Jesus and Jesus Alone Saves to the Uttermost, Hebrews 7:25.

God's Truth

New member
Can you show me which post your referring to? Because i certainly didn't mean that we can't obey God unless we have the Holy Spirit. We can't overcome without the Holy Spirit but we can obey. And we won't receive the Holy spirit unless we obey and do the will of God!

What you say is clear and true.

Thank you for clarifying.

It is good when one is speaking the truth to let them know you agree with them, and then add what you would like to say.

I am so glad to hear what you said. The way you said it before left room for these many false teachers to feel empowered.

They preach we cannot obey before we are saved, they are the faith only, or called the faith alone crowd, and the Calvinists.
 

God's Truth

New member
KJ

21
If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your heavenly Father give the holy Spirit to them that ask Him?”

Are you trying to nullify scripture with scripture? Did you not read Acts 5:32?

It plainly says that the Holy Spirit is given to those who obey.

As for God giving good gifts, it is to His children. You have to repent of your sins to be His child.
 

God's Truth

New member
Marhig, see how 1Mind1Spirit tried to jump on you when your clarified?

I tell you, there are people against following the Way to get saved, and those who obey to stay saved.
 

God's Truth

New member
God's love IS conditional.

If you obey God, you are His child.

If you do not obey Him, you obey the devil and are the devil's child.


John 8:44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

John 8:38
I am telling you what I have seen in the Father's presence, and you are doing what you have heard from your father


John 8:41
You are doing the works of your own father." "We are not illegitimate children," they protested. "The only Father we have is God himself."

John 8:55
Though you do not know him, I know him. If I said I did not, I would be a liar like you, but I do know him and obey his word.

1 John 2:4
Whoever says, "I know him," but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in that person.

1 John 3:8
The one who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work.

1 John 3:10
This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God's child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.

1 John 3:15
Anyone who hates a brother or sister is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life residing in him.
 

Bright Raven

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
God's love IS conditional.

If you obey God, you are His child.

If you do not obey Him, you obey the devil and are the devil's child.


John 8:44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

John 8:38
I am telling you what I have seen in the Father's presence, and you are doing what you have heard from your father


John 8:41
You are doing the works of your own father." "We are not illegitimate children," they protested. "The only Father we have is God himself."

John 8:55
Though you do not know him, I know him. If I said I did not, I would be a liar like you, but I do know him and obey his word.

1 John 2:4
Whoever says, "I know him," but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in that person.

1 John 3:8
The one who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work.

1 John 3:10
This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God's child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.

1 John 3:15
Anyone who hates a brother or sister is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life residing in him.

God's love is unconditional.

God’s love, as described in the Bible, is clearly unconditional in that His love is expressed toward the objects of His love (that is, His people) despite their disposition toward Him. In other words, God loves because it His nature to love (1 John 4:8), and that love moves Him toward benevolent action. The unconditional nature of God’s love is most clearly seen in the gospel. The gospel message is basically a story of divine rescue. As God considers the plight of His rebellious people, He determines to save them from their sin, and this determination is based on His love (Ephesians 1:4-5). Listen to the Apostle Paul’s words from his letter to the Romans:

“You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us” (Romans 5:6-8).

Reading through the book of Romans, we learn that we are alienated from God due to our sin. We are at enmity with God, and His wrath is being revealed against the ungodly for their unrighteousness (Romans 1:18-20). We reject God, and God gives us over to our sin. We also learn that we have all sinned and fallen short of God’s glory (Romans 3:23) and that none of us seek God, none of us do what is right before His eyes (Romans 3:10-18).

Despite this hostility and enmity we have toward God (for which God would be perfectly just to utterly destroy us), God reveals His love toward us in the giving of His Son, Jesus Christ, as the propitiation (that is, the appeasement of God’s righteous wrath) for our sins. God did not wait for us to better ourselves as a condition of atoning for our sin. Rather, God condescended to become a man and live among His people (John 1:14). God experienced our humanity—everything it means to be a human being—and then offered Himself willingly as a substitutionary atonement for our sin.

This divine rescue resulted in a gracious act of self-sacrifice. As Jesus says in John’s gospel, “Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends” (John 15:13). That is precisely what God, in Christ, has done. The unconditional nature of God’s love is made clear in two more passages from Scripture:

“But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved” (Ephesians 2:4-5).

"This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins" (1 John 4:9-10).

