What Does God Require For Your Salvation?

[Robert Pate]

Still carnal.....sold under sin, you say? Wretched man, you say?

Romans 6:20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.​

Romans 6:22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.​

And then we are saved. Romans 8:34


I don't believe Paul refutes that at all. In fact, Paul tells us, Philippians 4:13 "I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me."

And how to PERFORM that which is good...he finds NOT? Seriously? Romans 8:3 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Paul is not speaking of a Spirit filled life in Romans 7, but a man under the law.

Romans 7:17-18 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. 18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.​

The Christian life is a struggle between the flesh and the Spirit that continues until death.

 

[Robert Pate]

:thumb: Kind of a dead giveaway huh? Not supposed to be "in Adam" anymore.

There is no way to get rid of Adam. He will be with you till the day you die.

 

[Robert Pate]

What is the use? You have already started another thread today, and multiple threads since this one, which is standard operating procedure for you: for you start one or two threads full of your own opinions, then maybe answer a couple of times in each, but as soon as you get a little resistance up comes another thread from Robert Pate onto the board. I think the truth is that you are an old one nearing the end of life: so you are doing exactly what you accuse others of doing, you are here doing what you believe are your own good works, posting all these threads full of your own opinions and ignoring the scripture which is then posted and which refutes your own opinions, and all because you feel you do not have the time to actually engage any discussion in depth. But unfortunately, by your own admission from the scripture, your works are nothing more than filthy rags: so why do you do what you do? You do it because you actually believe that God is going to be pleased with you for abolishing His Holy Word which is His Son. You appear to have no peace, and that is likely what drives you to continue posting all these threads full of your opinions, while ignoring what the scripture actually says when it is posted in your threads. You are doing what you believe are your last good works before you die; seeking to justify yourself before men and God, before you die, because you have no true peace and it is eating you alive.

I have a spiritual obligation to try and teach unbelievers like you, the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

 

[beloved57]

I have a spiritual obligation to try and teach unbelievers like you, the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

Dont u believe and teach that people Christ died for, reconciled to God, are still lost and condemned ?

 

[Bright Raven]

Dont u believe and teach that people Christ died for, reconciled to God, are still lost and condemned ?

Romans 10:9-10 New International Version (NIV)

9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.

 

[God's Truth]

The Christian life is a struggle between the flesh and the Spirit that continues until death.

Those who fear God and have the Holy Spirit overcome.

 

[Robert Pate]

Those who fear God and have the Holy Spirit overcome.

HOGWASH!

"There is none righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10.

 

[glorydaz]

The Christian life is a struggle between the flesh and the Spirit that continues until death.

That certainly is something the enemy would like us to believe. What of the Peace that passes all understanding? What of the Rest we enter into when we believe?

Luke 16:13 No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Romans 6:17-18 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. 18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

Gal. 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

Gal. 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.​

 

[glorydaz]

Those who fear God and have the Holy Spirit overcome.

This one rejects the Gospel of Grace, so she cannot have the Holy Spirit. :chew:

 

[Robert Pate]

That certainly is something the enemy would like us to believe. What of the Peace that passes all understanding? What of the Rest we enter into when we believe?

Luke 16:13 No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Romans 6:17-18 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. 18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

Gal. 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

Gal. 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.​

So, you think that you have arrived?

The Christian lives two lives. The spiritual life where he is perfect and complete "In Christ" and the life that he lives in the flesh. Unfortunately, we only have the first fruits or the down payment of the Holy Spirit, Romans 8:23.

This causes us to groan because we have not been delivered from the bondage of corruption. But we have this hope, Romans 8:24. And with patience we wait to be delivered. And the Spirit makes intercession for us, Romans 8:26.

 

[glorydaz]

So, you think that you have arrived?

The Christian lives two lives. The spiritual life where he is perfect and complete "In Christ" and the life that he lives in the flesh. Unfortunately, we only have the first fruits or the down payment of the Holy Spirit, Romans 8:23.

This causes us to groan because we have not been delivered from the bondage of corruption. But we have this hope, Romans 8:24. And with patience we wait to be delivered. And the Spirit makes intercession for us, Romans 8:26.

We "groan" waiting the redemption of this body at the resurrection. That doesn't mean we groan in an inability to live righteous lives while we walk this earth. Calling ourselves "sinners" is NOT correct. It only joins the accuser in his efforts to make us feel hopeless here on earth...wretched men who cannot do what we want to do. That isn't us. We are not wretched. We are to have faith in the reality that we are dead to sin. It has no more power over us (but what we allow because of our doubt).

The bondage we were under, was the bondage of the law that was always accusing us as sinners. Being in the flesh is a drag, but it doesn't make us servants of sin.

 

[Robert Pate]

We "groan" waiting the redemption of this body at the resurrection. That doesn't mean we groan in an inability to live righteous lives while we walk this earth. Calling ourselves "sinners" is NOT correct. It only joins the accuser in his efforts to make us feel hopeless here on earth...wretched men who cannot do what we want to do. That isn't us. We are not wretched. We are to have faith in the reality that we are dead to sin. It has no more power over us (but what we allow because of our doubt).

The bondage we were under, was the bondage of the law that was always accusing us as sinners. Being in the flesh is a drag, but it doesn't make us servants of sin.

