I remember 'of it'. I never saw it.
The Trinity
- Thread starter Bright Raven
- Start date
I remember 'of it'. I never saw it.
keypurr
Well-known member
However I see ONLY the Father as God. The Son is a servant of his Father.The Holy Ghost is the power of God, not a person.
Either way, you are a Trinity Believer !@! [MENTION=3801]keypurr[/MENTION]
genuineoriginal
New member
It looks like you are trying to make an argument that concludes, "Therefore God has Multiple Personality Disorder".
iamaberean
New member
Father, Son and Holy Ghost are titles, not persons.
Father - The Creator
Son of God- God in Spirit, human in flesh that would give his blood to redeem us. Also known as the Holy One of Israel, our redeemer as the second man Adam, the first (covenant man) and the last (covenant man).
Holy Ghost - God in us
God uses titles so we can understand in what capacity he is speaking of. The same way I can point out that I am a husband, a father and a son, and yet I am one person.
In the New Testament it is also pointed out that the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost is ‘Jesus’.
Joh 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Here are more titles of the one God.
LORD of hosts and redeemer is Jesus as the Holy One of Israel.
Isa 47:4 As for our redeemer, the LORD of hosts is his name, the Holy One of Israel.
As the redeemer he is my salvation
Isa 12:2 Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for the LORD JEHOVAH is my strength and my song; he also is become my salvation.
He is known as the God of the whole earth.
Isa 54:5 For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.
Here God states, very plainly, “I am the first and the last and beside me there is no God”.
Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
Now Jesus confirms he is God and was flesh, when he says he is the first and the last, but also the one that was dead.
Rev 2:8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;
1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
Last edited by a moderator:
When genuineoriginal mentally talks to genuineoriginal, does it mean that he has a Personality Disorder?
You quoted an affirmation, not a question.
This is a question:
Do you folks never contemplate the wonderful gift of self-consciousness?
No.
The movie was Sybil.
All the time.
I even observe as a second part of my consciousness goes back and forth with a third part.
We are actually three in one.
There is our Dreamer (comes up with ideas). Our Realist (goes about what needs to get done toward their realization). And our Critic (provides feedback back and forth between those two as to what is working or not).
At which point, our Dreamer kicks in with "well, what if we try this, instead."
But because these three de-"part"-ments or person - "ally"-ties function so interchangeably with one another, we never notice.
Hopefully, that generates more questions than answers...
Apparently, your version ended up with a split in his per-son-ally-ty...
John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Your Jesus appears to have ended up like that quip about Schizophrenia "I used to have a problem...but now WE'RE okay..."
May you re-question your conclusions.
Quest - ion: to go on a quest for a time....
Last edited by a moderator:
Love Sally Field - great actress throughout her entire career.
Me too, and I agree.
Yes indeed, self-consciousness is a trinal activity and points to our origin and efficient cause.
Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Ask Mr. Religion
☞☞☞☞Presbyterian (PCA) 	
Gold Subscriber
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
I see. You are given much content to review, wherein Scripture is explained in detail. Rather than be a Berean and study the content, you resort to just assertions and offer no substantive response to the content provided.
Why not be an Arian?
Answer:
Because Scripture stands against you and it leads folks like yourself to wrongly claim a label—"Protestant Christian"—all the while you all have no claim to the title.
1. Jesus made every created thing (John 1:1-3, Col 1:16-17)
2. God alone made every created thing (Gen 1:1; Isa 44:24)
3. Therefore, Jesus is God
In the above I presuppose Scripture does not contradict itself. But suppose we do not take inerrancy for granted. Well, it is quite unreasonable to imagine that John was attempting to correct Genesis Chapter 1 verse 1. It is obvious John was assuming the truth of Genesis 1:1 so as to demonstrate the same conclusion I have made above.
We can go further...
4. A created thing cannot make itself
5. Therefore, since Jesus made every created thing, Jesus is not a created thing
6. But if Jesus is not a created thing, then He is an eternal, necessary thing (He exists because He must exist)
7. Therefore, Jesus is either
[i] something with the same attributes as God, although not God; or
[ii] Jesus simply is God
8. [i] defeats God’s omniscience and omnipotence, as well as being unsupported in Scripture;
[ii] is theologically unproblematic and attested in Scripture
9. Therefore, [ii]: Jesus simply is God.
Some may ask, "Why does implying two gods in the above defeat omnipotence and omniscience?"
Under the assumption of [i], there are two necessary, personal beings (Jesus and God), and they are not the same being. But omnipotence necessarily means God has no external constraint on His power. Therefore Jesus nor God can be omnipotent as each would be an external constraint on the other’s power. Similarly, omniscience involves knowing every truth—but how could one of the two gods know truths about the other god's thoughts? Thus if Jesus is not God, Christianity is ransacked. If Jesus is God, Christianity stands unmolested.
