Proof from the Bible that God is In Time

[Lighthouse]

This is still an open view paradigm that places constraints on God that cannot be there. A few for instances:
1) that God's 'now' is everywhere (omnipresent). Your and my 'now' is a culmination of past and present and future events that collide. Because we are not omnipresent but finite to a spot with only a singular perception. The sunlight, by which you are able to see during the day took 8 minutes to reach you. That light given off happened 8 minutes ago. If the sun were turned off, you'd not know it for 8 minutes. God would have already know it because He is not bound to any physical part of the universe. His "now" and our "now" are two separate things. He is both light years away now, and here now.
Example: We will not see a star that explodes off in the distance happening now, in our lifetime or even our great great granchild's lifetime. God sees it 'now.' We see some stars exploding on our telescopes just 'now' but it happened a very long time ago to God's now and we are only just seeing it. Our 'now' is a collision of past and future at a particular instance of inspection.

2) Because God is eternal, there is never a moment where any one thing collides forcing Him into that moment. Again, think of a star exploding across the galaxies. Again, realize we will never see it happen and it will take many many generations before our children's children see the event. You and I will be dead by then and never see it, yet it happened and God has already seen it. Yet, even as such is so many years away, here so many light years away from that explosion, God is seeing you reading this text just now. They happen simultaneously but everything in the universe happens simultaneously with God. If it is dark where you are, it is light on the other side of the world and so this so called 'day' is neither for God. It is a collision of events that we 'finite beings' happen to observe at one point, place and call it a 'moment.' That definiting 'moment' alone, cannot exist for God. He is beyond it.


Yes, I understand it appearing dumb. I think it is rather that he didn't explain this in a way that makes sense. It is beyond our 5 senses and so requires that it be explained at least beyond our 5 senses with a bit of logic or it cannot be grasped as true. God's day is completely different than your and my 24 hour period. God doesn't experience periods as you and I but many infinite periods beyond our comprehension in the moment it takes for us to experience what we think of as a 'moment.'

-Lon

Get back to me when you have a Biblical argument supported by some actual Scripture text.

None... just the part where you think it is subject to Him but He is actually subject to it were it not created.That is meaningless.He couldn't have, since He would still be waiting, were that true.Again: that's high praise, coming from you.B'zactly. The FIRST day was described in Genesis 1.Before the first day: there wasn't time.If it were, God would be subject to it. He created it, just like He created space. They're co-existent. See: Einstein's basic Theory of Relativity.

You're an idiot who couldn't form a Biblical argument to support your insipid blathering if your life depended on it.

 

[Aimiel]

Your attitude and spirit of hatred prove whose spirit you're associated with. You don't deserve to be given the time of day, due to your extreme rudeness. Sorry about your luck; please guess again... it's still your turn.

 

[Lon]

Get back to me when you have a Biblical argument supported by some actual Scripture text.

We've been down that path. I believe the logic of it is needed to get beyond such a hurdle. It is really hard to make metaphysical truths tangible for everyone.

 

[JosephR]

We've been down that path. I believe the logic of it is needed to get beyond such a hurdle. It is really hard to make metaphysical truths tangible for everyone.

Hey Lon , my two cents is this and it will be Tomorrow night before I can reply..

I think that all time began when God spoke the words In the beginning , just like in geometry a plane with no ends starts.. Then the Heavens and earth were created.. But when that plane was spoke into existence physical time became .. The blank slate for the Father to create...

For physical time as we know it to happen an energy transfer must occur.. So it could be argued that in the beginning or created matter apon this plane is the starting point for any energy transfer as far as the laws of thermodynamics go and my understanding.


Posted from the TOL App!

 

[Lighthouse]

Your attitude and spirit of hatred prove whose spirit you're associated with. You don't deserve to be given the time of day, due to your extreme rudeness. Sorry about your luck; please guess again... it's still your turn.

There is no hate in me, except for those who hate God. As per Psalm 139:19-22.

I am simply astonished at your lack of intellect and reasoning.

We've been down that path. I believe the logic of it is needed to get beyond such a hurdle. It is really hard to make metaphysical truths tangible for everyone.

You're in the same boat as Aimiel; you don't have the logic capacity to understand how illogical your argument is.

