How the Gospel Makes Calvinism, Catholicism, All Religions as Worthless

Robert Pate

New member
Paul said, "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: FOR IT IS THE POWER OF GOD UNTO SALVATION TO EVERYONE THAT BELIEVES" Romans 1:16.

Paul didn't say that Calvinism or Catholicism was the power of God unto salvation. No, He said that it is the GOSPEL that is the power of God unto salvation. Why is it that you can't believe Paul?

Paul also said, "By the deeds or works of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight" Romans 3:20.

Deeds or works of the law are any religious thing that we do. The words "Law" and "Religion" basically mean the same thing. Paul could have said... "By the works of your RELIGION no flesh will be justified". Instead of using the word "religion" Paul used the word "law". They both mean the same thing. When you are doing the law, you are doing religion.

The reason that the law or religion does not justify is because we are sinners. God does not accept the works or the religion of sinners. The only thing that God honors in the Bible is faith, mainly faith in his Son Jesus Christ.

The Gospel is the "good news" that we have ALREADY been reconciled to God by his Son Jesus Christ. We don't have to become a member of the Catholic church to be saved, nor do we have to believe that we have been predestinated. Not only did God reconcile us to himself by Jesus Christ, he reconciled the Whole world to himself by Jesus Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

He did this while we were still sinners, "And you that were sometimes alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet NOW has he reconciled" Colossians 1:21.

It is a done deal. All that God asks you to do to be part of this act of reconciliation is to believe on his Son Jesus Christ. Nothing else is required. Jesus said, "Whosoever that believes in me (Jesus) shall not perish, but have everlasting life" John 3:16.

When you believe on Jesus God will give you his Holy Spirit that will change your life and will make you the kind of person that you really want to be.
 

Robert Pate

New member
This assumption is the Fatal Flaw of Pate's false "gospel," as has already been demonstrated here.

End of thread.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+



You did not define what a WORK OF THE LAW is.

The Bible defines it as any religious thing that you do to try and merit salvation.

"Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the WORKS OF THE LAW. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone" Romans 9:32.

Knowing that a man is not justified by the WORKS OF THE LAW, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ and not by the WORKS OF THE LAW: for by the WORKS OF THE LAW no flesh shall be justified" Galatians 2:16.

"This only would I learn of you, did you receive the Spirit by the WORKS OF THE LAW, or by the hearing of faith" (the Gospel) Galatians 3:2.

"He therefore that ministers to you the Spirit and works miracles among you, does he do it by the WORKS OF THE LAW, or by the hearing of faith" (The Gospel) Galatians 3:5.

"For as many as are under the WORKS OF THE LAW are under the curse: for it is written, cursed is every one that does not continue in all things that are written in the book of the law to do them" Galatians 3:10.


I will hold my position that any religious thing that you do is a WORK OF THE LAW.
 

Cruciform

New member
You did not define what a WORK OF THE LAW is.
The cited source in Post #2 leads to detailed definitions of Paul's "works of the law." You've already been thoroughly and decisively answered there.

Again: End of thread.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
 

Robert Pate

New member
The cited source in Post #2 leads to detailed definitions of Paul's "works of the law." You've already been thoroughly and decisively answered there.

Again: End of thread.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+


The law is the very nature and the character of God.

The "Works of the Law" is doing things or trying to be like God.

Your religion teaches that one should do the "Works of the Law", Which does not justify.
 

Cruciform

New member
The law is the very nature and the character of God.The "Works of the Law" is doing things or trying to be like God.Your religion teaches that one should do the "Works of the Law", Which does not justify.
Already decisively answered (Post #2).
 

Robert Pate

New member
Already decisively answered (Post #2).

Catholics believe that the "Works of the Law" justify.

"If anyone says that the sinner is justified by faith alone, meaning that nothing else is required to cooperate in order to obtain the grace of justification and that it is not any way necessary that he be prepared and disposed by the action of his own will, let him be anathema. Canon #9.

The "Works of the Law" is what is required.
 

Cruciform

New member
Catholics believe that the "Works of the Law" justify."If anyone says that the sinner is justified by faith alone, meaning that nothing else is required to cooperate in order to obtain the grace of justification and that it is not any way necessary that he be prepared and disposed by the action of his own will, let him be anathema. Canon #9.The "Works of the Law" is what is required.
Post #2
 

Robert Pate

New member

The big question is... Do good works and obedience to the law justify?

Catholics believe that they are justified by works and obedience to the law. But it is not that simple. They believe that it is because of the infused righteousness of Christ that they are able to do good works and keep the commandments of Jesus and become pleasing to God.

Paul never taught such a thing.

Paul taught that faith and the Holy Spirit come to us by hearing and believing the Gospel, Romans 10:17 also Galatians 3:2. The Holy Spirit does not justify. Christ is the justifier, Romans 3:26.

Paul wrote, "But to him that does no works, but believes on him that justifies the ungodly, his faith (not his works) are counted for righteousness" Romans 4:5.

The difference between Christianity and the Catholic church is that the Catholic church believes that we are justified by works and obedience to the law. The Bible teaches that we are justified by faith and not works or obedience to the law, Romans 4:1, 2, 3. 4.
 

Robert Pate

New member

It is very obvious that you do not want to debate justification.

I can't say that I blame you. You don't have a case.

Paul said, "For if Abraham were justified by works, he would have something to glory about: but not before God. For what does the scripture say? Abraham believed God and it was counted unto him for righteousness" Romans 4:2, 3.

Faith counts for righteousness. NOT WORKS.
 

Cruciform

New member
It is very obvious that you do not want to debate justification.
No need, since your notion of Paul's "works of the law" has already been shown to be utterly false in Post #2 above and, thus, your "gospel" is likewise false.

There's really no more to say on the matter.

End of thread.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+
 

Robert Pate

New member
No need, since your notion of Paul's "works of the law" has already been shown to be utterly false in Post #2 above and, thus, your "gospel" is likewise false.

There's really no more to say on the matter.

End of thread.



Gaudium de veritate,

Cruciform
+T+


The Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19, is false?

You are without hope.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
pate

Faith counts for righteousness. NOT WORKS.

Faith is a Work of the Law, its something required of man to do Matt 23:23

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

So Faith is not a saved mans righteousness, Christ is, the object of his Faith is his Righteousness 1 Cor 1:30

30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

So you are trusting in your faith as your righteousness, and unfortunatley not Christ as your righteousness, the object of Faith !
 

Robert Pate

New member
pate



Faith is a Work of the Law, its something required of man to do Matt 23:23

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

So Faith is not a saved mans righteousness, Christ is, the object of his Faith is his Righteousness 1 Cor 1:30

30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

So you are trusting in your faith as your righteousness, and unfortunatley not Christ as your righteousness, the object of Faith !

I have never taught that we are saved by our faith.

What I have taught is that we are saved by the doing and the dying of Jesus.

Faith is what makes the Gospel ours.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
You are dull of hearing because you don't want the truth.

The Bible says that faith is counted for righteousness, Romans 4:5.

Ok you believe that your faith is counted as righteousness, and not Christ! That's the difference between you and I, Christ is my Righteousness, the object of my Faith !
 
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