School is open; Topic Paul

Bee1

Bee1

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Paul the Apostle, the cornerstone of Christianity, told by Jesus himself to go preach his ministry worldwide.Paul who once called Saul of Tarsus,avid persercutor of early Christian church. Now when and where his name change from Saul to Paul is so subtle that it is hardy notice.Ok, we have Saul of Tarsus on his merry way to Damasus to imprison and eventually kill as many early Christians as he can find,men and women.On his way he has a epiphany,he meets Jesus (who calls him Saul)and told to go to town and be told to spread Jesus's words near and far. Now as far as I know God only change two peoples' name in the Bible and that was Abram and Jacob.

But I am getting ahead of myself let's take this road trip to Damasus.


Acts 9:3-9


3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:

4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

7 And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.

8 And Saul arose from the earth; and when his eyes were opened, he saw no man: but they led him by the hand, and brought him into Damascus.

9 And he was three days without sight, and neither did eat nor drink.

Now the second retelling by Saul

Acts 22:9-10

9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.

10 And I said, What shall I do, Lord? And the Lord said unto me, Arise, and go into Damascus; and there it shall be told thee of all things which are appointed for thee to do.




Now in Acts 9:7 The people who were with Saul heard a voice but saw no man

Now in Acts 22:9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.


Now which one is it Saul, the people hear a sound but saw no light or the people saw the light but heard no sound? And why was Saul the only one that was blinded if everybody saw the light? Its gets better.

Now in Acts 26:13-14

13 At midday, O king, I saw in the way a light from heaven, above the brightness of the sun, shining round about me and them which journeyed with me.

14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

Now it seems everyone experienced the same thing. "We were all fallen" was never recounted before. Three 3 different version from a man that changes his own name to fit his agenda. Where are the witnesses to this 180-degree makeover? Looks like the NT could as least named one 1 witness to this Saul/Paul transformation. The holy spirit did not call him Paul? So why are you? Because it is in your Bible and that make's it gospel !
Once Saul was on his way again as a convert was he address as Paul. No Godly intervention, no fanfare nothing. I am no Theologian but if I find discrepancies like this and I do not read the Bible on a daily or weekly bases then I know someone else has pointed this out. And I looked in several different Bibles and found the older the manuscript the bigger the disparity. Or maybe this is just a minor technicality, nothing to worry about Saul/Paul is still the man?
 
Bee1

Bee1

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Jacob said:
Because was it Abram or Abraham's wife that is the or an exception to your rule?
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What rule is that? The two people who God changed name Abram to Abramham and Jacob to Israel. Are there more?

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john w

john w

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Bee1 said:
What rule is that? The two people who God changed name Abram to Abramham and Jacob to Israel. Are there more?

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Genesis 17 KJV
15 And God said unto Abraham, As for Sarai thy wife, thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be.


Genesis 41 KJV
45 And Pharaoh called Joseph’s name Zaphnath-paaneah; and he gave him to wife Asenath the daughter of Poti-pherah priest of On. And Joseph went out over all the land of Egypt.

2 Kings 24 KJV
17 And the king of Babylon made Mattaniah his father’s brother king in his stead, and changed his name to Zedekiah.




Numbers 13 KJV
16 These are the names of the men which Moses sent to spy out the land. And Moses called Oshea the son of Nun Jehoshua.


Ruth 1

20 And she said unto them, Call me not Naomi, call me Mara: for the Almighty hath dealt very bitterly with me.



Daniel 1 KJV
7 Unto whom the prince of the eunuchs gave names: for he gave unto Daniel the name of Belteshazzar; and to Hananiah, of Shadrach; and to Mishael, of Meshach; and to Azariah, of Abednego.
 
Bee1

Bee1

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john w said:
Genesis 17 KJV
15 And God said unto Abraham, As for Sarai thy wife, thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be.


Genesis 41 KJV
45 And Pharaoh called Joseph’s name Zaphnath-paaneah; and he gave him to wife Asenath the daughter of Poti-pherah priest of On. And Joseph went out over all the land of Egypt.

2 Kings 24 KJV
17 And the king of Babylon made Mattaniah his father’s brother king in his stead, and changed his name to Zedekiah.




Numbers 13 KJV
16 These are the names of the men which Moses sent to spy out the land. And Moses called Oshea the son of Nun Jehoshua.