 

[Aimiel]

There is no hate in me, except for those who hate God. As per Psalm 139:19-22.

I am simply astonished at your lack of intellect and reasoning.

I'm not the least bit astonished at yours or at your dismissal of the lesson that Jesus taught about hating our enemies:

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; that ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Your walk needs a bit of correction, to say the least. You're not being obedient. You're imperfect. Your logic is flawed, far more so than those you're attempting to accuse of having flawed logic. We don't hate humans, since God may cause anyone to repent tomorrow and use them to do the job we should have been doing (winning souls) and anyone who thinks they stand in perfection may just find himself standing on sand tomorrow. We need to walk in love and perfect our ability to love, not chase after ways to find fault and foment hatred amongst the brethren. In so doing we become the accuser of the brethren rather than their deliverer. I'm simply astonished at your disdain for anything which might infringe upon your pet theology. You don't seem to have an open mind to be able to discuss anything but rather jump at the chance to tear at someone's jugular if their opinion clashes with yours. Not only do you NOT show the world that He lives in you since you're not displaying the love for your fellow-Christian that Jesus spoke of...

John 13:35
By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

... but you are showing the ones whom you're supposed to be winning to Christ that hatred is what Christianity is all about. You're mis-representing Christ to the world. You should be ashamed.

The Lord invites us to come and reason together with Him...

Isaiah 1:18
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

Have you come to Him in repentance? Have you? It doesn't seem like you have. His repentance is a lesson that stays with Christians, their whole life. We repent every time He shows us our sin. Humility is the currency of Heaven. It is what Christ demonstrated for us for 33 years. He served others. He didn't spout hatred and disdain. He certainly could have, but the 'holier-than-thou' attitude is a smoke in His nose...

Isaiah 65:5
Which say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou. These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day.

Every time we slip and He points it out to us we repent. We seek His help in reasoning out what to do. We seek His plan and His purpose in every single problem in our life. There is nothing too big or too small to take to Him. He wants us to rely upon Him, not our own reasoning. Not our own intellect. Not our own image of Him. His Word. His Presence. His Truth. If we rely upon our flesh we have nothing.

 

[Lighthouse]

I'm not the least bit astonished at yours or at your dismissal of the lesson that Jesus taught about hating our enemies:

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; that ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Your walk needs a bit of correction, to say the least. You're not being obedient. You're imperfect. Your logic is flawed, far more so than those you're attempting to accuse of having flawed logic. We don't hate humans, since God may cause anyone to repent tomorrow and use them to do the job we should have been doing (winning souls) and anyone who thinks they stand in perfection may just find himself standing on sand tomorrow. We need to walk in love and perfect our ability to love, not chase after ways to find fault and foment hatred amongst the brethren. In so doing we become the accuser of the brethren rather than their deliverer. I'm simply astonished at your disdain for anything which might infringe upon your pet theology. You don't seem to have an open mind to be able to discuss anything but rather jump at the chance to tear at someone's jugular if their opinion clashes with yours. Not only do you NOT show the world that He lives in you since you're not displaying the love for your fellow-Christian that Jesus spoke of...

John 13:35
By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

... but you are showing the ones whom you're supposed to be winning to Christ that hatred is what Christianity is all about. You're mis-representing Christ to the world. You should be ashamed.

The Lord invites us to come and reason together with Him...

Isaiah 1:18
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

Have you come to Him in repentance? Have you? It doesn't seem like you have. His repentance is a lesson that stays with Christians, their whole life. We repent every time He shows us our sin. Humility is the currency of Heaven. It is what Christ demonstrated for us for 33 years. He served others. He didn't spout hatred and disdain. He certainly could have, but the 'holier-than-thou' attitude is a smoke in His nose...

Isaiah 65:5
Which say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou. These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day.

Every time we slip and He points it out to us we repent. We seek His help in reasoning out what to do. We seek His plan and His purpose in every single problem in our life. There is nothing too big or too small to take to Him. He wants us to rely upon Him, not our own reasoning. Not our own intellect. Not our own image of Him. His Word. His Presence. His Truth. If we rely upon our flesh we have nothing.

I am unsurprised by your lack of recognition that love and hate are not mutually exclusive.

