Killing in the Name of...
- Thread starter Nihilo
- Start date
1. I do not think he is a hero.
2. We may not know true outcome as we do not know intent of the robbers. Were the guns empty? Would they have shot even after store employees complied? Was there a credible threat? I thinkbthere was a credible threat but how we respond is dependant on the person. There will always be an affect on us after such violence is commited.
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Thou shall not kill
I stated my reason in the OP, call it what you will.
There's only One Christian faith (Eph4:5KJV); it is what the One Church believes and has always believed, and it is quote-unquote "Trinitarian" and always has been. There was no division in the Church all the way from the Apostles in the first century, to AD 1054, and the lone doctrine throughout all that time and throughout all those Christians regarding the nature of the Maker is that He is the Most Blessed and Most Holy and Undivided Trinity, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
I agree with, "I [think there] was a credible threat."
marhig
Well-known member
Hello again, can you tell me why you wrote thou shalt not kill? I know that we shouldn't kill, I don't believe that we should take a life for any reason whatsoever.
And as for the sentence, can you explain what you mean? Thanks
marhig
Well-known member
Here's what the apostles believed.
Paul in Ephesians 1
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from.the Lord Jesus Christ Blessed.be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1 Corinthians 8
but to us there is but one God, the Father of whom are all things and we in him, and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things and we by him
1 Corinthians 11
But I would have you know that the head of every man in Christ and the head of the woman is the man and the head of Christ is God
For there is one God and one mediator between God and man,the man Christ Jesus.(1 Timothy 2:5 KJV)
Blessed beGod, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and the God of all comfort.(2Corinthians 1:3 KJV)
Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.(Hebrews 10)
Peter
1 Peter 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
John
Revelation 1
]The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him
Clearly the apostles believed that God was the God of Jesus Christ, and I believe them, can you show me where God the son is in the Bible? Or that we must believe that Jesus is God to be a saved? Or that we must believe in a trinity to to saved?
If you can't find them, then please don't tell me that we have to believe in it, because it doesn't say in the Bible that I have to believe in the trinity, and it doesn't say in the Bible that we have to believe that Jesus is God, but we are to believe that Jesus is the son of God, and that's what I believe!
marhig
Well-known member
With God and in the hearts of Gods people.
Do you know spiritually what to be put to death by the Spirit is?
Are you suggesting the Holy Spirit did not reside in Peter?
Peter said, "You have not lied to men but to God.” (Acts 5:4)
It's not nice to lie to God.
12 “He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death. 13 However, if he did not lie in wait, but God delivered him into his hand, then I will appoint for you a place where he may flee.
About the video....The gun shop owner did not premeditate nor lie in wait.
About the video....The gun shop owner did not premeditate nor lie in wait.
Yup. Just for comparison's sake, here is the popes' view:
We note that in your video, the intent wasn't to kill the criminal, but to render the criminal unable to cause harm, and the only recourse was lethal force. It's an important distinction, and separates a moral act from an immoral one.The popes said:
To me this only means the great law, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." Defending yourself is being obedient to Jesus, IOW. When it's time to give Him an account, and you had the opportunity to defend yourself but you did not, He's not going to get as big a return on His investment. Remember we have what He's entrusted to us and only for a time, and He's going to be looking for profit. You can do more for Him alive, than you can dead.The popes said:
If the criminals in the video weren't brandishing objects and treating them like firearms (in the unlikely case that they are toys or props instead of real guns), but were empty handed, and if they were puny people and the gun shop workers were huge, then lethal force would have been "more than necessary," just as an example of what the video wasn't.The popes said:
And in this video is the administration of the death penalty, and it was administered in the blink of an eye, which is almost pure justice. The criminal reaped what he sowed instantly. He sowed destruction when he entered that store, gun drawn, and he reaped destruction when he took two or three rounds right to his thorax, ending the deadly threat that he posed.
He chose. He chose what to sow, and so he chose what he would reap. His executioner only did what the criminal chose for him to do, he was "forced to deal his aggressor a lethal blow," in the popes' words.
. sure.
1. Some times people quote a single passage from Bible or a bible and suggest that passages meaning although that meaning is opposite to what could be suggested earlier in the chapter or later in the paragraph. context is not always simple.
At times ... we ourselves are at odds with ourselves and context that leans one way may lean another. Like quotes provided on this thread.
2. I added the commandment which helps push your point of view.
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marhig
Well-known member
Now if I said that, I would be told by some here that i would be twisting the scriptures
But, I truly think that Jesus mean't what he said. Below are a few verses as to why I believe that the father is the only true God. Plus, it doesn't tell us anywhere in the Bible that we have to believe in a triune God or in God the son! But that we are to believe that Jesus is the son of God, and we are to know the father, who is the only true God and Jesus Christ whom he has sent.
