at home divided the spoil.
13 Though you have lien between hooks, (or dwelt among lips), Wings of a dove, overlaid with silver, and feathers overlaid with bright gold!
14 When the Almighty scattered kings therein, it snowed in Tsalmon.
15 A hill of Elohim is the hill of Bashan; a hill of heights is the hill of Bashan:
16 O high hills, why should you envy the mount which Elohim has desired for His Seat? YHWH tabernacles therein continually.
17 The chariots of Elohim are two myriads and thousands of thousands: Adoni came from Sinai, into the Holy Sanctuary.
18 You have ascended on High, You have led captivity captive, You have apportioned gifts among men: Yea, that even among those having been turned away, Yah Elohim might dwell. Ephesians 4:8
(Reply #9).
Ephesians 4:4-15
4 One body, and one Spirit, even as you also were called in one expectation of your calling:
5 One Master, one faith, one immersion:
6 One Elohim and Father of all, Who is over all, and through all, and in all.
7 But unto each one of us was the grace given according to the measure of the gift of Messiah.
8 Wherefore he says, "When he ascended on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men." Psalm 68:18
9 Moreover this, "He ascended", what is it but that he also descended into the lower parts of the earth?
10 He that descended is the same also that ascended far above all the heavens, that he might fill all things.
11 And he gave some to be apostles, and some to be prophets, and some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers:
12 For the perfecting of the holy ones, unto the work of ministering, unto the building up of the body of Messiah:
13 Until we all attain unto the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of Elohim, unto a full grown man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Messiah:
14 That we may no longer be babes, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, in craftiness, after the wiles of error:
15 But speaking truth in love, may grow up in all things into him who is the head, Messiah:
Paul quotes Psalm 68:18 and directly applies it to the Meshiah, the Son of Elohim: and Psalm 68:18 speaks of the Son of YHWH, that is by the plain text, Yah Elohim, the Word of YHWH Elohim Almighty, (Reply #41).
CherubRam
New member
You are special Epoisses.
CherubRam
New member
[FONT="]Yah.[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[h=4][FONT="]Exodus 23:21.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]Pay attention to him and listen to what he says. Do not rebel against him; he will not forgive your rebellion, since [/FONT][FONT="]my Name is in him.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][/h] [FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Yah is the short form of God’s personal name Yahwah, used about fifty time in the Old Testament.[/FONT]
[FONT="]Yah-wah / Yah-shua[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[h=4][FONT="]Psalm 68:4.[/FONT][FONT="] Sing to Elohiym, sing praise to His name, extol Him who rides on the clouds [/FONT][FONT="]His name is Yah [/FONT][FONT="]and rejoice before Him. [/FONT][/h] [h=4][FONT="]John 5:43.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]I have come in [/FONT][FONT="]my Father's name[/FONT][FONT="], and you do not accept me; but if someone else comes in his own name, you will accept him. [/FONT][/h] [FONT="]The best evidence is that his proper name was "y'shua". But Galileans always dropped their 'ayins', hence "y'shu" for which in the talmud many Jewish people use as an acronym meaning “may his name be blotted out”.[/FONT]
[FONT="]The name Jesus is an unknown word that was invented. In the NIV Exhaustive Concordance you will find the name Joshua along with the name Jesus. In English the name Joshua is pronounced Jah/ shoo/ ah. We do know as a matter of fact that “Jah” is for “Yah” in Hebrew and English.[/FONT]
[FONT="]The assignment of the vowels in Hebrew are arbitrary, in order to hide his real name. This is also true of God’s own personal name which is Yahwah. [/FONT]
[FONT="]The Orthodox Jews believe that it is their duty to conceal God’s personal name from the public. [/FONT]
[FONT="]So if you wish to use the Messiah’s real name in English that would be “Yahshua.” [/FONT]
[h=4][FONT="]Numbers 13:16[/FONT][FONT="] (Moses gave Hoshea son of Nun the name Joshua.)[/FONT][/h] [FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Why did Moses give Hosea the name Joshua? (Yahshua) [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]I come in the name of Yahwah.[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="][FONT="]Psalm 118:26[/FONT][/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]Blessed is he who comes in the name of (the Lord / Yahwah.) From the house of (the Lord / Yahwah) we bless you. [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="][FONT="]Matthew 23:39[/FONT][/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of (the Lord / Yahwah.)’”[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="][FONT="]Luke 13:35[/FONT][/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]Look, your house is left to you desolate. I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of (the Lord / Yahwah.)’”[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[h=4][FONT="]Exodus 23:21.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]Pay attention to him and listen to what he says. Do not rebel against him; he will not forgive your rebellion, since [/FONT][FONT="]my Name is in him.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][/h] [FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Yah is the short form of God’s personal name Yahwah, used about fifty time in the Old Testament.[/FONT]
