This Black WAS abused by cops.. Sandra Bland

[fool]

No, it's not like that and you're missing the point if so which for you, I honestly find surprising. I for one am not arguing that cops should not have authority or be able to enforce such when applicable. With the personal anecdote I supplied you with beforehand do you think the cop acted appropriately or too leniently with me? If you answer this then explain your answer one way or the other thanks.

Refresh my memory, you were jogging at 2 am near a mineshaft and something was stolen by a man fitting your description somewhere near by shortly before?

Sounded like you and the Constable handled it.
I've been in similar situations only not jogging, or near a mineshaft but it was two in the morning (standard time East Coast DST on however that works out in metric, but pretty late or early depending on culture).

I much like you presented my ID and gave an account of my whereabouts and we parted ways with no problem.

 

[GFR7]

Just placing this OpEd here as part of the collection of links:
GFR

Sandra Bland's fate sealed by bad policing

Her suicide is questionable, but it's clear the trooper is morally guilty.

Sandra Bland is dead because of the treatment she received at the hands of Brian Encinia.

While the question of whether the 28-year-old Illinois woman actually committed suicide after her encounter with the Texas state trooper landed her in jail is being debated, what’s certain is that it was Encinia’s bad policing that put Bland on a rendezvous with death.

After stopping her for changing lanes without signaling — a minor traffic infraction — Encinia behaved more like a thin-skinned guy with a gun than an officer of the law when he sensed that Bland was really irritated that he pulled her over.

Returning to her car after writing a warning ticket, an action that would have sent Bland on her way had he simply given it to her, Encinia didn’t tell Bland he was about to let her go. Instead, as she sat in her car smoking a cigarette and looking away from him, Encinia picked a fight.

“You mind putting out your cigarette, please? If you don’t mind,” he said to Bland.

...........................

A close reading of the transcript of this encounter also shows that Encinia misled his supervisor on another point when he radioed in his account of what happened. “I tried to de-escalate her. It wasn’t getting anywhere, at all. I mean I tried to put the Taser away. I tried talking to her and calming her down, and that was not working,” he said.

In fact, he did just the opposite. When Encinia returned to Bland's car with a warning ticket, he could have simply handed it over and let her drive off. But she was still smarting over being stopped, and he didn’t like her attitude. He extended the traffic stop for no good reason, which is something the Supreme Court said this year in Rodriguez v. United States that cops can’t do.

http://www.usatoday.com/opinion/

 

[Arthur Brain]

Refresh my memory, you were jogging at 2 am near a mineshaft and something was stolen by a man fitting your description somewhere near by shortly before?

Sounded like you and the Constable handled it.
I've been in similar situations only not jogging, or near a mineshaft but it was two in the morning (standard time East Coast DST on however that works out in metric, but pretty late or early depending on culture).

I much like you presented my ID and gave an account of my whereabouts and we parted ways with no problem.

I was jogging home but thankfully away from precarious mineshafts, jogging not really being a sensible option if such were there...

However, you haven't answered my question. Did this cop act too leniently with me even though I was thoroughly cooperative? Should he have had the right to slap me in cuffs with regards to the above and without anything other than a vague profile fit, taking into account that I was again - fully cooperative?

I'll say this much. The officer that night was a credit to the force over here. He was polite, courteous, and explained exactly why he needed to search me before I actually gave my permission which I gladly did as I had nothing to hide.

 

[The Barbarian]

Texas does not require you to roll your window down more than is necessary to communicate.

A crack is sufficient, although it's always possible that the officer might get offended and escalate.

 

[The Barbarian]

I would never step foot in a state like TX. It's full of rednecks and illiterates.

fool writes:

And steers.
Don't forget them.

Most illiterate rednecks in Texas are steers. Or the human equivalent.

 

[The Barbarian]

Yes, I've seen one stopped at a DWI checkpoint, and refuse to answer whether he had been drinking that night. I've seen people refuse to give their license and registration.

Strictly speaking, there has to be an articulable reason, even if operating a vehicle, in most states, to show ID. And of course, no one is compelled to say whether or not they've been drinking.

I saw a woman who refused to pull her vehicle over to secondary when the officer asked.

Most states, it there's a reasonable suspicion of criminal activity, you are required to do so. But not otherwise. Police can't just order you around on a whim.

It's quite educational. They are all white, btw.

I don't think the problem is racism so much as it's about people they perceive as powerless, and therefore abusable.

 

[GFR7]

I don't think the problem is racism so much as it's about people they perceive as powerless, and therefore abusable.

I agree; it's more economic than racist. A poor white person or a poor person of any ethnicity would be treated badly. The powerless are sitting ducks before police these days.

I recall a different time when it was far less widespread than now. Certainly people were not jailed for traffic violations or rudeness, nor for many things that now get people incarcerated and caught up in a system they'll never fully be free of.

I don't know if people realize that since 1980 the police forces increased in an unprecedented way, and became militant in a uniform way not seen prior. It has become a truism:

 

[The Barbarian]

Militarization is a major problem with police today. Often, it leads to use of military equipment and tactics when old school police could handle things with a lot less drama.

 

[HisServant]

I agree; it's more economic than racist. A poor white person or a poor person of any ethnicity would be treated badly. The powerless are sitting ducks before police these days.