It is important to note that God’s love is a love that initiates; it is never a response. That is precisely what makes it unconditional. If God’s love were conditional, then we would have to do something to earn or merit it. We would have to somehow appease His wrath and cleanse ourselves of our sin before God would be able to love us. But that is not the biblical message. The biblical message—the gospel—is that God, motivated by love, moved unconditionally to save His people from their sin. (From gotquestions.org)
 

God's Truth

New member
God's love is unconditional.

God’s love, as described in the Bible, is clearly unconditional in that His love is expressed toward the objects of His love (that is, His people) despite their disposition toward Him. In other words, God loves because it His nature to love (1 John 4:8), and that love moves Him toward benevolent action. The unconditional nature of God’s love is most clearly seen in the gospel. The gospel message is basically a story of divine rescue. As God considers the plight of His rebellious people, He determines to save them from their sin, and this determination is based on His love (Ephesians 1:4-5). Listen to the Apostle Paul’s words from his letter to the Romans:

“You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us” (Romans 5:6-8).

Reading through the book of Romans, we learn that we are alienated from God due to our sin. We are at enmity with God, and His wrath is being revealed against the ungodly for their unrighteousness (Romans 1:18-20). We reject God, and God gives us over to our sin. We also learn that we have all sinned and fallen short of God’s glory (Romans 3:23) and that none of us seek God, none of us do what is right before His eyes (Romans 3:10-18).

Despite this hostility and enmity we have toward God (for which God would be perfectly just to utterly destroy us), God reveals His love toward us in the giving of His Son, Jesus Christ, as the propitiation (that is, the appeasement of God’s righteous wrath) for our sins. God did not wait for us to better ourselves as a condition of atoning for our sin. Rather, God condescended to become a man and live among His people (John 1:14). God experienced our humanity—everything it means to be a human being—and then offered Himself willingly as a substitutionary atonement for our sin.

This divine rescue resulted in a gracious act of self-sacrifice. As Jesus says in John’s gospel, “Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends” (John 15:13). That is precisely what God, in Christ, has done. The unconditional nature of God’s love is made clear in two more passages from Scripture:

“But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved” (Ephesians 2:4-5).

"This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins" (1 John 4:9-10).

It is important to note that God’s love is a love that initiates; it is never a response. That is precisely what makes it unconditional. If God’s love were conditional, then we would have to do something to earn or merit it. We would have to somehow appease His wrath and cleanse ourselves of our sin before God would be able to love us. But that is not the biblical message. The biblical message—the gospel—is that God, motivated by love, moved unconditionally to save His people from their sin. (From gotquestions.org)

God's love is conditional.

It is not love to cause harm to another. Period.
 

1Mind1Spirit

Literal lunatic
Are you trying to nullify scripture with scripture? .

Not a chance.


Did you not read Acts 5:32?

It plainly says that the Holy Spirit is given to those who obey.

It says God has given.

What it does not say is, because of, as you assume.


As for God giving good gifts, it is to His children.

Shore nuff.


You have to repent of your sins to be His child.


His children will/do repent.
 

Nang

TOL Subscriber
God's love is unconditional.

God’s love, as described in the Bible, is clearly unconditional in that His love is expressed toward the objects of His love (that is, His people) despite their disposition toward Him. In other words, God loves because it His nature to love (1 John 4:8), and that love moves Him toward benevolent action. The unconditional nature of God’s love is most clearly seen in the gospel. The gospel message is basically a story of divine rescue. As God considers the plight of His rebellious people, He determines to save them from their sin, and this determination is based on His love (Ephesians 1:4-5). Listen to the Apostle Paul’s words from his letter to the Romans:

“You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us” (Romans 5:6-8).

Reading through the book of Romans, we learn that we are alienated from God due to our sin. We are at enmity with God, and His wrath is being revealed against the ungodly for their unrighteousness (Romans 1:18-20). We reject God, and God gives us over to our sin. We also learn that we have all sinned and fallen short of God’s glory (Romans 3:23) and that none of us seek God, none of us do what is right before His eyes (Romans 3:10-18).

Despite this hostility and enmity we have toward God (for which God would be perfectly just to utterly destroy us), God reveals His love toward us in the giving of His Son, Jesus Christ, as the propitiation (that is, the appeasement of God’s righteous wrath) for our sins. God did not wait for us to better ourselves as a condition of atoning for our sin. Rather, God condescended to become a man and live among His people (John 1:14). God experienced our humanity—everything it means to be a human being—and then offered Himself willingly as a substitutionary atonement for our sin.

