You are welcome to answer those question GT.
CAN YOU HAVE GOD'S GRACE WITHOUT GOD'S LAW?
- Thread starter 3rdAngel
- Start date
You are welcome to answer those question GT.
God's Truth
New member
I was wondering if you heard Jesus' actual speaking voice.
Yes, through His Word and also by dreams.
God's Truth
New member
Dreams?
Yes sometimes I have had dreams of the return and second coming of Jesus to to warn his people where ever they may be.
God's Truth
New member
In these dreams you hear the actual voice of Jesus speaking to you?
No, in some dreams I have had, I see and experience things that show me things. Some about me some about things to come to our world.
God's Truth
New member
Seems like pulling teeth though for you to answer.You said no, then you said in some. So you have heard Jesus' actual voice?
Yes I have already answered you, through His Word and dreams he teaches me.
God's Truth
New member
What does his voice sound like?
It is more like His presence that goes with His Word that is revealed to the understanding personally. Or a still small voice saying this is the way walk you in it.
God's Truth
New member
It doesn't sound like you have ever heard Jesus' actual voice.
Indeed I have and he who has loved me has blessed me more than I deserve.
God's Truth
New member
Why won't you describe his voice then if you have heard his actual voice?
I did, it is the Word of God that is revealed through the presence of His Spirit. What is it you do not understand? Do you hear voices you believe are from God?
God's Truth
New member
You keep condemning me and saying that it is Jesus' voice telling you.
You haven't heard Jesus' actual voice.
I don't hear VOICES that I believe are from God.
Jesus has spoken to me before, and you shouldn't speak of his voice telling you that I am condemned.
Dear friend, I do not judge you and neither do I condemn you. I have only ever shared God's Word with you. They are God's Words not my words. If you feel condemned by them, count it as a blessing as it is God's Spirit speaking with you as Gods Spirit is the Spirit of the Word of God *JOHN 6:63 and when he the Spirit of truth is come he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment *JOHN 16:8. If you feel condemned by the scriptures shared with you dear friend count it as a blessing as God is calling you to have a closer walk with him as they are God's Word's not my words. They are a blessing or a curse. They are a blessing to all those who believe and follow them and a curse to all those who reject them.
I told you already I hear His Voice and follow him through His Word. Those who do not hear His Voice to not follow him. *JOHN 10:26-27.
As posted earlier. I do not judge you or condemn you. I never have. I have only shared the scriptures with you that are not my words but God's Word. If we deny God's Word then God's Spirit will convince us of sin *JOHN 16:8; ROMANS 14:23 as they are God's Words not mine and we should believe and follow them *JOHN 10:26-27. If you feel condemned by the scriptures dear friend receive them as a blessing from God who is calling you through his Words. As it is written...
JOHN 10:26, My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me
and again...
JOHN 12:47-48 [47] If any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
[48], He that rejects me, and receives not my words, has one that judges him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
May you receive God's Word and be blessed. Ignoring them does not make them disappear.
God's Truth
New member
You are dishonest. You falsely claim God says something that He doesn’t say.
You haven’t heard God’s voice but pretend that you do.
You are the one condemning yourself by doing and saying what you do.
You have never heard his actual voice but you keep pretending you do.
You have proved yourself to be condemned and a liar.
Ok.... well back to the OP "CAN YOU HAVE GRACE WITHOUT GOD'S LAW?
Q1. WHAT IS GRACE FOR?
Grace is linked to mercy and peace from God the farther and from JESUS in love and truth.
2 JOHN 1:3 [3] Grace be with you, mercy, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.
ROMANS 1:5 [5], By whom we have received GRACE and apostleship, FOR OBEDIENCE TO THE FAITH among all nations, for his name.
We are to grow in God's GRACE and the KNOWLEDGE of our LORD JESUS CHRIST.
2 PETER 3:18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen. *2 PETER 1:2
We do this by seeking JESUS to be our teacher and continuing in God's WORD.
