The Trinity

The Trinity


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Bright Raven

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Jesus Christ paid the needed price, but he was sent by his God to do it. He is the Messiah because his God made him so. Jesus was called Master because he had all the answers as to who God is.

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You are no using that translation properly. Of course, why would you. You don't handle any of the others properly either.
 

Rivers

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It does not say Jesus made the ages. You assume to much. Jesus was born to Mary many years after the creation. He did not pre-exist.

Hebrews 1:2 says that God "made the ages (AIWNAS) through" Jesus Christ. The beginning of the verse indicates that this happened in "these last days." Jesus didn't exist prior to the last days.
 

Bright Raven

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It does not say Jesus made the ages. You assume to much. Jesus was born to Mary many years after the creation. He did not pre-exist.

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Yes He did.

John 1:1King James Version (KJV)

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


Colossians 1:16 King James Version (KJV)

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
 

keypurr

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Hebrews 1:2 says that God "made the ages (AIWNAS) through" Jesus Christ. The beginning of the verse indicates that this happened in "these last days." Jesus didn't exist prior to the last days.

Hebrews 1:2

(KJV) Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

(ESV) but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.

(NRSV) but in these last days he has spoken to us by a Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, through whom he also created the worlds.

(NKJV) has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds;

(NASB) in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.

(NIV) but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.

I do not see the words Jesus Christ in this verse.


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keypurr

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I don't see any indication that the apostles believe in a "spirit son"? Where are you getting that language from scripture?

Heb 1:3 is one that needs deep thought. The express image of a spirit is not a man, it would be a spirit as God is a spirit. Start there. Then go to Col 1:15 and Phil 2. Then in Heb 10:5 you will see that Christ needed a body prepared for him. Why?


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keypurr

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Yes He did.

John 1:1King James Version (KJV)

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.


Colossians 1:16 King James Version (KJV)

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Oh BR, you still do not understand that the logos is NOT Jesus. It is the spirit son that God sent, not the son that was born. The worlds were not created by a man. The express image is the son he used in the creation. Christ is God's first creation for all things were created through him.

We must put he pieces together to see truth friend. Jesus became the Christ when Christ took over his body that God prepared for him. The spirit became flesh. Jesus was born NOT SENT.


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Bright Raven

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Oh BR, you still do not understand that the logos is NOT Jesus. It is the spirit son that God sent, not the son that was born. The worlds were not created by a man. The express image is the son he used in the creation. Christ is God's first creation for all things were created through him.

We must put he pieces together to see truth friend. Jesus became the Christ when Christ took over his body that God prepared for him. The spirit became flesh. Jesus was born NOT SENT.


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Ah Keypurr, who is the Logos in John 1:14?

John 1:14 King James Version (KJV)

14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
 

keypurr

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Ah Keypurr, who is the Logos in John 1:14?

John 1:14 King James Version (KJV)

14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Proof that the word was Not flesh but BECAME flesh.

How did the word become flesh?

First we must see that the word is not a human until it became flesh.

Next we must try to understand how it could become flesh.

Heb 10:5 gives us some insight friend. Christ is speaking about a BODY prepared for him. Christ needed a body, why?

So he could become flesh.

BR, I am trying so hard to find the words to explain my thoughts to you, but I have failed. I will never give up.


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Bright Raven

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Proof that the word was Not flesh but BECAME flesh.

How did the word become flesh?

First we must see that the word is not a human until it became flesh.

Next we must try to understand how it could become flesh.

Heb 10:5 gives us some insight friend. Christ is speaking about a BODY prepared for him. Christ needed a body, why?

So he could become flesh.

BR, I am trying so hard to find the words to explain my thoughts to you, but I have failed. I will never give up.


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The question remains. Who was the Word? Why don't you believe?
 

keypurr

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The question remains. Who was the Word? Why don't you believe?

I believe that the logos is the true son that was sent to us. That son is the express image of our God. It is a spirit being like his Father. Jesus is the flesh son, he is the human body prepared to hold the true spirit son on Earth. This spirit spoke and acted through Jesus.

Christ became flesh, he was a spirit before that. God created all through this spirit.


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Bright Raven

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I believe that the logos is the true son that was sent to us. That son is the express image of our God. It is a spirit being like his Father. Jesus is the flesh son, he is the human body prepared to hold the true spirit son on Earth. This spirit spoke and acted through Jesus.

Christ became flesh, he was a spirit before that. God created all through this spirit.
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Jesus is the Savior of the world. Can you really fathom that? Who is the Saviour but God almighty.

Isaiah 45:21King James Version (KJV)

21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the Lord? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
 

Rivers

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Heb 1:3 is one that needs deep thought. The express image of a spirit is not a man, it would be a spirit as God is a spirit.

You're logic doesn't follow here because you are assuming that XARAKTHR ("image") refers to something ontological which isn't required by the context. Moreover, Hebrews 1:3 does not say anything about "spirit."

Start there. Then go to Col 1:15 and Phil 2.

Neither of these passages mentions anything about a "spirit" or "spirit son" either. You seem to be imagining that idea into various passages without any exegetical reason to justify it.

Then in Heb 10:5 you will see that Christ needed a body prepared for him. Why?

This passages is simply referring to the fact that the human body of Jesus was "offered" as a sacrifice for sins (Hebrews 10:10). There's nothing in this passage about a "spirit son" either. The writer of Hebrews understood that Jesus was an ordinary human being like all the other Israelites (Hebrews 2:14).


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Rivers

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Hebrews 1:2

(NIV) but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.

I do not see the words Jesus Christ in this verse.


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There is no word "spirit" in this verse either. The "son" refers to Jesus Christ, who was a human being like all the other Israelites (Hebrews 2:14).
 

keypurr

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You're logic doesn't follow here because you are assuming that XARAKTHR ("image") refers to something ontological which isn't required by the context. Moreover, Hebrews 1:3 does not say anything about "spirit."



Neither of these passages mentions anything about a "spirit" or "spirit son" either. You seem to be imagining that idea into various passages without any exegetical reason to justify it.



This passages is simply referring to the fact that the human body of Jesus was "offered" as a sacrifice for sins (Hebrews 10:10). There's nothing in this passage about a "spirit son" either. The writer of Hebrews understood that Jesus was an ordinary human being like all the other Israelites (Hebrews 2:14).


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[/QUOTE]

First you need to see that God is a spirit. Jesus told you that.

Next, see where God made his express or exact image and through that image created all. Heb 1 and Col 1:15.

This image is referred to as the son at the creation. He was given the full power of his creator, for God was pleased that he had his fullness.

Now look at Heb 10:5, Christ, the spirit son, speaks of a body prepared for him. He needed a body to dwell in when the time was right for him to be sent to us. Proof that there is a spirit son.

Looking at Act 10:38 we can easily see that Jesus got his POWER when he was anointed with it. Christ took over the flesh of Jesus and spoke and acted through it. Jesus is flesh but the spirit in him is a form of God. Phil 2.

Folks do not understand that Jesus was not born as Christ, be became Christ when Christ went IN him. Christ came with power.

Ponder over that and see if it just might be right.






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