Original Sin and the Calvinists

[Epoisses]

All men?

The Lord Jesus Christ was made like us in every way.

Hebrews 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.​

Still can't admit that you're a sinner? Jesus has nothing for you, he came to save sinners not righteous people.

 

[God's Truth]

No!

Jesus tells us HOW TO BE HIS.

You neglect that.

Jesus tells US HOW TO BECOME HIS so that you can hear and see.

 

[God's Truth]

Why listen? What is it about His command that is compelling? Why not listen to someone else instead?

Because some want more out of this life than to please their flesh.

We are FLESH, but we are spirit too.

Some people are more spiritual, they want more out of life.

Don't limit yourself to the teachings of men.

Think about it and keep discussing this with me.

Jesus is the way and tells people what to do to get saved.

No one already belonged to God when they were born.

When Jesus came, he came for those who already belonged to God.

There is another generation of people after Jesus died.

Jesus came and tells all who wants to be saved how to be saved.

 

[glorydaz]

If a person can do nothing good because of his nature then how do you explain what Paul wrote here in "bold":

"For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves" (Ro.2:14).​

Why people can't see that man was created with a human nature that is free to choose which path to take is beyond me. We live in a body of flesh and are susceptible to the lusts of the flesh. To claim that is a sinful nature is to accuse God of creating sinners. Blaming it all on Adam is one of the biggest lies perpetrated by organised religion since organised religion came into existence. Man always seeks an excuse for why he sins.

 

[glorydaz]

Still can't admit that you're a sinner? Jesus has nothing for you, he came to save sinners not righteous people.

Are you retarded? I was talking about the Lord Jesus Christ, made like unto us.

When you have no answer to what is posted, just move along instead of taking the time to show us how stupid you are.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Because we are dead in trespasses and sin, we can't see.

No, people cannot see because they corrupted themselves, just like other men who had done the same thing:

"And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth" (Gen.6:12).​

In order for something to be corrupted that thing must originally be in a state that can only be described as "good," i.e. not corrupt.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Man always seeks an excuse for why he sins.

Yes, EXACTLY!

Some people just refuse to take total responsibility for their sins!

 

[God's Truth]

Still can't admit that you're a sinner? Jesus has nothing for you, he came to save sinners not righteous people.

All are sinners.

Jesus came to save those who ADMIT they are sinners.

That is what Jesus says to do to be one whom he saves.

Those people are the righteous.

That is how to have the righteousness that leads to salvation.

Romans 6:16 Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

I guess that the Calvinists have run out of answers!

 

[God's Truth]

I guess that the Calvinists have run out of answers!

Calvinism is false and Lutheranism is false, and faith alone is false.

Jesus came to tell ALL the Way to salvation.

Jesus knew that the way would be written and it was written so that people would believe and obey.

Jesus tells us HOW TO be the one he saves.

He tells us to to prepare our hearts for him to live there and make his home.

Jesus tells us what to do to prepare our hearts for him to live there.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

and faith alone is false.

Then Paul and those with Him must have been in error because the answer they gave to the question of how a person can be saved speaks of believing and nothing but believing:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).​

Of course there will always be some who think that Paul just forgot to name everything that it takes for a person to be saved!

 

[God's Truth]

Then Paul and those with Him must have been in error because the answer they gave to the question of how a person can be saved speaks of believing and nothing but believing:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).​

Of course there will always be some who think that Paul just forgot to name everything that it takes for a person to be saved!

You mean like this:

Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

Acts 20:21 I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.

Did you read that?

Paul is speaking about to who he preached and what.

What did Paul preach?

Paul preached repent and have faith.

Now read this next scripture, for Paul is preaching to the Greeks who had not heard yet, and what does Paul preach? Paul preaches REPENT.

Acts 17:30 Therefore, although God has overlooked such times of ignorance, he now commands all people everywhere to repent,

 

[Jerry Shugart]

The Greek word translated "repent" means a change of mind. Going from unbelief to belief.

And of course you pick and choose which verses you will believe and which ones you refuse to believe so you said nothing about what is said at Acts 16:30-31.

 

[God's Truth]

The Greek word translated "repent" means a change of mind. Going from unbelief to belief.

Change your mind about sin and stop doing it.

And of course you pick and choose which verses you will believe and which ones you refuse to believe so you said nothing about what is said at Acts 16:30-31.

What would you like to talk about?

You reject the truth that we have to believe to be saved, believe what? Believe that Jesus died for the sins of the world and we have to repent of those sins.

All the scriptures that say 'believe', they do not nullify all the scriptures that say 'obey'.

 

[ttruscott]

Anyone who would dare support this evil teaching is as warped as The Westminster Confession of Faith!

Yet when I ask WHY GOD would make HIS future bride disgusting in corruption and evil in Adam, they deny that this is their meaning of the their confession. Anyone who thinks GOD forced us to be created evil or even tainted in the least is under a strong delusion....GOD is love and there is no way our inheriting anything tainted from Adam is loving.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

All the scriptures that say 'believe', they do not nullify all the scriptures that say 'obey'.

How Paul and those with him answered the following question demonstates that once a person believes he is saved:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).​

The answer given is either true or it is false. If "obedience" is also required to be saved then Paul and those with him made a huge blunder because they should have answered, "Believe AND obey...and thou shall be saved."

According to your ideas we must believe that Paul and those with him gave an incorrect answer because they failed to mention obedience along with believing.

Do you really think that they all blundered and just left out something which is essential to salvation?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Yet when I ask WHY GOD would make HIS future bride disgusting in corruption and evil in Adam, they deny that this is their meaning of the their confession. Anyone who thinks GOD forced us to be created evil or even tainted in the least is under a strong delusion....GOD is love and there is no way our inheriting anything tainted from Adam is loving.

STRONG DELUSION is right.

"This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all" (1 Jn.1:5).​

 

[glorydaz]

All the scriptures that say 'believe', they do not nullify all the scriptures that say 'obey'.

Yes, they do. That's what GRACE is all about.

How you can deny this is beyond me. THAT IN THE AGES TO COME.....all glory will go to the Lord Jesus Christ, and no one will be able to claim they did anything to receive this GIFT.

Eph. 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:​

 

[God's Truth]

Yes, they do. That's what GRACE is all about.

NO. God did NOT NULLIFY all His words!

God did not nail Jesus' words to the cross.

How you can deny this is beyond me. THAT IN THE AGES TO COME.....all glory will go to the Lord Jesus Christ, and no one will be able to claim they did anything to receive this GIFT.

How do you EVER get that it gives glory to Jesus to nullify his words?

Eph. 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:​

A gift to His CHILDREN. You have to first become a child of His!

Not of yourselves mean you don't have to do the ceremonial works to purify yourself because Jesus will do it.

 

[God's Truth]

How Paul and those with him answered the following question demonstates that once a person believes he is saved:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).​

They had to hear the message that saves, and that message is about FORGIVENESS OF THE SINS YOU REPENT OF DOING.

The answer given is either true or it is false. If "obedience" is also required to be saved then Paul and those with him made a huge blunder because they should have answered, "Believe AND obey...and thou shall be saved."

Paul does say that but you ignore and deny those scriptures!!!


Acts 20:21 I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.

Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

According to your ideas we must believe that Paul and those with him gave an incorrect answer because they failed to mention obedience along with believing.

Do you really think that they all blundered and just left out something which is essential to salvation?

Do you really want to do away with ALL the scriptures, all the words of God telling us to obey? Do you really want to say Jesus came and gave all those teachings to have them nullified?