JOHN 14:26 [26], But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I have said to you.
JOHN 8:31-36
[31], Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed;
[32], And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
[33], They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how say you, You shall be made free?
[34], Jesus answered them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Whoever commits sin is the servant of sin.
[35], And the servant stays not in the house for ever: but the Son stays ever.
[36], If the Son therefore shall make you free, you shall be free indeed.
TITUS 2:11-12 [11], FOR THE GRACE OF GOD HAS APPEARED BRINGING SALVATION TO ALL MEN, [12], TEACHING US, THAT, DENYING UNGODLINESS AND WORLDLY JUSTS, WE SHOULD LIVE SOBERLY, RIGHTOUESLY AND GODLY IN THIS PRESENT WORLD
ROMANS 6:1-2, [1] What shall we say then? SHALL WE SIN [break any one of God's 10 commandments], THAT GRACE MAY ABOUND? God forbid. [2], How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
ROMANS 6:15-17 What then? SHALL WE SIN BECAUSE WE ARE NOT UNDER LAW BUT UNDER GRACE? GOD FORBID! [16] Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of SIN RESULTING IN DEATH, or of OBEDIENCE resulting in righteousness?
ROMANS 3:31 [31], Do we then make void the law through faith? GOD FORBID: YES, WE ESTABLISH THE LAW.
God's GRACE is given to us because all of us have sinned and are sinners (broken God's 10 Commandments) and the wages of SIN is death *ROMANS 3:23; ROMANS 5:12; ROMANS 6:23.
ROMANS 8:3-4
[3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: [4], THAT THE RIGHTOUESNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.
...................
WORD MEANINGS OF GRACE
GRACE GREEK WORD
χάρις; charis khar'-ece From G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude): - acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace (-ious), joy liberality, pleasure, thank (-s, -worthy).
GRACE HEBREW WORD
חן; chên khane From H2603; graciousness, that is, subjectively kindness, favor or objectively (beauty): - favour, grace (-ious), pleasant, precious, [well-] favoured.
.....................
CONCLUSION: Grace is unmerited favour leading to a change of behaviour. God's GRACE IS FOR OBEDIENCE to GOD'S WORD in those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW it to save us from our sins and the penalty of sin (death) and our sinful nature through our LORD JESUS CHRIST!
Hope this helps.
Q1. WHAT IS GRACE FOR?
Grace is linked to mercy and peace from God the farther and from JESUS in love and truth.
2 JOHN 1:3 [3] Grace be with you, mercy, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.
ROMANS 1:5 [5], By whom we have received GRACE and apostleship, FOR OBEDIENCE TO THE FAITH among all nations, for his name.
We are to grow in God's GRACE and the KNOWLEDGE of our LORD JESUS CHRIST.
2 PETER 3:18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen. *2 PETER 1:2
We do this by seeking JESUS to be our teacher and continuing in God's WORD.
JOHN 14:26 [26], But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I have said to you.
JOHN 8:31-36
[31], Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed;
[32], And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
[33], They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how say you, You shall be made free?
[34], Jesus answered them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Whoever commits sin is the servant of sin.
[35], And the servant stays not in the house for ever: but the Son stays ever.
[36], If the Son therefore shall make you free, you shall be free indeed.
TITUS 2:11-12 [11], FOR THE GRACE OF GOD HAS APPEARED BRINGING SALVATION TO ALL MEN, [12], TEACHING US, THAT, DENYING UNGODLINESS AND WORLDLY JUSTS, WE SHOULD LIVE SOBERLY, RIGHTOUESLY AND GODLY IN THIS PRESENT WORLD
ROMANS 6:1-2, [1] What shall we say then? SHALL WE SIN [break any one of God's 10 commandments], THAT GRACE MAY ABOUND? God forbid. [2], How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
ROMANS 6:15-17 What then? SHALL WE SIN BECAUSE WE ARE NOT UNDER LAW BUT UNDER GRACE? GOD FORBID! [16] Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of SIN RESULTING IN DEATH, or of OBEDIENCE resulting in righteousness?