HANDS: A useful memory aid for those who rightly affirm the divinity of Christ
In John 20:25, Thomas expresses his skepticism. Then, in John 20:26, Jesus appears and gives Thomas his requested sign: Jesus shows his hands (and side) to his doubting disciple. Using the acronym HANDS as a mnemonic device, we get an overview of the case for Jesus’ deity:
H – Honors – Jesus receives the honors reserved for God
A – Attributes – Jesus possesses the attributes of God
N – Names – Jesus is identified by the names of God
D – Deeds – Jesus does the deeds of God
S – Seat – Jesus shares the seat of God’s majesty and dominion
Specifically:
1. Jesus receives the honors reserved for God:
Honor – John 5:23
Glory – Heb 13:21, 1 Peter 4:11, 2 Peter 3:18, Rev 5:12-13
Worship – Matt 2:11, Matt 14:33, Matt 28:9, Matt 28:17, Heb 1:6, Rev 5:13-14
Prayer – John 14:14, Acts 1:21-25, Acts 7:59-60, 2 Cor 12:8-9,
Songs – Eph 5:19, Rev 5:9-10, Phil 2:6-11
Faith – John 1:12, John 3:16, John 6:35, John 8:24, Acts 10:43, Rom 9:33, 1 John 3:23
Fear – 2 Cor 5:10-11
Love – Matt 10:37, John 14:21, Eph 6:24
2. Jesus possesses the attributes of God:
Perfect Image/Precise Nature/Fullness of God – John 12:45, John 14:7-10, Col 1:15-19, Col 2:9, Heb 1:3
Eternal –John 1:1-3, John 8:56-59, Heb 1:2
Uncreated – John 1:3, 1 Cor 8:6, Col 1:15-16, Heb 1:2
Immutable – Heb 1:10-12, Heb 13:8
Omnipotent – Matt 28:18-20, Heb 1:3
Omnipresent – Matt 18:20, Matt 28:20, John 1:47-49
Omniscient – Matt 9:4, Mark 2: 6-8, Luke 6:8, John 4:16-18, Acts 1:24, 1 Cor 4:5
Incomprehensible – Matt 11:27, Luke 10:22
3. Jesus identified by the names of God:
God – John 1:1, John 1:18, John 20:28, Acts 20:28, Rom 9:5, Tit 2:13, Heb 1:8, 2 Peter 1:1
Lord – Matt 3:3, Mark 1:3, Acts 2:16-21, Acts 7:59-60, Rom 10:9-17
King of Kings and Lord of Lords – Rev 17:14, Rev 19:16
“I AM” – John 8:57-59, John 18:5-6
First and Last/Beginning and End/Alpha and Omega – Rev 1:7-8, Rev 2:8, Rev 22:12-13 (compare Isaiah 44:6; Isaiah 48:12)
4. Jesus does the deeds of God:
Creator of all things – John 1:3, 1 Cor 8:6, Col 1:16-17, Heb 1:2
Sustainer of all creation – Heb 1:3
Ruler of creation – Mark 4: 39-41
Giver of revelation – Matt 11:27
Speaks with absolute and binding authority – Mark 1:22, Matt 7:24-29, etc.
Forgives sins – Matt 9:1-8, Luke 7:47-50, Acts 5:31, Col 3:13
Sends the Holy Spirit – Matt 3:11, Luke 24:49, John 15:26, Acts 2:33,
Gives Spiritual Gifts – Eph 4:8-11
Judges all people – Matt 16:27, John 5:22, Acts 10:42, 2 Cor 5:10, etc.
5. Jesus shares the seat of God’s majesty and dominion:
Equal with God – Matt 9:2-7, John 5:17-18, John 10:30-33
Seated at the right hand of God – Mark 14:61-64, Rom 8:34, Eph 1:20, 1 Peter 3:22, Rev 3:21
Rules over all things – Matt 11:27, Matt 28:18-20, Luke 10:22, Eph 1:22, Heb 2:8
Reigns forever – Luke 1:33, Eph 1:19-21, Heb 1:8, Rev 11:15
Is this a sufficient amount of Scripture for you to actually interact with in substance? Or are you going to just keep repeating yourself? Be a Berean or consider changing your username to IamNOTaBerean.
AMR
Ask Mr. Religion
☞☞☞☞Presbyterian (PCA) 	
Gold Subscriber
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
After you complete your studies of my previous post, here is a wee bit more Scripture for your consideration:
Our Lord Is Called God Explicitly
Matthew 1:23, "Emmanuel-God with us."
John 1:1, "The Word was God."
John 5:17-23, The Son is "equal" to his Father
John 8:53-59, Jesus is the "I AM" of Exodus 3:1-15
John 10:28-33, Jesus and the Father are equal
John 20:28 "The Lord of me and THE GOD of me."
Romans 9:5, Christ is God over all
Colossians 2:9, All the fullness of deity
Titus 2:13, "our Great God and Saviour."
Hebrews 1:8, "Thy throne O God."
