Where did bats come from?

[bob b]

Um, :duh:, but the fossilized bats ARE ancestral. It shows that the ancestral forms were insectivores. What are you expecting it to say about them? You don't want answers, so why do you ask questions?

From Wikipedia article on insectivores:

"An insectivore is a carnivore with a diet that consists chiefly of insects and similar small creatures."

Since isolated findings of teeth that are believed to be from fossil bats are similar to other fossil insectivores likes moles, taxonomists have placed the ancestors of bats in the insectivore clade.

To answer your question, I would expect people to answer "We don't know" when asked to identify the ancestors of bats.

Reminds me of the story about "Nebraska Man" that was first identified as a human ancestor on the basis of a single fossil tooth, but later was downgraded to that of a fossil pig.

 

[noguru]

From Wikipedia article on insectivores:

"An insectivore is a carnivore with a diet that consists chiefly of insects and similar small creatures."

Since isolated findings of teeth that are believed to be from fossil bats are similar to other fossil insectivores likes moles, taxonomists have placed the ancestors of bats in the insectivore clade.

To answer your question, I would expect people to answer "We don't know" when asked to identify the ancestors of bats.

Reminds me of the story about "Nebraska Man" that was first identified as a human ancestor on the basis of a single fossil tooth, but later was downgraded to that of a fossil pig.

I did answer "I don't know". You then tried to imply that I was apathetic as well.

 

[uk_mikey]

Um, :duh:, but the fossilized bats ARE ancestral. It shows that the ancestral forms were insectivores. What are you expecting it to say about them? You don't want answers, so why do you ask questions?

Bats are a protected species in the UK. If we find bats living in our roof, we aren't allowed to disturb them.

I saw some bats this evening. They fly so fast.

I think they are my favourite mammal.

Although I do like parsnips.

Just thought I'd mention it.

:noid:

 

[SUTG]

Bats are a protected species in the UK. If we find bats living in our roof, we aren't allowed to disturb them.

I saw some bats this evening. They fly so fast.

I think they are my favourite mammal.

Although I do like parsnips.

Just thought I'd mention it.

:noid:

Parsnips and bats share a common ancestor.

 

[uk_mikey]

Parsnips and bats share a common ancestor.

Ahhh... Thanks for that.

I wasn't sure why I'd mentioned it. Now you reminded me.

Gee, you are clever!

:thumb:

 

[noguru]

Parsnips and bats share a common ancestor.

Would that ancestor go all the way back to eukaryotic bacteria?

 

[Sealeaf]

So where do you guys think bats came from?

Caves.

 

[PlastikBuddha]

From Wikipedia article on insectivores:

"An insectivore is a carnivore with a diet that consists chiefly of insects and similar small creatures."

Since isolated findings of teeth that are believed to be from fossil bats are similar to other fossil insectivores likes moles, taxonomists have placed the ancestors of bats in the insectivore clade.

To answer your question, I would expect people to answer "We don't know" when asked to identify the ancestors of bats.

Reminds me of the story about "Nebraska Man" that was first identified as a human ancestor on the basis of a single fossil tooth, but later was downgraded to that of a fossil pig.

Science doesn't claim to have all of the answers. It is the process of building human understanding up from ignorance to a purely hypothetical complete knowledge so why would you expect scientists to run around talking about all the things we don't know yet instead of discussing the things that we DO know? Why does it remind you of that, Bob? Because there have been errors made in the past it is safe to assume that anything you don't like is also an error? Not a good attitude for a science lover. Science will always have errors and miscperceptions. I think what you want once again is religion.

 

[DoogieTalons]

Wow sat here alone, without a clue where bats came from I must conlude that some god or other made them. I'll not research nor look any further it must have been a god. So I'll go with the Hopi creation story...

In the beginning there were only two: Tawa, the Sun God, and Spider Woman, the Earth Goddess. All the mysteries and power in the Above belonged to Tawa, while Spider Woman controlled the magic of the Below. In the Underworld, abode of the Gods, they dwelt and they were All. There was neither man nor woman, bird nor beast, no living thing until these Two willed it to be.

So there you go Spider woman did it with her pal Tawa.... as good a story as any I suppose.

 

[chrysostom]

You forgot the flood

 

[Daniel50]

Why they must have evolved like everything else, of course.

http://ebat.tamu.edu/bats/bat_faqs.php

:zoomin: :dog: :chuckle:

 

[PlastikBuddha]

Bats are a protected species in the UK. If we find bats living in our roof, we aren't allowed to disturb them.

I saw some bats this evening. They fly so fast.

I think they are my favourite mammal.

Although I do like parsnips.

Just thought I'd mention it.

:noid:

Bats are cool. I remember when I was kid living in New Mexico there a was spring out in the desert where at the evening I could watch them swoop about feeding on the insects hovering about the water. That an watching millions upon millions fly out of Carlsbad Cavern's like a furry cloud. Parsnips, however, are disgusting.

 

[pleasedtomeetme]

Why they must have evolved like everything else, of course.

HERE is where bats come from.

 

[uk_mikey]

Bats are cool. I remember when I was kid living in New Mexico there a was spring out in the desert where at the evening I could watch them swoop about feeding on the insects hovering about the water. That an watching millions upon millions fly out of Carlsbad Cavern's like a furry cloud. Parsnips, however, are disgusting.