Ruth 1

20 And she said unto them, Call me not Naomi, call me Mara: for the Almighty hath dealt very bitterly with me.



Daniel 1 KJV
7 Unto whom the prince of the eunuchs gave names: for he gave unto Daniel the name of Belteshazzar; and to Hananiah, of Shadrach; and to Mishael, of Meshach; and to Azariah, of Abednego.
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Ok so who change Saul to Paul?

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john w

john w

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Bee1 said:
Ok so who change Saul to Paul?

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His name was not changed-he was still called "Saul" in Acts 9, .....

Acts 26 KJV

14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.



...."post conversion" by the Lord Jesus Christ. The custom of dual names was common in "those days."

Acts 13 KJV
2 As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them...............................................
9 Then Saul, (who also is called Paul,) filled with the Holy Ghost, set his eyes on him,

=same person.

"also"=his "Roman"/"Greek" name...


The "shift," by the "writer" of Acts, possibly "Dr." Luke:

Acts 13 KJV
13 Now when Paul and his company loosed from Paphos, they came to Perga in Pamphylia: and John departing from them returned to Jerusalem.




Survey:


1 Corinthians 9:19-23 KJV
19 For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more. 20 And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; 21 to them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law. 22 To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some. 23 And this I do for the gospel’s sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.


Many biblical figures in the book have two given names....
 
Tambora

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Bee1 said:
And Paul's conflicting accounts in Acts?
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Do they conflict, or are you reading something into it that is not there?
Or perhaps you are being way too rigid with the language and meanings of words used in your trollish attempts to discredit scripture.
Hearing the noise doesn't automatically mean you hear the words.
Use your noggin for some common sense at times, and you might be able to solve some puzzles for yourself.
 
john w

john w

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Bee1 said:
And Paul's conflicting accounts in Acts?

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Translation: You're an outed troll, not here to learn, edify others, but to "prove" that you are right. No, troll, do not confuse your lack of reading comprehension skills, and lack of spiritual discernment, for any alleged "conflicting accounts in Acts," or in the bible. The bible is correct. You are wrong. It corrects you, not vice verse.
 
D

Danoh

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Jacob said:
Today is Shishi, Ziv 5. It is night.

Some people say that Saul's name was changed to Paul.
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It's more like a man who is referred to as Juan by fellow Hispanics, and as John by others outside of his Hispanic culture.

I knew a Ukrainian guy who's family and culture referred to him as Valodja.

Outside of that, he was known as Walter.

Born here, and given his American name here, but raised in Hong Kong, the late martial arts legend and international action super star: Bruce Lee, was referred to as Li Jun Fan and or Li Siu Loong back in Hong Kong, where he grew up.

That sort of thing.

Saul the Jew.

Paul the Roman citizen.

Acts 9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

Acts 22:25 And as they bound him with thongs, Paul said unto the centurion that stood by, Is it lawful for you to scourge a man that is a Roman, and uncondemned?

Acts 22:3 I am verily a man which am a Jew, born in Tarsus, a city in Cilicia, yet brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel, and taught according to the perfect manner of the law of the fathers, and was zealous toward God, as ye all are this day.

Acts 17:11, 12.
 
Jacob

Jacob

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Danoh said:
It's more like a man who is referred to as Juan by fellow Hispanics, and as John by others outside of his Hispanic culture.

I knew a Ukrainian guy who's family and culture referred to him as Valodja.

Outside of that, he was known as Walter.

Born here, and given his American name here, but raised in Hong Kong, the late martial arts legend and international action super star: Bruce Lee, was referred to as Li Jun Fan and or Li Siu Loong back in Hong Kong, where he grew up.

That sort of thing.

Saul the Jew.

Paul the Roman citizen.

Acts 9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

Acts 22:25 And as they bound him with thongs, Paul said unto the centurion that stood by, Is it lawful for you to scourge a man that is a Roman, and uncondemned?

Acts 22:3 I am verily a man which am a Jew, born in Tarsus, a city in Cilicia, yet brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel, and taught according to the perfect manner of the law of the fathers, and was zealous toward God, as ye all are this day.

Acts 17:11, 12.
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Wow! Now that is dangerous speech!

Saul's name was not changed to Paul by virtue of becoming a Roman. The question for you might be which name he had first.
 
C

chair

Well-known member
Stuu said:
Hang on a minute there. Jesus was dead at this stage.

Stuart
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Saul had some kind of personal vision. If the vision was true- great! But if it was false- just a hallucination- then Christianity as we know it is based on one man's delusion? That couldn't possibly be the case. Therefore Saul / Paul had a true vision. Logic- see?
 
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