Anyway, as I said here are a few verses to show you why I believe as I do that the father is God. To me there is overwhelming evidence in the scriptures that God the father is also the God of Jesus who is the Christ. And I don't understand why people keep telling me I'm wrong when it's clear as day as you can see below! Am I supposed to ignore what it says in the Bible?
It is not mine to grant but is for those for whom it has been prepared by my Father.(Matthew 20:20-23 KJV)
My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?(Matthew 26:39 & 27:46 KJV)
Father, if you wish, remove this cup from me, not by my will, but thy will.(Luke 22:42 KJV)
Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit.(Luke 23:46 KJV)
Father, the hour is come; glorify your Son - as you have given him power over all flesh
John continues:
Life eternal is this to know thee the only true God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.(John 17:1-3 KJV)
Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. (John 5:19 KJV)
I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me bears witness of me. (John 8:18 KJV).
Touch me not, for I am not yet ascended to my Father…I ascend unto my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.”(John 20:17 KJV)
I go unto the Father, for my Father is greater than I.”(John 14:28 KJV)
I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.(John 5-30)
I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me. (John 5)
Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is God(Mark 10:17-18 KJV)
And that is none other God but one. For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, but to us there is but one God, the Father of whom are all things and we in him, and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things and we by him. (1 Corinthians 8:4-6 KJV)
But I would have you know that the head of every man in Christ and the head of the woman is the man and the head of Christ is God. (1 Corinthians 11:3).
For there is one God and one mediator between God and man,the man Christ Jesus.(1 Timothy 2:5 KJV)
Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and the God of all comfort. (2Corinthians 1:3 KJV)
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Peter 1:3 KJV)
Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.(Hebrews 10)
These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: As thou hast given him power over all flesh,that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent..I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Ephesians 1
That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him
Revelation 1
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him
Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.(Hebrews 1:9)
Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God and I will write upon him my new name..He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
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"And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; 29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: 32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them." Romans 1
Zeke
Well-known member
And temple is located where?Now if I said that, I would be told by some here that i would be twisting the scriptures
But, I truly think that Jesus mean't what he said. Below are a few verses as to why I believe that the father is the only true God. Plus, it doesn't tell us anywhere in the Bible that we have to believe in a triune God or in God the son! But that we are to believe that Jesus is the son of God, and we are to know the father, who is the only true God and Jesus Christ whom he has sent.
Anyway, as I said here are a few verses to show you why I believe as I do that the father is God. To me there is overwhelming evidence in the scriptures that God the father is also the God of Jesus who is the Christ. And I don't understand why people keep telling me I'm wrong when it's clear as day as you can see below! Am I supposed to ignore what it says in the Bible?
It is not mine to grant but is for those for whom it has been prepared by my Father.(Matthew 20:20-23 KJV)
My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?(Matthew 26:39 & 27:46 KJV)
Father, if you wish, remove this cup from me, not by my will, but thy will.(Luke 22:42 KJV)
Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit.(Luke 23:46 KJV)
Father, the hour is come; glorify your Son - as you have given him power over all flesh
John continues:
Life eternal is this to know thee the only true God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.(John 17:1-3 KJV)
Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. (John 5:19 KJV)
I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me bears witness of me. (John 8:18 KJV).
Touch me not, for I am not yet ascended to my Father…I ascend unto my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.”(John 20:17 KJV)
I go unto the Father, for my Father is greater than I.”(John 14:28 KJV)
I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.(John 5-30)
I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me. (John 5)
Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is God(Mark 10:17-18 KJV)
And that is none other God but one. For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, but to us there is but one God, the Father of whom are all things and we in him, and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things and we by him. (1 Corinthians 8:4-6 KJV)
But I would have you know that the head of every man in Christ and the head of the woman is the man and the head of Christ is God. (1 Corinthians 11:3).
For there is one God and one mediator between God and man,the man Christ Jesus.(1 Timothy 2:5 KJV)
Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and the God of all comfort. (2Corinthians 1:3 KJV)
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Peter 1:3 KJV)
Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.(Hebrews 10)
These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: As thou hast given him power over all flesh,that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent..I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Ephesians 1
That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him
Revelation 1
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him
Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.(Hebrews 1:9)
Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God and I will write upon him my new name..He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
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Murder is the highest capital crime, and multiple murderers and especially mass murderers and serial murderers are the highest capital criminals, and these criminals deserve to have all their bones in their arms and legs snapped like pencils, as they watch. And then they should be painfully but not fatally woven into the spokes of a wagon wheel, lashed there, and then exposed to the elements to let nature take back what it has wrongly given to us. That’s justice. That we don’t do that anymore, the torture before death, we have to acknowledge that as a true mercy that we collectively grant to murderers, primarily. Are we getting back a return on this investment, since we decided that executions should be more “humane?” Has our murderer population diminished? Are we even keeping such data?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breaking_wheel#/media/File:Klassisches_Radern.png
worthy of death
Ecclesiastes 8:11 KJV
(11) Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil.
