their claims are easily being refuted, yet they keep bring up cheap shot claims.
That proves they are not reading the bible much.
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pacifism for true Jesus' followers.
- Thread starter meshak
- Start date
their claims are easily being refuted, yet they keep bring up cheap shot claims.
That proves they are not reading the bible much.
Wasn't the time for it.
Ecclesiastes 3:1-8 KJV
(1) To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
(2) A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
(3) A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
(4) A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
(5) A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
(6) A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
(7) A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
(8) A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace.
But there will be a time for it.
Christ will return and there's gonna be some killing goin on.
I brought up the words of the Lord Jesus Christ.
The words of the Lord Jesus Christ are not cheap shots.
In the meantime, we are commanded to love God and our neighbour, we can do nothing greater.
Revelation 19:15 KJV
(15) And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Doesn't sound like a pacifist.
(15) And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Doesn't sound like a pacifist.
One more time, for the babes/sheep....
The LORD God of Division
"So there was a division among the people because of him.....And there was a division among them.....There was a division therefore again among the Jews for these sayings."-John 7:43 KJV, John 9:16 KJV, John 10:19 KJV
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Intra/trans-dispensational principle: The LORD God of Division
"...and God divided the light from the darkness." Genesis 1:4 KJV
Do you remember, during the "Christmas season," the often played, now dead David Bowie/Bing Crosby rendition of "The Little Drummer Boy?" Mr. Bowie/most of the Christ rejecting world, sings the oft-repeated phrase, "Peace on Earth" as its main message. This is the predominantly Christ-rejecting world's interpretation/understanding of the message of Christmas. However, according to the Holy Bible, which is "...true from the beginning...."(Psalms 119:160 KJV), this is not the message of Christmas.
Yes, the words "peace on earth" are in the Holy Bible, but they are not in the Christmas account. The Lord Jesus Christ does speak of "peace on earth":
"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." Matthew 10:34 KJV
Notice: a sword divides/separates-it does not unify/"bring together"
The word of God is likened to a "twoedged sword"-survey Hebrews 4:12 KJV...Ephesians 6:17 KJV.
Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:..." Luke 12:51 KJV
Both times the Lord Jesus Christ spoke of "peace on earth", He said, in simple terms that left no doubt as to his intended meaning, that he was not bringing it. He did not bring it when he was on earth, and he does not bring it today. And the verse the "world" traditionally understands(and embraces) to say "peace on earth", actually says:
"Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men." Luke 2:14 KJV
This speaks of God's peace toward each man in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, not peace between men.
The Lord Jesus Christ is the "great divider." The world is quite willing to accept a "sweet little baby lying in the manger", but mention the Lord Jesus Christ and his cross, and that he is a "...man of war...."(Exodus 15:3 KJV), and he, and anyone that proclaims his message, becomes unwelcome guests, with "...no room for them in the inn"(Luke 2:7 KJV)-division.
The same inevitable fate awaits those that are faithful to rightly dividing the word of truth, 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV, a biblical command, not suggestion-you will be in the minority, and you will be the cause of division. But "...Be of good cheer..."(Acts 23:11 KJV). Scripturally, strength in numbers is not only ill-founded, it is not true. Scripture provides abundant testimony to this fact. Consider "the minority":
Noah-only 7 people saved by the LORD through Noah. And yet Noah is called "...a preacher of righteousness...." in 2 Peter 2:5 KJV-this should be an encouragement to those who feel they are the only one preaching the gospel of the grace of God.
Joseph-all his brothers opposed him
David- took on a giant
Elijah- outnumbered 450 to one(1 Kings 18:22 KJV)
Gideon-Had only 300 men(31,700 eliminated -Judges 6-7)
Paul- "...all men forsook me...."(2 Tim. 4:16 KJV).
The Lord Jesus Christ-No commentary is needed here.
The bible is a book of details, and therefore, I pay attention to details.
"Grace and peace..."-Paul, "the apostle of the Gentiles"(Romans 11:13 KJV), and thus our apostle, over, and over...
Notice, the order: Grace, then peace....Not vice verse.
There is no peace, w/o first grace.
What this world, and "Christianity" needs is not more "popular" teaching, but more unpopular preaching. I say "Split, split, split, and keep splitting." Split, split,.......... until the light of rightly dividing the word of truth, division, cuts through all the smoke and fog.
Division is what the "Commander in Chief," the Lord Jesus Christ, "brought to the table," during His ministry on this grave yard, known as earth,and is what Paul was taught to bring, often, upon direct orders from the risen, glorified, ascended, and seated same Commander, "the Lord from heaven,"(1 Cor. 15:47 KJV), to those who rebel against the doctrine the Saviour committed to him......
"Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them."-Romans 16:17 KJV
... and that is what I often bring to the table, shaking respective members of the body of Christ, out of their slumber, and, marking/exposing/identifying the rebels against Paul, and confronting the lost, with the "transdispensational" principle, a question, and directive, they will, eventually, need to address, as it is written....