[FONT="]Yah-wah / Yah-shua[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[h=4][FONT="]Psalm 68:4.[/FONT][FONT="] Sing to Elohiym, sing praise to His name, extol Him who rides on the clouds [/FONT][FONT="]His name is Yah [/FONT][FONT="]and rejoice before Him. [/FONT][/h] [h=4][FONT="]John 5:43.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]I have come in [/FONT][FONT="]my Father's name[/FONT][FONT="], and you do not accept me; but if someone else comes in his own name, you will accept him. [/FONT][/h] [FONT="]The best evidence is that his proper name was "y'shua". But Galileans always dropped their 'ayins', hence "y'shu" for which in the talmud many Jewish people use as an acronym meaning “may his name be blotted out”.[/FONT]
[FONT="]The name Jesus is an unknown word that was invented. In the NIV Exhaustive Concordance you will find the name Joshua along with the name Jesus. In English the name Joshua is pronounced Jah/ shoo/ ah. We do know as a matter of fact that “Jah” is for “Yah” in Hebrew and English.[/FONT]
[FONT="]The assignment of the vowels in Hebrew are arbitrary, in order to hide his real name. This is also true of God’s own personal name which is Yahwah. [/FONT]
[FONT="]The Orthodox Jews believe that it is their duty to conceal God’s personal name from the public. [/FONT]
[FONT="]So if you wish to use the Messiah’s real name in English that would be “Yahshua.” [/FONT]
[h=4][FONT="]Numbers 13:16[/FONT][FONT="] (Moses gave Hoshea son of Nun the name Joshua.)[/FONT][/h] [FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Why did Moses give Hosea the name Joshua? (Yahshua) [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]I come in the name of Yahwah.[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="][FONT="]Psalm 118:26[/FONT][/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]Blessed is he who comes in the name of (the Lord / Yahwah.) From the house of (the Lord / Yahwah) we bless you. [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="][FONT="]Matthew 23:39[/FONT][/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of (the Lord / Yahwah.)’”[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="][FONT="]Luke 13:35[/FONT][/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]
[FONT="]Look, your house is left to you desolate. I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of (the Lord / Yahwah.)’”[/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="] [/FONT]
No, "Yah" is not a "short form" of the name of the Father, (the Tetragrammaton). That is rather your opinion based on what other so-called "scholars" have agreed upon and told you they believe. Why do you not answer my question? Who told you it is okay to shorten the Name of the Father? Would you appreciate it if someone came along and decided to shorten or abridge your name by half of what it is? No one gave you that permission but rather you assume it because the scholars whom you put your trust in have assumed it. Your assumption of the right to cut the name of the Father in half is therefore based on nothing more than the scholarly opinions of those who do the same and assume to themselves the right to do what they likewise do.
Moreover "Yah" is used many more times than what you have claimed because you and the so-called scholars do not take the Septuagint into account and how they rendered the Hebrew into Greek in many critical and explanatory places; and that is especially true in Genesis, where the Tetragrammaton appears to be in the Hebrew but does not get rendered as such into the Greek Septuagint: and it is that way not because they had "some other Hebrew text", or omitted anything, but because the waw-vav was originally used as a word separator and was read that way by the ancients in many places where it is not now read that way by so-called scholarship and because of what the Masoretes did to the modern Masoretic Hebrew text, (and Paul reveals this also by quoting from Isaiah 45 concerning Meshiah Yah). Moreover, because you and they do not understand the Nomina Sacra, (specifically Iota-Heta), and how and why the name of the Master, (Iota-Heta), is employed throughout the entire Greek NT, the error is hidden from both you and them.
CherubRam
New member
Yahwah means "Life Began." Yah is God's first name. God is "Life." There should be no letter or vowel to separate God's first and last name.
Yahshua means "Yah's Salvation." There should be no letter or vowel to separate Christ first and last name.
As you may know, the letters in the Greek and Hebrew are ran together in the text writings.
The best study I've read on that is in Young's Literal translation of the Bible. Having said that he misses out on the deeper truth due to his lack of understanding of time in relation to eternity.
First and last names now? :chuckle:
The name of the Father, (as far as a particular spelling), is the Tetragrammaton.
If you are addressing this to me then what I mentioned was how the waw-vav was originally used as a word separator, (as well as being used to form words). When it was read as a word separator it was either not read as part of a word at all or it was read as "and", "but", etc., between two words. The original Ashuri text from the time of Ezra did not have the modern final form letters, (sofits), and was written in scriptura continua, (no spaces, like the Koine Greek Uncial manuscripts which all of the more ancient Greek NT writings are written in). Because there was no spacing, and no final form letters, the waw-vav doubled as a word separator, (which made the Hebrew text very difficult to read and understand).
