ECT The Kingdom of Heaven and the Kingdom of God are the same.

I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Danoh said:
No, brother, you are.

But we both know where that gets us given your unwillingness to explore it in the same breath that you assert your conclusion to one and all as the only sound one.

In which case, hats off to ya, back at ya, bro...

For we both appear to be fine with where we are each at.

And... It also saves me the trouble of all the passages that attempting to bring you up to speed on this would require.

Ephesians 2's "far off" is not Acts 2's "far off." Acts 2's is physical; Ephesians 2's is spiritual.

Seriously, it is a lot of work.

So, I am at the same time grateful you are content where you are.

The best to you in this.
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Danoh's comment on Eph 2 above is worthless. It is clearly a parallel to being without God, hope and covenants. But I don't know that Danoh does anything but read single isolated verses for soundbytes, and I can't do anything about that. He's gone MAD.
 
D

Danoh

New member
Interplanner said:
Danoh's comment on Eph 2 above is worthless. It is clearly a parallel to being without God, hope and covenants. But I don't know that Danoh does anything but read single isolated verses for soundbytes, and I can't do anything about that. He's gone MAD.
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Lol - you idiot; that IS the very "spiritual" I was referring to that the Gentiles are said to have been "far off" from in Eph. 2.

It refers to the SPIRITUAL condition the Gentiles had been left in by God way back in Genesis 11, see the latter half of Acts 17 and the latter half of Romans 1.

Whereas Acts 2's "far off" is Daniel 9's "far off" as to those Israelites PHYSICALLY dispersed among Gentile nations.

You never appear to catch that only Israelites are referred to as "the children of God," and that God is referred to by them as "our God," and or "the God of our fathers."

Not so, the Gentiles "at that time" they "were far off" SPIRITUALLY, including the Ephesian Gentiles; despite the synagogues in their midst, meaning the witness within their midst as to the existence of the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Lol - I'm surprised you don't conclude I am referring to a Law firm by my mentioning of those three names.
 
G

Grosnick Marowbe

New member
Hall of Fame
Lazy afternoon said:
Kingdom of Heaven Kingdom of God
Mat 4:17 Mark 1:14
Mat 5:3 Luke 6:20
Mat 10:7 Luke 9:2
Mat 11:11 Luke 7:28
Mat 13:11 Luke 8:10
Mat 13:31 Luke 13:18, 19
Mat 19:14 Mark 4:30, 31
Mat 19:23, 24 Luke 18:24


LA
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Those verses were meant for the lost sheep of the House of Israel. What point, if any, are you trying to make? Perhaps someday you'll gain some knowledge? Or, perhaps not?
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
SaulToPaul said:
I concur.
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And yet in most posts, Danoh is the one complaining that 'physical' is here, 'spiritual' is there.

His comment is not worthwhile. Anyone looking at the context of Eph 2 can see that far off was parallel to dead, hopeless, without covenants, etc.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Grosnick Marowbe said:

Those verses were meant for the lost sheep of the House of Israel. What point, if any, are you trying to make? Perhaps someday you'll gain some knowledge? Or, perhaps not?
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But no verse of the Bible ultimately is for one group and not another. The reason for the missional focus on the lost sheep was to leverage their background in concepts like redemption, atonement, propitiation so that the Gospel version (vs the Levitical version) of those would be made clear to anyone whom the speaker addressed in future mission work.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
patrick jane said:
Ephesians 2:11 KJV - Ephesians 2:12 KJV -
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Ahh, but is that because of what the text said or because of what post-exilic Judaism said? HUGE question. When Paul speaks, he speaks as raised in post-exilic Judaism. When Christ speaks and acts, it is about post-exilic Judaism. Rom 10:1-4 is describing post-exilic Judaism.

I say this because when we debate whether the OT mentioned blessing and the mission to the nations, we are not debating the same thing.
 
God's Truth

God's Truth

New member
SaulToPaul said:
Gen 12:1-3 (KJV). There are Jews and Gentiles in this promise.
And there are Gentiles excluded from this promise. Like the Ephesians, you, and me.
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Prophecies of Jesus fulfilled, as shown by Gentiles believing in God---

so that the Gentiles may glorify God for his mercy, as it is written: “therefore I will praise you among the Gentiles; I will sing hymns to your name.”
Again, it says,
“Rejoice, O Gentiles, with his people.”
And again,
“Praise the Lord, all you Gentiles,
And sing praises to him, all you
Peoples.”
And again, Isaiah says,
“The Root of Jesse will spring up,
one who will arise to rule over the
Nations;
The Gentiles will hope in him.”

Read this Old Testament scripture, it is quoted in the New Testament:

2 Samuel 22:50 Therefore I will praise you, LORD, among the nations; I will sing the praises of your name.

Romans 15:9
and, moreover, that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy. As it is written: "Therefore I will praise you among the Gentiles; I will sing the praises of your name."

...And these scriptures:

Romans 15:11
And again, "Praise the Lord, all you Gentiles; let all the peoples extol him."

Psalm 117:1 Praise the LORD, all you nations; extol him, all you peoples.

Psalm 66:4 All the earth bows down to you; they sing praise to you, they sing the praises of your name."
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Good start GT, there are 2500 quotes or clips of the OT by the NT. It should be a science in itself, but instead everyone follows the modern D'ist experts.
 
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