glorydaz
Well-known member
I understand about 2 and 3, but please explain more about one.
Is that saying the Holy Spirit placing that knowledge in us is a baptism?
ECT WHAT THE GREEK WORD BAPTIZO MEANS IN MATT 28:19 ??
- Thread starter DAN P
- Start date
I understand about 2 and 3, but please explain more about one.
Is that saying the Holy Spirit placing that knowledge in us is a baptism?
Hi and 1 Cor 12:3 and there are 5 verbs in that verse !!
The last verb says that no one can SAY , IN THE AORIST TENSE That Jesus is Lord EXCEPT by Holy Spirit Power and the sames goes for ANYONE that becomes saved as in Rom 10:9 !!
That is why Paul is the PATTERN in 1 Tim 1:16 !!
God has to open the HEART like He did to Lydia in Act 16:14 !!
Then God gives the FAITH to believe !!
Then Rom 10:9 all become saved and not UNTIL then WITHOUT Repentance , or Water Baptism , or
Penance or Tongues !!
dan p
"And he said to them, 'Into what then were you baptized?' So they said, 'Into John’s baptism.'" (Acts 19:3)
Baptize and baptism are two different words.
Baptize:
G907
βαπτίζω
baptizō
bap-tid'-zo
From a derivative of G911; to make whelmed (that is, fully wet); used only (in the New Testament) of ceremonial ablution, especially (technically) of the ordinance of Christian baptism: - baptist, baptize, wash.
G911
βάπτω
baptō
bap'-to
A primary verb; to whelm, that is, cover wholly with a fluid; in the New Testament only in a qualified or specific sense, that is, (literally) to moisten (a part of one’s person), or (by implication) to stain (as with dye): - dip.
G908
βάπτισμα
baptisma
bap'-tis-mah
From G907; baptism (technically or figuratively): - baptism.
Baptisma refers to those who are baptized, ie those who have been made fully wet.
Hi and remember that dictionaries are not INSPIRED and neither are translation , so we need to study how words are used !!
dan p
You see two, but Paul only saw one.
"one Lord, one faith, one baptism" (Ephesians 4:5)
glorydaz
Well-known member
Of course...the one that saved. He always preached the baptism by the Holy Spirit.
"Immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he received his sight at once; and he arose and was baptized." (Acts 9:18)
Yes, we just covered baptism G907, which means to make fully wet.
John's baptism was not with the holy Spirit. John's baptism symbolized the holy Spirit.
glorydaz
Well-known member
I have no idea where you get the idea that John's baptism symbolized the Holy Spirit.
It was directed at Israel....a baptism of repentance.
That they accepted Jesus Christ as their GOD.
Acts 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
Water symbolizes the holy Spirit.
oatmeal
Well-known member
It means to be dipped as in a cleansing.
Consider that neither of those is what that passage is speaking of...
Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
And obviously, the following is also not the case; or you wouldn't be asking.
1 John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
What then is the following actually referring to?
1 Corinthians 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
One, what was he talking about before he then added that to it?
Two, what more does he go on to talk about with regard to what he was talking about before he then added to it what he says in verse 3?
Three, does he go into any of what he was talking about to begin with there, anywhere else in his writings?
Yes.
In chapters 11 and 13, but also, in Romans 12 and in Romans 14; and again in Epesians 4, etc., as those sections are all mostly the issue of fellowship between Believers.
His point in the above is in the sense of "you Corinthians have the Spirit as those sealed of God; and He has made you members of one another in the Lord. He is a part of each of you; and you are each a part of Him, and by that; members of one another? Guess then, Who you are actually calling 'accursed' when ever you look down your noses at one another - The Lord!"
"That being the case; would the Spirit be One to lead you to, in a sense, call one another "accursed"? - No!"
This is the sense of his thought throughout all that.
That theirs should be the lens of Romans 5:8 - that they were all in the same boat.
As in...
Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
5:6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. 5:7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Romans 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
In Ephesians, he puts that in the following manner...
Ephesians 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love. 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers. 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. 4:31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.
1 Corinthians 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
11:33 Wherefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another.
1 Corinthians 12:1 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant. 12:2 Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led. 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. 12:5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. 12:6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
12:11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will. 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 12:14 For the body is not one member, but many. 12:15 If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? 12:16 And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?
12:20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 12:21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. 12:22 Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary: 12:23 And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness. 12:24 For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked: 12:25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. 12:26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
The thing is a doctrinal or teaching on conduct becoming of saints as to what their focus is to be throughout their dealings with one another.
As I'd noted on some other thread on ECT, bringing all those things out is accomplished through a Doctrinal Study that the Word Study of one word here and there does not really allow the far much fuller picture of.
Anyway, hope that helps.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Where? I've seen oil representing the Holy Spirit....not water.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Uh oh.....Guess we've found a place of disagreement here, Dan. But, I do enjoy your posts, nonetheless.
Lon
Well-known member
:think:
Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit
:think:
Many places. Here's one:
"Jesus answered and said to her, 'Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life." (John 4:13-14)
glorydaz
Well-known member
Nothing there about the Holy Spirit. But the living water, like the bread of life is undoubtedly related to the word of God. Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.....and this verse speaking of the word of God.
Ephesians 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Rather the Holy Spirit refers to anointing oil throughout scripture. Anointing is always with oil.
Acts 10:38
How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
Exodus 29:7 Then shalt thou take the anointing oil, and pour it upon his head, and anoint him.
Who anointed Jesus with oil?
Lon
Well-known member
Realize I'm familiar with different theological perspectives. My concern isn't that any of our respective theologies have no holes, they certainly do, especially given another's disagreement. For me, just contemplating all scriptures is ALL of our duty. We stand or fall before our Maker respectively. I am thankful to God that we stand only on the fact that He is able to make us stand. So, my desire is ever to press us all further into Jesus our Lord and Savior. :e4e: -Lon