Psalm 5:4-6, 11:5-6, 139:19-22, Proverbs 6:16-19, Romans 5:8, 12:9-21, 1 John 4:8, 16

Your implication that I do not love those I hate is unfounded; based on a fallacious foundation of baseless assumption.

 

[Aimiel]

You missed the whole point of Jesus' instruction; which is that we are not to hate others, because they are whom we're supposed to be winning to The Lord. Love towards one's fellow-Christian isn't expressed by name-calling, hatred, disdain or self-righteousness. Love excludes those things because love acts differently than the world. You're acting like the world.

Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

You're too easily provoked, you have no patience and enjoy name-calling and put-downs. You need to learn how to endure others and love them before you can be capable of preaching. You have to know them, love them, forgive them and humble yourself before The Lord before you can stand on your soap box and preach. Never preach down to anyone, because you're preaching to yourself (alone) when you do. You need to hear what The Lord wants to get across to you: you're not perfect.

 

[Lighthouse]

You missed the whole point of Jesus' instruction; which is that we are not to hate others, because they are whom we're supposed to be winning to The Lord. Love towards one's fellow-Christian isn't expressed by name-calling, hatred, disdain or self-righteousness. Love excludes those things because love acts differently than the world. You're acting like the world.

No. Jesus' instruction was that we are to love the wicked, in spite of our hatred for them. Through Paul we were told not to be hypocrites in our love, but rather we are to abhor evil. For if we do not then how are the wicked to know they are wicked and need to know the love of God for their evil to be overcome?

I find it interesting that you deny Jesus' own words when you decry name-calling and hatred of evil.

And don't try arguing that men are not evil, as the Bible clearly states, "For as he thinks in his heart, so is he." Proverbs 23:7

Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth; beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

Would you care to point out where I have argued otherwise?

"The righteous shall rejoice when he sees the vengeance;
He shall wash his feet in the blood of the wicked,
So that men will say,
“Surely there is a reward for the righteous;
Surely He is God who judges in the earth.”"
-Psalm 58:10-11

You're too easily provoked, you have no patience and enjoy name-calling and put-downs. You need to learn how to endure others and love them before you can be capable of preaching. You have to know them, love them, forgive them and humble yourself before The Lord before you can stand on your soap box and preach. Never preach down to anyone, because you're preaching to yourself (alone) when you do. You need to hear what The Lord wants to get across to you: you're not perfect.

You are right that I have little patience for complete stupidity, but only because I know people like you are not as dumb as they present themselves to be.

It is simply that they refuse to think and reason, preferring instead to either to latch on to the unsubstantiated because it was spoken by someone they blindly trust or they simply think they are too ignorant to figure it out on their own.

The latter are especially frustrating when they don't listen to instructions and just ask someone else to solve the same problem for them again and again because they think they're too stupid to ever understand something because they think that it must be complicated and could never be simple when all the while it is really quite simple.

And what am I to forgive people for if they have not sinned against me? And am I to forgive them if they have not repented when they have sinned against me?

When I call you stupid it is not because I think you truly are too stupid to understand what I am telling you, but that you are refusing to use the intelligence you have to think things through to their logical conclusion and/or use the knowledge available to you [the Bible] to compare and contrast with the words spoken from many a pulpit or in other books that are not His word.

 

[Aimiel]

No. Jesus' instruction was that we are to love the wicked, in spite of our hatred for them. Through Paul we were told not to be hypocrites in our love, but rather we are to abhor evil. For if we do not then how are the wicked to know they are wicked and need to know the love of God for their evil to be overcome?

Because it's The Holy Spirit's job to convict of sin...

Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: of sin, because they believe not on me; of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

I find it interesting that you deny Jesus' own words when you decry name-calling and hatred of evil.

I find your reasoning odd, and definitely not Christian or Christ-like in the least.

You are right that I have little patience for complete stupidity, but only because I know people like you are not as dumb as they present themselves to be.

You have NO patience and it isn't right that you call someone, "Stupid." You're playing, "Holier-than-thou," when you do and that's (again) not the least bit Christian.

Isaiah 65:5
Which say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou. These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day.

Do you think you're above the judgments that God put in Scripture? Do you think more of yourself than you do others? We are supposed to consider others before ourselves. That is one of the things that shows the world Who Christ is: He is the Love that is in us.