1 John 5:20, "The true God."
Our Lord Is Described In Terms Reserved Only For God
Creator of ALL Things
John 1:3
Ephesians 3:9
Colossians 1:16,17
Hebrews 2:10
Revelation 3:14
The Almighty - Revelation 1:8 with 21:5-7; and 22:12,13,16,20
The First and Last - Revelation 1:17; 2:8; 22:13 (Compare Isaiah 44:6)
The Exact Representation of The Father - Hebrews 1:John 12:45 and 14:6-11, Isaiah 46:9
Our Lord Is Worshipped As God. (See Luke 4:8)
Revelation 5:11-13 (Compare Revelation 4:9-11)
Hebrews 1:6
O.T. and N.T. Cross-References
Isaiah 40:3 with John 1:23 & 3:28
Isaiah 45:23 with Philippians 2:10,11 and Romans 14:11
Isaiah 44:24 with John 1:3
Isaiah 6:1-5 with John 12:37-41
Isaiah 8:13,14 with I Peter 2:7,8
Isaiah 42:8 with John 17:5
Isaiah 60:19 with Luke 2:30-32
Psalms 102:24-27 with Hebrews 1:10-12
Psalms 45:6,7 with Hebrews 1:8,9
Psalms 23:1 with Isaiah 40:10,11 and John 10,11
I Kings 8:39 with Revelation 2:23
Joel 2:32 with Romans 10:9-13
Exodus 3:14 with John 8:58,59
Malachi 3:1 with Matthew 11:10
Exodus 19:18-21 with Hebrews 12:18-26
Zechariah 12:10 & 13:6,7 with John 19:34-37
Zechariah 14:4,5 with Matthew 24:29-31; Matthew 25:31; Jude 14,15; II Thessalonians 1:7-10; Revelation 19:11-21
Our Lord Is God Made Flesh
- Philippians 2:5-8: Jesus "being in the form of God" (i.e., deity), did not consider it something to cling to, but emptied himself of his divine glory and perogatives, not his divine nature, and took upon his divine form "the form of a servant" (i.e., humanity), in order to suffer death.
- John 1:1,14: "In the beginning was (eternally) the Word and the Word was with God (i.e., the Father and Holy Spirit), and the Word was God (deity)." "And the Word was made flesh and dwelt among us."
- Hebrews 1:3 and 2:9-18: Jesus is the "exact representation of His (God's) very being". No creature could possibly do that! But, Jesus set aside his infinite glory to become one of us so that he could be to us an, example in faith, the perfect sacrifice, our High Priest, Mediator, and Savior.
Who Is The "Angel Of Jehovah?"
Genesis 16:7-13
Genesis 18:1,13,17,20-22,26,33; 19:24
Genesis 22:11-18
Genesis 31:11-13
Genesis 32:24-30 (compare Hosea 12:4,5)
Genesis 48: 15,16
Exodus 3:1-15 (compare vs. 5 with Joshua 5: 14,15)
Exodus 23:20,21
Judges 6:11-23
In these passages the "Angel of Jehovah" speaks as Jehovah, is called Jehovah, does the works of Jehovah, and is worshipped by those to whom He appears. He is Our Lord, the Son of God.
And before you chime in with the usual Arian retorts...
- John 14:28 "My Father is greater than I." Just as the husband is positionally greater than the wife so the Father is greater the the Son when considering the economy of the Trinity. Both husband and wife are equally human as the Father and Son are equally divine.
- Colossians 1:15 "the Firstborn of all creation." "Firstborn" (Prototokos), not "first created" (Protoktistos). Firstborn is term that means first in importance. These scriptures bear that out: Genesis 41:51,52 with Jeremiah 31:9; Deuteronomy 21:15-17; Exodus 4:22; and Job 18:13.
- Revelation 3:14 "the beginning of the creation of God." We derive many words such as architect, archangel, arch-rival, from the Greek word arche translated beginning in this verse. It means "origin," "source," "chief," and "ruler." Jesus is the origin of all, the creator.
AMR
iamaberean
New member
This will surprise you. I agree, Jesus is God, manifested in the flesh.
What I still think we disagree on is that he is not another God, again he is God. And, heres comes the other point, he is also the Redeemer, he purchased us with his blood.
Maybe you agree with me, but I have the opinion that you believe in trinity, which is not biblical.
[
Last edited by a moderator:
You need the shrink the font down. No need to use huge fonts like this. The default size 3 is good enough. When your post appears, the forum software automatically posts it at size 3.
Ask Mr. Religion
☞☞☞☞Presbyterian (PCA) 	
Gold Subscriber
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Which of the following do you disagree with:
The union of the divine and the human natures of Our Lord is not:
1. a denial that our Lord was truly God (Ebionites, Elkasites, Arians);
2. a dissimilar or different substance (anomoios) with the Father (semi-Arianism);
3. a denial that our Lord had a genuine human soul (Apollinarians);
4. a denial of a distinct person in the Trinity (Dynamic Monarchianism);
5. God acting merely in the forms of the Son and Spirit (Modalistic Monarchianism/Sabellianism/United Pentecostal Church);
6. a mixture or change when the two natures were united (Eutychianism/Monophysitism);
7. two distinct persons (Nestorianism);
8. a denial of the true humanity of Christ (docetism);
9. a view that God the Son laid aside all or some of His divine attributes (kenoticism);
10. a view that there was a communication of the attributes between the divine and human natures (Lutheranism, with respect to the Lord's Supper); and
11. a view that our Lord existed independently as a human before God entered His body (Adoptionism).
AMR