What??? Parsnips are delicious roasted in vegetable or nut oil. Best with turkey, steamed peas and carrots, and a beef gravy. The parsnips add a sweet content to the meal.

I have no idea what bats taste like, but i'd end up in a police cell if I tried. :chuckle:

 

[The Barbarian]

Because bats don't fossilize well, there is a very poor record of bat evolution in the fossile record. Molecular biology is begining to show some results, but it's been slow going.

 

[bob b]

Are bats merely creatures that fly?

And God created [H1254] ... and every winged [H3671] fowl [H5775] after his kind [H4327]

H1254
בָּרָא
bârâ’
baw-raw'
A primitive root; (absolutely) to create; (qualified) to cut down (a wood), select, feed (as formative processes):—choose, create (creator), cut down, dispatch, do, make (fat).

H5775
עוֹף
‛ôph
ofe
From H5774; a bird (as covered with feathers, or rather as covering with wings), often collective:—bird, that flieth, flying, fowl.

H5774
עוּף
‛ûph
oof
A primitive root; to cover (with wings or obscurity); hence (as denominative from H5775) to fly; also (by implication of dimness) to faint (from the darkness of swooning):—brandish, be (wax) faint, flee away, fly (away—), X set, shine forth, weary.

H3671
כָּנָף
kânâph
kaw-nawf'
From H3670; an edge or extremity; specifically (of a bird or army) a wing, (of a garment or bed clothing) a flap, (of the earth) a quarter, (of a building) a pinnacle:— + bird, border, corner, end, feather [-ed], X flying, + (one an-) other, overspreading, X quarters, skirt, X sort, uttermost part, wing ([-ed]).

H4327
מִין
mı̂yn
meen
From an unused root meaning to portion out; a sort, that is, species:—kind. Compare H4480.

Note: the word species comes from the Latin and means: a sight, outward appearance, shape, form, sort, kind. Early biologists thus would have naturally equated species with kind, but later gave the word species a special meaning that undoubtedly was not what the author of Genesis 1 had in mind. This led many early Christian theologians and preachers to assume that God created all species (kinds) in the beginning in a “perfect” form which has never changed. Thus, later biologists rejected Genesis 1 when they found that their particular definition of species was not fixed but varied over time. The point is, of course, that it is not necessarily valid to assume that a modern definition of a word is the same as the definition used in the earliest scriptural documents.

This point may also apply to "creatures that live in the sea".

 

[PlastikBuddha]

Are bats merely creatures that fly?

And God created [H1254] ... and every winged [H3671] fowl [H5775] after his kind [H4327]

H1254
בָּרָא
bârâ’
baw-raw'
A primitive root; (absolutely) to create; (qualified) to cut down (a wood), select, feed (as formative processes):—choose, create (creator), cut down, dispatch, do, make (fat).

H5775
עוֹף
‛ôph
ofe
From H5774; a bird (as covered with feathers, or rather as covering with wings), often collective:—bird, that flieth, flying, fowl.

H5774
עוּף
‛ûph
oof
A primitive root; to cover (with wings or obscurity); hence (as denominative from H5775) to fly; also (by implication of dimness) to faint (from the darkness of swooning):—brandish, be (wax) faint, flee away, fly (away—), X set, shine forth, weary.

H3671
כָּנָף
kânâph
kaw-nawf'
From H3670; an edge or extremity; specifically (of a bird or army) a wing, (of a garment or bed clothing) a flap, (of the earth) a quarter, (of a building) a pinnacle:— + bird, border, corner, end, feather [-ed], X flying, + (one an-) other, overspreading, X quarters, skirt, X sort, uttermost part, wing ([-ed]).

H4327
מִין
mı̂yn
meen
From an unused root meaning to portion out; a sort, that is, species:—kind. Compare H4480.

Note: the word species comes from the Latin and means: a sight, outward appearance, shape, form, sort, kind. Early biologists thus would have naturally equated species with kind, but later gave the word species a special meaning that undoubtedly was not what the author of Genesis 1 had in mind. This led many early Christian theologians and preachers to assume that God created all species (kinds) in the beginning in a “perfect” form which has never changed. Thus, later biologists rejected Genesis 1 when they found that their particular definition of species was not fixed but varied over time. The point is, of course, that it is not necessarily valid to assume that a modern definition of a word is the same as the definition used in the earliest scriptural documents.

This point may also apply to "creatures that live in the sea".

That's some great "science" there Bob! What ya gonna do for an encore, dunk some witches to see if they float?

 

[bob b]

That's some great "science" there Bob! What ya gonna do for an encore, dunk some witches to see if they float?

I've always wondered why some people seem to be compelled to post things on this forum that have no content of any value.

 

[PlastikBuddha]

I've always wondered why some people seem to be compelled to post things on this forum that have no content of any value.

Me too. That entire blisteringly stupid post from a "science lover" that is nothing more than biblical mysticism for example.

 

[bob b]

In case you failed to notice, PB, my posting was an analysis of the wording in Genesis 1, not a scientific statement.

I have no choice but to close the thread to stop your inane comments.