Example:
יהוהאלהים
Possible readings depending upon the surrounding context:
1) "YHWH Elohim" (יהוה אלהים)
2) "Yah the Elohim" (יה ו האלהים)
3) "Yah and the Elohim" (יה והאלהים)
UNTIL the Masorete Hebrew text came along it was up to the reader or translator(s) to determine where the waw-vav was being used as a word separator and where it was actually part of a word. And as I said previously, the way Paul understands the scripture, (and because he quotes from the Septuagint or something very similar to it), the name "Yah" is used many more times than what you have counted from the Masoretic text. This is especially crucial when it comes to places where your understanding could result in the possibility of a blasphemous statement concerning the Father: for instance, teaching that the Father "knows evil", (the question from the thread which I already referenced), such as the Masoretic text does in Genesis 3:22, while those who rendered the Hebrew text into the Greek Septuagint, (long before the Masorete text ever came about), clearly knew better than to make such an egregious error.
CherubRam
New member
Thank you very much Daqq, that is very useful. Do you have any more gems like that?
CherubRam
New member
Brown-Driver-Briggs
יָהּ50 [SIZE=+1]proper name, of deity[/SIZE] contracted from יהוה, first appears in early poems; Exodus 15:2 עָזִי וְזִמְרָת יָהּ My strength and song is Yah (cited Isaiah 12:2; Psalm 118:14), compare the poetic extract יָד עַל כֵּס יָהּ = hand to the throne of Yah Exodus 17:16 (E), the song of Hezekiah Isaiah 38:11 (repeated by dittography), (א)שׁ להבת יה (so read in preference to the ᵑ0 שַׁלְהֶבֶתְיָה) = flame of fire from Yah Songs 8:6; ביה יהוה Isaiah 26:4 (והיה sustained by Aq and the rhythmical movement, unless it be a mistake for שׁמו, compare Psalm 68:5), יה אלהים Psalm 68:19. Elsewhere יָהּ is used only in late Psalms, especially in the Hallels, in the phrase הַלֲלוּיָֿהּ praise ye Yah Psalm 104:35; Psalm 105:45; Psalm 106:1; Psalm 106:48; Psalm 111:1; Psalm 112:1; Psalm 113:1; Psalm 113:9; Psalm 115:18; Psalm 116:19; Psalm 117:2; Psalm 135:1; Psalm 135:3; Psalm 135:21; Psalm 146:1; Psalm 146:10; Psalm 147:1; Psalm 147:20; Psalm 148:1; Psalm 148:14; Psalm 149:1; Psalm 149:9; Psalm 150:1; Psalm 150:6, compare also יהלל יה Psalm 102:19 יהללו יה Psalm 115:17 תהלל יה Psalm 150:6 (see הלל); in variant reading other phrases Psalm 77:12; Psalm 89:9; Psalm 94:7; Psalm 94:12; Psalm 115:18; Psalm 118:5 (twice in verse); Psalm 118:17; Psalm 118:18; Psalm 118:19; Psalm 122:4; Psalm 130:3; Psalm 135:4.
Quoting the BDB, (or Thayer's, or Strong's, etc.), proves nothing because scripture context and scripture teaching and scripture doctrine is the only way to find what I have presented here, (and again, as already stated and even shown now multiple times, PAUL has the answers). You simply choose to believe man, (so-called scholars), over and above the teachings of the scripture because you either do not wish to spend your time to do your own investigation or perhaps do not feel you are capable of doing your own investigation, (but I know that everyone here, who can read and write, and obviously has online access to the internet, is capable enough).
Yep, here is another gem:
Exodus 6:2-3
2 And Elohim spoke to Moshe and said to him, I am YHWH.
3 And I appeared to Abraham, to Yitzchak, and to Yaakob, through El Shaddai: but by My name YHWH I was not known to them.
Now therefore you have a serious problem if indeed you care about scripture integrity: for according to the Masorete Hebrew text Abraham is made to be saying the Tetragrammaton name of the Father in manifold places, (including prayers which are supposed to be quotes of his own words in his prayers and supplications), but which cannot be true because those instances openly contradict the above statement. Moreover, understanding Genesis according to the Genesis Tablet Theory, which I believe to be true, only exacerbates and highlights this problem because it is clear that no one before Moshe knew the Tetragrammaton name of the Father: and yet the first five chapters, at the very least, are not written by Moshe but rather compiled by Moshe, and are the words from tablets of the ancients who came before him. Adam did not know the Tetragrammaton name of the Father, (neither could Chavah or Eve have known it, though she is made to say it in Gen 4:1, in the Masorete Hebrew text, and she attributes the birth of Cain to the Almighty, :nono
. Noah did not know the Tetragrammaton name of the Father, Abraham did not know the Tetragrammaton name of the Father, but those before Moshe did know the names Yah and El Shaddai who appeared to them and spoke to them: for the Father made appearances to them through, or by way of, El Shaddai, (and Yah Elohim, the Son, the Word, whom Abraham has a conversation with in Gen 15:1-17). The Father is non-corporeal Spirit: no man has seen or beheld the Father at any time.