"...Who is on the Lord’s side?... "... choose you this day whom ye will serve; ..."(Exodus 32:26 KJV,Joshua 24:15 KJV)
Yes, there should be no division within the body of Christ, amongst members; however, division is caused within the body, by those who rebel against the doctrine committed to the apostle Paul, that "sound doctrine" that is the Lord Jesus Christ's doctrine, teaching, in this dispensation.
Jesus was born to die, that was his mission and he did not need Peter interfering.
Another cheap shot.
Jesus and His disciple did not kill anyone just escapes you.
You said you just read the Bible only once? You should read more especially Matthew, Mark, Luke and John instead of spreading false gospel in the forum.
meshak,
I do not know where your view comes from. But I do believe that you are promoting pacifism as consistent with what Jesus taught and how He lived. Meaning, that is how you see it. There are different views on this, but the view a person takes should come from Jesus and scripture. One thing is for sure, Jesus loved people and died for it. He did not take up the sword. In this I commend you.
I believe you are opposed to violence, and I am too. Does your view, if you are opposed to violence of all kinds or in all forms, affect your view of pacifism in how you read the Bible, even with your focus on Jesus?
I am against war (thus a pacifist, or was I already a pacifist either by understanding the term or in thought or practice before hearing of the word or concept of war?) and violence, physical aggression, and personal (self-)defense. Jesus and the apostles went to their death preaching the gospel in the love of God. Justice and righteousness are real. But they did not fight, make war, or kill anyone (not even if they had any enemies). What people need to know is that eternal life and the forgiveness of sins is available in Jesus Christ who died for them and rose to life again, never to die again. There is the promise of resurrection for all, though not all are among the righteous. We can live righteous lives. And we don't have to kill anyone. There is no need, in that no need should be seen, if we are to rescue others by the gospel rather than hurt even if others have hurt us. Do you see the rescue aspect, or just righteousness in Jesus? Rescue the perishing. Save the dying.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Do not resist an evil person. Each person is responsible to God for what they themselves do. We can help others to live righteous lives. We ought ourselves to live righteous lives. We ought to love one another, as brothers and sisters in Christ, and to love the world (to love unbelievers) without becoming entangled in their sin. Each of us ought to confess our sins to God that we would be healed. Living righteous and holy lives means living lives free from sin, and this should be for everyone.
I do not know where your view comes from. But I do believe that you are promoting pacifism as consistent with what Jesus taught and how He lived. Meaning, that is how you see it. There are different views on this, but the view a person takes should come from Jesus and scripture. One thing is for sure, Jesus loved people and died for it. He did not take up the sword. In this I commend you.
I believe you are opposed to violence, and I am too. Does your view, if you are opposed to violence of all kinds or in all forms, affect your view of pacifism in how you read the Bible, even with your focus on Jesus?
I am against war (thus a pacifist, or was I already a pacifist either by understanding the term or in thought or practice before hearing of the word or concept of war?) and violence, physical aggression, and personal (self-)defense. Jesus and the apostles went to their death preaching the gospel in the love of God. Justice and righteousness are real. But they did not fight, make war, or kill anyone (not even if they had any enemies). What people need to know is that eternal life and the forgiveness of sins is available in Jesus Christ who died for them and rose to life again, never to die again. There is the promise of resurrection for all, though not all are among the righteous. We can live righteous lives. And we don't have to kill anyone. There is no need, in that no need should be seen, if we are to rescue others by the gospel rather than hurt even if others have hurt us. Do you see the rescue aspect, or just righteousness in Jesus? Rescue the perishing. Save the dying.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Do not resist an evil person. Each person is responsible to God for what they themselves do. We can help others to live righteous lives. We ought ourselves to live righteous lives. We ought to love one another, as brothers and sisters in Christ, and to love the world (to love unbelievers) without becoming entangled in their sin. Each of us ought to confess our sins to God that we would be healed. Living righteous and holy lives means living lives free from sin, and this should be for everyone.
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There was a typo in one of the sentences. I changed it because it should read...
There is the promise of resurrection for all, though not all are among the righteous.
Luke 14:14 NASB - 14 and you will be blessed, since they do not have the means to repay you; for you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous."
Acts 24:15 NASB - 15 having a hope in God, which these men cherish themselves, that there shall certainly be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.
Acts 24:15 NASB - 15 having a hope in God, which these men cherish themselves, that there shall certainly be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.
That's not what I said, but why does it matter?
I changed the following sentence as it was unclear. It read personal defense not (personal) self-defense.
I am against war (thus a pacifist, or was I already a pacifist either by understanding the term or in thought or practice before hearing of the word or concept of war?) and violence, physical aggression, and personal (self-)defense.
I am against war (thus a pacifist, or was I already a pacifist either by understanding the term or in thought or practice before hearing of the word or concept of war?) and violence, physical aggression, and personal (self-)defense.
Being against self defense is contrary to human nature
This is what you said.
It sounds like you just read one time.
It does not matter, You don't look like you have read NT many times.
If you have read, you know I am telling the truth that Jesus and His disciples did not kill anyone. And they are good example to follow.
this is basice Christian principle, friend.
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If you are true Christian, you should know that Jesus and His disciple did not kill anyone and they are good example to follow for His followers.
Is it consistent with the Spirit of God?