And what am I to forgive people for if they have not sinned against me? And am I to forgive them if they have not repented when they have sinned against me?

Yes. You're not God. They don't have to jump through any hoops to please you or do your bidding. You're not The Judge of The Universe, although to read just about any one of your posts you seem to think you are.

When I call you stupid it is not because I think you truly are too stupid to understand what I am telling you, but that you are refusing to use the intelligence you have to think things through to their logical conclusion and/or use the knowledge available to you [the Bible] to compare and contrast with the words spoken from many a pulpit or in other books that are not His word.

No, you're just being childish and vain. You think you're so smart, but you're even more ignorant than you just described, because you think the words you wrote couldn't POSSIBLY apply to you, since you're incapable of error.

 

[Lighthouse]

Because it's The Holy Spirit's job to convict of sin...

And in order for Him to convict the word must be preached. And preaching the word is our job.

Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: of sin, because they believe not on me; of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

How does that make a difference to my statements?

I find your reasoning odd, and definitely not Christian or Christ-like in the least.

Would you prefer I called you a viper? A white-washed tomb? How about a son of Hell? Or a son of the father of lies?

You have NO patience and it isn't right that you call someone, "Stupid." You're playing, "Holier-than-thou," when you do and that's (again) not the least bit Christian.

Being smarter than you doesn't make me holier than you. The only thing that makes any of us holy is the holiness of God. I am no more holy than He has made me. Nothing I do, or am [apart from Him], has any effect on my holiness.

As for my patience, you have no idea how much patience I truly have and exercise.

Isaiah 65:5
Which say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou. These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day.

See above.

Do you think you're above the judgments that God put in Scripture? Do you think more of yourself than you do others? We are supposed to consider others before ourselves. That is one of the things that shows the world Who Christ is: He is the Love that is in us.

I am above nothing. I have been judged and found guilty. That's why I submitted to Christ. And it is because of this that I preach His word; so others may realize their need for Him.

But go ahead and judge me if you want. No skin off my nose.

Yes. You're not God. They don't have to jump through any hoops to please you or do your bidding. You're not The Judge of The Universe, although to read just about any one of your posts you seem to think you are.

The answer is actually, "No," according to Jesus' own words.

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif][FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]“[/FONT][/FONT]Take heed to yourselves. If your brother sins against you, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him. And if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day returns to you, saying, ‘I repent,’ you shall forgive him.[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif][FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]”[/FONT][/FONT]
-Luke 17:3-4

And if they do not sin against me it's not my job to forgive them at all as I have no cause to be offended in the first place.

I am not Him, I am His servant who does as He has commanded me. And He commanded us to judge righteous judgment.

No, you're just being childish and vain. You think you're so smart, but you're even more ignorant than you just described, because you think the words you wrote couldn't POSSIBLY apply to you, since you're incapable of error.

I have proof of how smart I am. I do not think of myself as being any smarter than the evidence states.

And those words do not apply to me as I am willing to try until I either figure it out [learn] or prove that I am not smart enough to do so and therefore need help.

But I have not always been this way; I used to just believe whatever the preacher in the pulpit told me, even if I knew it appeared to contradict the actual text of the Bible and all God had revealed of Himself and His creation.

 

[Aimiel]

And in order for Him to convict the word must be preached. And preaching the word is our job.

You've missed the point of Jesus' instruction entirely. He said to love those who are our enemies. He said to do good to those who despitefully use us. You can't hate someone and love them too; it's either or, not both. We hate the spirit that drives them and we can even hate their actions (sin) but we love them and pray they might repent and it's the goodness of God that they see in us that leads them there.

Romans 2:4
Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

Being patient, being loving and being forgiving is how we show the world Who God is. He is in us, loving them through us.

Being smarter than you doesn't make me holier than you.

Calling me names doesn't make you smarter than I nor does it show any measure of intelligence... quite the contrary: it reveals your shortcomings, intellectually and emotionally.

As for my patience, you have no idea how much patience I truly have and exercise.

Anyone who reads one of your posts at random does.

I am above nothing. I have been judged and found guilty. That's why I submitted to Christ. And it is because of this that I preach His word; so others may realize their need for Him.

If that were true, you would have simply agreed with me long ago and found ways to bridge the gap rather than throw dynamite at it.