This divine rescue resulted in a gracious act of self-sacrifice. As Jesus says in John’s gospel, “Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends” (John 15:13). That is precisely what God, in Christ, has done. The unconditional nature of God’s love is made clear in two more passages from Scripture:

“But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved” (Ephesians 2:4-5).

"This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins" (1 John 4:9-10).

It is important to note that God’s love is a love that initiates; it is never a response. That is precisely what makes it unconditional. If God’s love were conditional, then we would have to do something to earn or merit it. We would have to somehow appease His wrath and cleanse ourselves of our sin before God would be able to love us. But that is not the biblical message. The biblical message—the gospel—is that God, motivated by love, moved unconditionally to save His people from their sin. (From gotquestions.org)

Excellent post. Such is why Reformers hold to "UNCONDITIONAL Election" as well as the UNCONDITIONAL Covenant of Grace. Very, very important truth to grasp!
 

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
Excellent post. Such is why Reformers hold to "UNCONDITIONAL Election" as well as the UNCONDITIONAL Covenant of Grace. Very, very important truth to grasp!

Salvation is conditional. No one will be saved that does not believe that Jesus has atoned for their sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2.

The elect are those that have elected to believe in Jesus as their savior, John 3:16.
 

God's Truth

New member
Not a chance.




It says God has given.

What it does not say is, because of, as you assume.




Shore nuff.





His children will/do repent.

No Nang, He does not make people His children against their wanting and against their knowledge.

As for 1Mind1Spirit, You have to repent before you can be a child of God.

Read Acts 5:32 more carefully.

The Holy Spirit is given TO THOSE WHO OBEY.
 

God's Truth

New member
Salvation is conditional. No one will be saved that does not believe that Jesus has atoned for their sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2.

The elect are those that have elected to believe in Jesus as their savior, John 3:16.

Jesus elects those who obey him.

Jesus saves those who believe and obey him. See Acts 5:32, John 14:23, Acts 10:35, Psalm 50:23, Acts 13:26,Matthew 18:3, Luke 13:3, John 15:14, Matthew 12:50,Luke 11:28, John 13:17.
 

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
Jesus elects those who obey him.

Jesus saves those who believe and obey him. See Acts 5:32, John 14:23, Acts 10:35, Psalm 50:23, Acts 13:26,Matthew 18:3, Luke 13:3, John 15:14, Matthew 12:50,Luke 11:28, John 13:17.

The will of the Father is that you believe and trust in his son Jesus Christ.

You are not trusting in him if you are trying to be like him.
 

God's Truth

New member
The will of the Father is that you believe and trust in his son Jesus Christ.

You are not trusting in him if you are trying to be like him.

We are supposed to be transformed to his image.

What king does not want to be obeyed?

What parent does not want to obey?

What spouse has love for you if they are doing things behind your back?

What you teach is not from God.
 

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
We are supposed to be transformed to his image.

What king does not want to be obeyed?

What parent does not want to obey?

What spouse has love for you if they are doing things behind your back?

What you teach is not from God.

The transforming is done by the Holy Spirit, not you. This is your problem, you are trying to do in the flesh what God has already done in Jesus Christ. You have not entered into his rest, Hebrews 4:10.
 

Nang

TOL Subscriber
Salvation is conditional. No one will be saved that does not believe that Jesus has atoned for their sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2.

The elect are those that have elected to believe in Jesus as their savior, John 3:16.

Corrupt sinners only "elect" to sin.

Faith to believe is a gift from God.

Therefore, faith is not a condition of salvation, but evidence God has saved.
 

Nang

TOL Subscriber
No Nang, He does not make people His children against their wanting and against their knowledge.

Totally corrupted souls, enslaved to sin, death, and the devil, are incapable and unwilling to belong to God. They have no spiritual knowledge of God nor any love for God at all.

As for 1Mind1Spirit, You have to repent before you can be a child of God.

Enslaved souls, serving sin, death, and the devil cannot repent. They cannot escape. They need rescue . . and God alone can rescue them from their slavery.

Souls that DO repent, evidence God's salvation and rescue from bondage to sin.



The Holy Spirit is given TO THOSE WHO OBEY.

Those who are regenerated from death to new spiritual life, and indwelt with the Holy Spirit, are given new hearts to love God and obey His will and Word.

God's saving grace is absolutely unconditional, else it would not be grace at all.
 
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