I recall a different time when it was far less widespread than now. Certainly people were not jailed for traffic violations or rudeness, nor for many things that now get people incarcerated and caught up in a system they'll never fully be free of.

I don't know if people realize that since 1980 the police forces increased in an unprecedented way, and became militant in a uniform way not seen prior. It has become a truism:

When we refused to teach our children discipline and the need to stay out of the way of the law.

Its a natural response to the way kids in general view the police and government these days.

 

[bybee]

Militarization is a major problem with police today. Often, it leads to use of military equipment and tactics when old school police could handle things with a lot less drama.

Police, today, in many instances, are dealing with whole neighborhoods of violence and aggression.
The blatant hatred of police officers makes it dangerous for them to "Walk the beat" with just a night stick for keeping the peace.

 

[bybee]

Militarization is a major problem with police today. Often, it leads to use of military equipment and tactics when old school police could handle things with a lot less drama.

Well, when the drama is coming from within the neighborhood via rioting, arson, assault, looting, perhaps the police should just hang back and say "Jeepers you guys, this is not very nice, but it is your neighborhood and we don't want to hurt your feelings so we'll just leave you to settle your own problems".

 

[fool]

I was jogging home but thankfully away from precarious mineshafts, jogging not really being a sensible option if such were there...

However, you haven't answered my question. Did this cop act too leniently with me even though I was thoroughly cooperative? Should he have had the right to slap me in cuffs with regards to the above and without anything other than a vague profile fit, taking into account that I was again - fully cooperative?

In the US he could put you in cuffs and frisked you for his own safety while he conducted his investigation.
Was he too lenient when he didn't? Perhaps not but he took a risk in not doing so because you could have been the perp and just playing it cool until you saw a chance to stab him.

I'll say this much. The officer that night was a credit to the force over here. He was polite, courteous, and explained exactly why he needed to search me before I actually gave my permission which I gladly did as I had nothing to hide.

Sounds like it went well.

 

[bybee]

In the US he could put you in cuffs and frisked you for his own safety while he conducted his investigation.
Was he too lenient when he didn't? Perhaps not but he took a risk in not doing so because you could have been the perp and just playing it cool until you saw a chance to stab him.

Sounds like it went well.

Exactly! When civilized persons interact the object is problem solving.

 

[MarcATL]

Failure to signal a lane change.

Think about that for a moment.

 

[King cobra]

Think about that for a moment.

She failed to signal.
According to a 2012 SAE study, a conservative estimate of one million crashes could be prevented in the U.S. if turn signals were appropriately used.
She failed to signal.

She ran a stop sign.
According to the Fatality Analysis Reporting System, 13,627 vehicles were involved in fatal crashes at stop signs in 1999 and 2000 - 21% failed to obey the sign and 23% failed to yield the right-of-way.
She ran a stop sign.

 

[GFR7]

Think about that for a moment.

The worst of it is, the trooper was spoiling for a fight when he needlessly asked her to extinguish her cigarette. It was all downhill from there, with threats of violence and brutal actions on his part. This second phase became it's own separate traffic stop, leaving the turn signal issue in the dust.

 

[Rusha]

The worst of it is, the trooper was spoiling for a fight when he needlessly asked her to extinguish her cigarette. .

As it was explained to you (several times), it wasn't *needless*. SHE was spoiling for a fight via her refusal and sarcasm.

She failed to signal.
According to a 2012 SAE study, a conservative estimate of one million crashes could be prevented in the U.S. if turn signals were appropriately used.
She failed to signal.

She ran a stop sign.
According to the Fatality Analysis Reporting System, 13,627 vehicles were involved in fatal crashes at stop signs in 1999 and 2000 - 21% failed to obey the sign and 23% failed to yield the right-of-way.
She ran a stop sign.

:thumb:

 

[Rusha]

Exactly! When civilized persons interact the object is problem solving.

THAT is the difference .... the woman (from the story) was spoiling for a fight, regardless of how a few would like to pretend she didn't escalate the situation by refusing to comply with a justifiable request.

 

[GFR7]

THAT is the difference .... the woman (from the story) was spoiling for a fight, regardless of how a few would like to pretend she didn't escalate the situation by refusing to comply with a justifiable request.

That is not the way the Texas Department of Public Safety saw it, nor a myriad of attorneys, nor journalists who viewed the footage from the New Yorker, Rolling Stone, USA Today, and other papers - although I cannot say I respect all of these publications in general.

 

[rexlunae]

As it was explained to you (several times), it wasn't *needless*. SHE was spoiling for a fight via her refusal and sarcasm.



:thumb:

She clearly wasn't happy, and wasn't very nice. But the obligations are very different. A police officer is supposed to be a keeper of the peace. They must be able to handle conflicts without escalating them, otherwise there's no reason to pay them to do what they do. That's his job, for which he is expected to be professional. And his bosses seemed to kinda agree with that. She, on the other hand, is not working at the moment she is pulled over, nor is there any reason to think she'd be trained in conflict resolution, and it is she who is having their rights curtailed, no matter how justifiable you think it is. She has a right to be annoyed, and to express that annoyance.