 

[Lighthouse]

You've missed the point of Jesus' instruction entirely. He said to love those who are our enemies. He said to do good to those who despitefully use us. You can't hate someone and love them too; it's either or, not both. We hate the spirit that drives them and we can even hate their actions (sin) but we love them and pray they might repent and it's the goodness of God that they see in us that leads them there.

First off, the word is "spitefully" in modern English, since nobody speaks the King's English anymore, especially not in the United States of America.

Secondly, did you miss the part wherein I stated that I do love them? I can do both, as I have Christ in me and in Him dwells the fulness of the Godhead.

The Bible is very clear that God does both and that we also can. If you think otherwise then you deny His word and do not know Him.

Psalm 139:21-22

Romans 2:4
Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

And this means what to the issue at hand? I'm a lot more longsuffering than you know. And even more so with the Spirit producing fruit in me.

Being patient, being loving and being forgiving is how we show the world Who God is. He is in us, loving them through us.

And if they don't know and understand why we are being patient, loving and forgiving what good does it do? If we don't make them aware of their need for God to be longsuffering, or for forgiveness; if they don't comprehend why it matters that God loves them then what difference does it make to them?

Calling me names doesn't make you smarter than I nor does it show any measure of intelligence... quite the contrary: it reveals your shortcomings, intellectually and emotionally.

I never claimed it made me smarter than you. I simply said that I call you stupid because you're being stupid.

My being smarter than you is not dictated by my calling you on it.

Anyone who reads one of your posts at random does.

Thus the danger of reading out of context.

If that were true, you would have simply agreed with me long ago and found ways to bridge the gap rather than throw dynamite at it.

That's a complete non sequitur.

And you seem to be forgetting that I agreed with you on these particular subjects when I joined TOL a decade ago.

 

[Aimiel]

Secondly, did you miss the part wherein I stated that I do love them?

Saying one thing and doing another only shows double-mindedness.

The Bible is very clear that God does both and that we also can. If you think otherwise then you deny His word and do not know Him.

I know His Character and He doesn't hate anyone. He hates their sin. He hates sinfulness. If He hated all sinners, He never would have sent His Son to save them from their sin. He would have written them off and started over, long ago.

And this means what to the issue at hand? I'm a lot more longsuffering than you know. And even more so with the Spirit producing fruit in me.

Mostly your fruit is rotten. You produce strife and bitterness. It isn't Christ-like at all. It's cruel and demeaning. You act despitefully.

And if they don't know and understand why we are being patient, loving and forgiving what good does it do?

They see God in us. :duh:

 

[Lighthouse]

Saying one thing and doing another only shows double-mindedness.

If you're going to accuse me of being a liar then show me to be one. Otherwise keep your accusations to yourself.

I know His Character and He doesn't hate anyone. He hates their sin. He hates sinfulness. If He hated all sinners, He never would have sent His Son to save them from their sin. He would have written them off and started over, long ago.

Did you miss the story of the flood where He did write them off and start over?

And why is it you are so ignorant as to think God id incapable of loving those He hates? His word says He hates all workers of iniquity and that He loves us all so much in spite of it that He sent His Son to die for us.

You claim to know His character but you don't know Him at all; you do not know His word that explains His character, and He does not know you.

Be glad that since He did send His Son that you are not written off and will not be unless and until you go to Hell.

Mostly your fruit is rotten. You produce strife and bitterness. It isn't Christ-like at all. It's cruel and demeaning. You act despitefully.

You make these claims and fail to demonstrate them to be true. You fail.

They see God in us. :duh:

You fail so much at understanding people.

 

[Aimiel]

If you're going to accuse me of being a liar then show me to be one.

You've done a far better job than I have at that.

Did you miss the story of the flood where He did write them off and start over?

The flood was His Mercy. Had He not done that, mankind would have been eradicated and there have been many other mercies as well.

And why is it you are so ignorant as to think God id incapable of loving those He hates?

It isn't ignorant to not think of God being double-minded.

His word says He hates all workers of iniquity and that He loves us all so much in spite of it that He sent His Son to die for us.

His Word says that He loves men, but sin He hates. If He hated everyone who sinned He would never have sent His Son.

You make these claims and fail to demonstrate them to be true. You fail.