CherubRam
New member
Yep, here is another gem:
Exodus 6:2-3
2 And Elohim spoke to Moshe and said to him, I am YHWH.
3 And I appeared to Abraham, to Yitzchak, and to Yaakob, through El Shaddai: but by My name YHWH I was not known to them.
Now therefore you have a serious problem if indeed you care about scripture integrity: for according to the Masorete Hebrew text Abraham is made to be saying the Tetragrammaton name of the Father in manifold places, (including prayers which are supposed to be quotes of his own words in his prayers and supplications), but which cannot be true because those instances openly contradict the above statement. Moreover, understanding Genesis according to the Genesis Tablet Theory, which I believe to be true, only exacerbates and highlights this problem because it is clear that no one before Moshe knew the Tetragrammaton name of the Father: and yet the first five chapters, at the very least, are not written by Moshe but rather compiled by Moshe, and are the words from tablets of the ancients who came before him. Adam did not know the Tetragrammaton name of the Father, (neither could Chavah or Eve have known it, though she is made to say it in Gen 4:1, in the Masorete Hebrew text, and she attributes the birth of Cain to the Almighty, :nono
#1. People do have more than one name.
#2. Adam and Eve knew God's name as Yahwah, but over time it was forgotten.
Exodus 6:3
I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as God Almighty, but by my name (the LORD / Yahwah) I did not make myself fully known to them.
Genesis 4:1. 4 Adam made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, “With the help of (the Lord / Yahwah) I have brought forth a man.”
:nono:
Genesis 4:1 LXX
1 αδαμ δε εγνω ευαν την γυναικα αυτου και συλλαβουσα ετεκεν τον καιν και ειπεν εκτησαμην ανθρωπον δια του θεου
1 And Adam knew Eve his wife, and conceiving she brought forth Kain, and said, I have acquired a man by way of the Elohim.
But since you choose not to hear; have a nice thread.
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CherubRam
New member
:nono:
Genesis 4:1 LXX
1 αδαμ δε εγνω ευαν την γυναικα αυτου και συλλαβουσα ετεκεν τον καιν και ειπεν εκτησαμην ανθρωπον δια του θεου
1 And Adam knew Eve his wife, and conceiving she brought forth Kain, and said, I have acquired a man by way of the Elohim.
But since you choose not to hear; have a nice thread.
I checked Gen 1:4 with two different sources and they show the name Yahwah.
As you can see, the name is Yahwah.
Masoretic Text
א וְהָאָדָם, יָדַע אֶת-חַוָּה אִשְׁתּוֹ; וַתַּהַר, וַתֵּלֶד אֶת-קַיִן, וַתֹּאמֶר, קָנִיתִי אִישׁ אֶת-יְהוָה.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
The One that IS.....................
The One that IS.....................
Maybe there is an aspect of 'God' that is wholly beyond name, thought, idea, words or concept
The Nameless One
This original reality is just Self-aware,...or is the essence of Awareness Itself.
Let us also reflect that the same universal God-presence dwells in all, if this 'Deity' is truly omnipresent, and it is 'God' in us, that allows for our own self-conscious existence, enabling us to say "I AM".
The One that IS.....................
Maybe there is an aspect of 'God' that is wholly beyond name, thought, idea, words or concept
The Nameless One
This original reality is just Self-aware,...or is the essence of Awareness Itself.
Let us also reflect that the same universal God-presence dwells in all, if this 'Deity' is truly omnipresent, and it is 'God' in us, that allows for our own self-conscious existence, enabling us to say "I AM".
So then you, like most, are in bondage to the Masoretes and their version of the text, which is essentially a running commentary because they themselves added the vowel pointing so as to lead you in the way. Too bad you choose the Masoretes over the Testimony of the Messiah and his apostles who quoted from the LXX as I did above: for the apostolic writings came about seven hundred to a thousand years before your Masorete fathers, that is, a whole millennium, and the LXX, especially the Torah, was around for about thirteen hundred years before the Masorete commentary which you put your faith and trust in. Therefore I said; have a nice thread. :chuckle:.
CherubRam
New member
The Septuagint is not a better text. I have the smarts to check on things when they do not match.