Paul referred to himself as "The Chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. And then he spoke about his struggle with sin in Romans 7;13-25. We never reach the point where we think that we have arrived. We remain needy sinners, always in need of God's mercy and grace.

As long as we are in these Adamic bodies we are sinners, saved sinners, but still sinners. But we have hope. Paul said, "Hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man sees then why does he hope for it" Romans 8:24. Paul saw himself as a wretched man. He even referred to himself as "carnal sold under sin". But then he had hope that he would be delivered from sin, death and the devil, Romans 8:25.

I say live the Christian life the best that you can, always trusting in Christ and his Gospel.

 

[glorydaz]

Paul referred to himself as "The Chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15.

I understand what you're saying, but I have to disagree. When Paul says he was the "chief" of sinners, he certainly did not mean he was the worst sinner ever. He tells us he was blameless under the law. Philippians 3:6

Paul is speaking of his being the first (for a pattern) of those who would be saved hereafter.

1 Tim. 1:9-16 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine; 11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust. 12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry; 13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief. 14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus. 15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. 16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.​

And then he spoke about his struggle with sin in Romans 7;13-25. We never reach the point where we think that we have arrived. We remain needy sinners, always in need of God's mercy and grace.

Paul was speaking as a man under the law in chapter 7. He was a man most wretched because the law had dominion over him. The struggle you speak of is what those who attempt to keep the law by their own efforts have to endure.

Romans 7
7 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?​

As long as we are in these Adamic bodies we are sinners, saved sinners, but still sinners. But we have hope. Paul said, "Hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man sees then why does he hope for it" Romans 8:24. Paul saw himself as a wretched man. He even referred to himself as "carnal sold under sin". But then he had hope that he would be delivered from sin, death and the devil, Romans 8:25.

I say live the Christian life the best that you can, always trusting in Christ and his Gospel.

I say the same, Robert, believing, as Paul says, that we are dead to sin. Sin really has no more dominion over us. We have been delivered from the law, and satan has no room to accuse us of sin. EVER.

So, was Paul carnal and sold under sin after he was created IN CHRIST Jesus....a new creation? Of course not. He was NOT carnal. He goes on to tell us why.

Romans 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.​

 

[fishrovmen]

We "groan" waiting the redemption of this body at the resurrection. That doesn't mean we groan in an inability to live righteous lives while we walk this earth. Calling ourselves "sinners" is NOT correct. It only joins the accuser in his efforts to make us feel hopeless here on earth...wretched men who cannot do what we want to do. That isn't us. We are not wretched. We are to have faith in the reality that we are dead to sin. It has no more power over us (but what we allow because of our doubt).

The bondage we were under, was the bondage of the law that was always accusing us as sinners. Being in the flesh is a drag, but it doesn't make us servants of sin.

Well said!

 

[Robert Pate]

I understand what you're saying, but I have to disagree. When Paul says he was the "chief" of sinners, he certainly did not mean he was the worst sinner ever. He tells us he was blameless under the law. Philippians 3:6

Paul is speaking of his being the first (for a pattern) of those who would be saved hereafter.

1 Tim. 1:9-16 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine; 11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust. 12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry; 13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief. 14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus. 15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. 16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.​

Paul was speaking as a man under the law in chapter 7. He was a man most wretched because the law had dominion over him. The struggle you speak of is what those who attempt to keep the law by their own efforts have to endure.

Romans 7
7 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?​

I say the same, Robert, believing, as Paul says, that we are dead to sin. Sin really has no more dominion over us. We have been delivered from the law, and satan has no room to accuse us of sin. EVER.

So, was Paul carnal and sold under sin after he was created IN CHRIST Jesus....a new creation? Of course not. He was NOT carnal. He goes on to tell us why.

Romans 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.​

Philippians 3:6 was about when Paul was a Pharisee.

The reason that Paul was a wretched man was because as long as a man lives he is under the law.

The only strength that a Christian has is in the "knowing".

We know and believe that we have been justified by the doing and the dying of Jesus.

We know that we are perfect and complete "in Christ".

We know that we are not under the law, but under grace.

We know that our salvation is secure in Christ.

We know that sin, death and the devil have been destroyed.

It is called living by faith.

 

[glorydaz]

The reason that Paul was a wretched man was because as long as a man lives he is under the law.

Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

 

[Robert Pate]

Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

We know that, but we are not "In Christ" yet. We are still here on this dreadful planet in these corrupt Adamic bodies.

Spiritually, we are free from sin and death, but not physically.

 

[glorydaz]

We know that, but we are not "In Christ" yet. We are still here on this dreadful planet in these corrupt Adamic bodies.

Spiritually, we are free from sin and death, but not physically.

Of course we are IN CHRIST.

We are hid with Christ in God the minute we believe.

What does it matter that this tent we dwell in still keeps us bound to this earth?

Colossians 3:2-4
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. 3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. 4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.​

 

[Robert Pate]

Of course we are IN CHRIST.

We are hid with Christ in God the minute we believe.

What does it matter that this tent we dwell in still keeps us bound to this earth?

Colossians 3:2-4
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. 3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. 4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.​

All that I am saying is that we will have to deal with the flesh even though we know that we sit in heavenly places in Jesus Christ, Ephesians 2:6.

 

[john w]

We know that, but we are not "In Christ" yet.

Another made up Pate-ism.


Shut up, as Christianity, is all about being "in Christ."