I've simply called you out and you're exposed.

You fail so much at understanding people.

No, I simply understand how true Christians are seen by the world and have seen people get saved just because they see God's Goodness in someone who's filled with God's Spirit. It's God's Goodness that leads men to repentance, whether you understand where someone might observe His Goodness in this world or not.

 

[Lighthouse]

You've done a far better job than I have at that.

Again you fail at coming up with evidence; thus leading one to surmise there is none and you are a false accuser of the brethren, bearing false witness.

The flood was His Mercy. Had He not done that, mankind would have been eradicated and there have been many other mercies as well.

The point still stands.

It isn't ignorant to not think of God being double-minded.

It's ignorant to think of loving and hating at the same time as being double-minded, or of love and hate as being mutually exclusive.

His Word says that He loves men, but sin He hates.

Where?

If He hated everyone who sinned He would never have sent His Son.

He sent His Son because He loves those He hates, in spite of hating them. That is how powerful His love is.

I've simply called you out and you're exposed.

What you've done is deny Scripture. And make unsupported claims.

No, I simply understand how true Christians are seen by the world and have seen people get saved just because they see God's Goodness in someone who's filled with God's Spirit. It's God's Goodness that leads men to repentance, whether you understand where someone might observe His Goodness in this world or not.

Why does His goodness lead to repentance?

 

[Aimiel]

Again you fail at coming up with evidence; thus leading one to surmise there is none and you are a false accuser of the brethren, bearing false witness.

If only you could see the irony of you saying that.

It's ignorant to think of loving and hating at the same time as being double-minded, or of love and hate as being mutually exclusive.

No, it's called: sanity.

Where?

John 3:16. Jesus never said that He hated ANYONE. Sorry. You're stuck in the Old Testament. You need to move out of there and read your New Testament. He wants us to love on another. You think He wants you to hate everyone who isn't just like you. You're the Pharisee who came out of the temple praying, "Dear God, thank you that I'm not like Aimiel." You're lost.

He sent His Son because He loves those He hates, in spite of hating them. That is how powerful His love is.

You put way too many words in God's Mouth. He didn't say that, you did. You're a big fat liar.

What you've done is deny Scripture. And make unsupported claims.

I know you did, but what did I do?

Why does His goodness lead to repentance?

Because He said it does.

Romans 2:4
Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

 

[Lighthouse]

If only you could see the irony of you saying that.

Again you blurt out implied accusation without offering ay supporting evidence. You're a hack!

No, it's called: sanity.

You wouldn't know sanity if it it you on the backside.

John 3:16. Jesus never said that He hated ANYONE.

So Jesus is not God?

You don't think He hated hypocrites, like the Pharisees and Sadducees?

Sorry. You're stuck in the Old Testament. You need to move out of there and read your New Testament. He wants us to love on another. You think He wants you to hate everyone who isn't just like you. You're the Pharisee who came out of the temple praying, "Dear God, thank you that I'm not like Aimiel." You're lost.

Are you saying God changed between testaments?

And, again, you're a vapid imbecile as you clearly cannot see the several times I have made it clear that I do love those I hate.

And also a false accuser of the brethren as you claim I hate all who are not like me.

You put way too many words in God's Mouth. He didn't say that, you did. You're a big fat liar.

Psalm 5:5 and Romans 5:8.

I know you did, but what did I do?

And now you resort to acting like a five year old.

Because He said it does.

Romans 2:4
Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

:doh:

That is not what I asked.

I am not arguing that His goodness does not lead to repentance; I'm asking if you know the reason it does so. Idiot.

 

[Aimiel]

You don't think He hated hypocrites, like the Pharisees and Sadducees?

Did He ever even once say that He hated anyone? He said He hated the 'deeds' of the ones whom He named in Revelation.

Are you saying God changed between testaments?

God never changes. He doesn't want us to judge others and hate them. He wants us to judge righteous judgment. He wants us to know who is a sinner that needs prayer and who is our brother who can help us pray for the sinner.

And, again, you're a vapid imbecile as you clearly cannot see the several times I have made it clear that I do love those I hate.

No, I'm smart enough to see that you hate everyone, including me.

And also a false accuser of the brethren as you claim I hate all who are not like me.

It's all you demonstrate: hatred.