ROMANS 3:31 [31], Do we then make void the law through faith? GOD FORBID: YES, WE ESTABLISH THE LAW.
God's GRACE is given to us because all of us have sinned and are sinners (broken God's 10 Commandments) and the wages of SIN is death *ROMANS 3:23; ROMANS 5:12; ROMANS 6:23.
ROMANS 8:3-4
[3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: [4], THAT THE RIGHTOUESNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.
...................
WORD MEANINGS OF GRACE
GRACE GREEK WORD
χάρις; charis khar'-ece From G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude): - acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace (-ious), joy liberality, pleasure, thank (-s, -worthy).
GRACE HEBREW WORD
חן; chên khane From H2603; graciousness, that is, subjectively kindness, favor or objectively (beauty): - favour, grace (-ious), pleasant, precious, [well-] favoured.
.....................
CONCLUSION: Grace is unmerited favour leading to a change of behaviour. God's GRACE IS FOR OBEDIENCE to GOD'S WORD in those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW it to save us from our sins and the penalty of sin (death) and our sinful nature through our LORD JESUS CHRIST!
Hope this helps.
Q2. CAN WE HAVE GOD'S GRACE IN THE NC WITHOUT GOD'S LAW? (Part 1/2)
From the scriptures it was shown God's GRACE is linked to MERCY and PEACE and TRUTH because all of us have SINNED and fall short of the Glory of GOD and the wages of sin is death. *ROMANS 3:23; ROMANS 5:12; ROMANS 6:23. But God so loved our world that he sent his only SON to die on our behalf for the sins that we all have committed in order to bring us back to GOD.
JOHN 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
ROMANS 8:3-4
[3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: [4], THAT THE RIGHTOUESNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.
God's GRACE is shown that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
ROMANS 5:6-10
[6], For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
[7], For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
[8], But God commends his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
[9], Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
[10], For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
This leads us to the next question.
CAN WE HAVE GOD'S GRACE IN THE NC WITHOUT GOD'S LAW?
If we are all SINNERS in need of a SAVIOUR if we do not KNOW that we are sinners will how can we see God's GRACE? Notice this next question from JESUS to the Pharisees that thought they were rightouess in God's eyes.
MATTHEW 7:12-13
[12], But when Jesus heard that, he said to them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick. [13], But go you and learn what that means, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
and again...
MATTHEW 5:20
[20], For I say to you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
JESUS came to magnify the LAW from the INSIDE OUT quoting MATTHEW 5:17-32 (thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *ISAIAH 42:21. This is to show that unless our RIGHTOUESNESS EXCEEDS the RIGHTOUESNESS of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. EVIL begins in the HEART.
BREAKING GOD's 10 COMMANDMENTS from the heart defile a man *MATTHEW 15:18-19. JESUS is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:27-28. JESUS magnified the LAW to the INSIDE OUT. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour and that sin originates in the HEART (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have the NEW COVENANT promise and need to be BORN AGAIN by Faith in God's WORD for salvation to be free from SIN (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.
If we are not BORN AGAIN into the NEW COVENANT promise and continue in it we will not enter the kingdom of Heaven *1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 2:3-4. ALL those who KNOWINGLY break any one of God's 10 commandments stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. All those who KNOWINGLY CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into God's KINGDOM *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23. God's 4th Commandment is one of the 10 Commandments that give us the KNOWLEDGE of what sin is. There is no such thing as the 9 commandments in God's WORD. The same as there is no scripure that says God's 4th commandment is Abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day.
RIGHTESOUSNESS comes from LOVE because LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW and the very expression of what LOVE is *ROMANS 13:8-10. He that does not LOVE does not KNOW GOD for GOD IS LOVE * 1 JOHN 4:8. All those who are BORN AGAIN have a NEW HEART TO LOVE and FOLLOW GOD *1 JOHN 4:7. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12.
Those who are BORN AGAIN do not practice SIN (breaking God's Commandments) *1 JOHN 3:4-9. This is why JOHN finishes on this subject by saying; For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous *1 JOHN 5:3 and is why JESUS says IF you LOVE me KEEP my commandments *JOHN 14:15. UNLESS we are BORN AGAIN under the NEW COVENANT to LOVE we will not enter the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7. We need to be changed from the INSIDE OUT.
Can we have GRACE without God's LAW if the purpose of God's LAW is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172?
We will go more into this question in PART 2 of this post....
From the scriptures it was shown God's GRACE is linked to MERCY and PEACE and TRUTH because all of us have SINNED and fall short of the Glory of GOD and the wages of sin is death. *ROMANS 3:23; ROMANS 5:12; ROMANS 6:23. But God so loved our world that he sent his only SON to die on our behalf for the sins that we all have committed in order to bring us back to GOD.
JOHN 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
ROMANS 8:3-4
[3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: [4], THAT THE RIGHTOUESNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.
God's GRACE is shown that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
ROMANS 5:6-10
[6], For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
[7], For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
[8], But God commends his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
[9], Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
[10], For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
This leads us to the next question.
CAN WE HAVE GOD'S GRACE IN THE NC WITHOUT GOD'S LAW?
If we are all SINNERS in need of a SAVIOUR if we do not KNOW that we are sinners will how can we see God's GRACE? Notice this next question from JESUS to the Pharisees that thought they were rightouess in God's eyes.
MATTHEW 7:12-13
[12], But when Jesus heard that, he said to them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick. [13], But go you and learn what that means, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
and again...
MATTHEW 5:20
[20], For I say to you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
JESUS came to magnify the LAW from the INSIDE OUT quoting MATTHEW 5:17-32 (thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *ISAIAH 42:21. This is to show that unless our RIGHTOUESNESS EXCEEDS the RIGHTOUESNESS of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. EVIL begins in the HEART.
BREAKING GOD's 10 COMMANDMENTS from the heart defile a man *MATTHEW 15:18-19. JESUS is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:27-28. JESUS magnified the LAW to the INSIDE OUT. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour and that sin originates in the HEART (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have the NEW COVENANT promise and need to be BORN AGAIN by Faith in God's WORD for salvation to be free from SIN (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.
If we are not BORN AGAIN into the NEW COVENANT promise and continue in it we will not enter the kingdom of Heaven *1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 2:3-4. ALL those who KNOWINGLY break any one of God's 10 commandments stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. All those who KNOWINGLY CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into God's KINGDOM *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23. God's 4th Commandment is one of the 10 Commandments that give us the KNOWLEDGE of what sin is. There is no such thing as the 9 commandments in God's WORD. The same as there is no scripure that says God's 4th commandment is Abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day.
RIGHTESOUSNESS comes from LOVE because LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW and the very expression of what LOVE is *ROMANS 13:8-10. He that does not LOVE does not KNOW GOD for GOD IS LOVE * 1 JOHN 4:8. All those who are BORN AGAIN have a NEW HEART TO LOVE and FOLLOW GOD *1 JOHN 4:7. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12.
Those who are BORN AGAIN do not practice SIN (breaking God's Commandments) *1 JOHN 3:4-9. This is why JOHN finishes on this subject by saying; For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous *1 JOHN 5:3 and is why JESUS says IF you LOVE me KEEP my commandments *JOHN 14:15. UNLESS we are BORN AGAIN under the NEW COVENANT to LOVE we will not enter the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7. We need to be changed from the INSIDE OUT.
Can we have GRACE without God's LAW if the purpose of God's LAW is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172?
We will go more into this question in PART 2 of this post....