Yes a highly valuable thread. Just like the Messianic Christology thread.
Calvinists are replacement theologians which is why they've never heard these things. It doesn't fit their theology.
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ECT Grace is unconditional but not universal
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Yes a highly valuable thread. Just like the Messianic Christology thread.
Calvinists are replacement theologians which is why they've never heard these things. It doesn't fit their theology.
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Sonnet
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Grace is unconditional but not universal
As a Christian Israel is the focal point of my life. There is a Remnant of believing Jews who are true Jews. Gentiles are partakers of the Jew's spiritual blessings.
Paul taught that there can be any type of brethren, presbyterian, baptist, but there is one type of brethren that we can't be - ignorant brethren
“For I would not, brethren, have you ignorant of this mystery, lest ye be wise in your own conceits, that a hardening in part hath befallen Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in; and so all Israel shall be saved: even as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer; He shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: And this is my covenant unto them, When I shall take away their sins.”
**Romans *11:25-27 *ASV
http://bible.com/12/rom.11.25-27.asv
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As a Christian Israel is the focal point of my life. There is a Remnant of believing Jews who are true Jews. Gentiles are partakers of the Jew's spiritual blessings.
Paul taught that there can be any type of brethren, presbyterian, baptist, but there is one type of brethren that we can't be - ignorant brethren
“For I would not, brethren, have you ignorant of this mystery, lest ye be wise in your own conceits, that a hardening in part hath befallen Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in; and so all Israel shall be saved: even as it is written, There shall come out of Zion the Deliverer; He shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: And this is my covenant unto them, When I shall take away their sins.”
**Romans *11:25-27 *ASV
http://bible.com/12/rom.11.25-27.asv
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Sonnet
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I am unclear how this is relevant to my point about Romans 10:1ff.
Isaiah 53
"But they did not all hearken to the glad tidings. For Isaiah saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?”
**Romans *10:16 *ASV
http://bible.com/12/rom.10.16.asv
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"But they did not all hearken to the glad tidings. For Isaiah saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?”
**Romans *10:16 *ASV
http://bible.com/12/rom.10.16.asv
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Here's a little kiss for ya
"I am inquired of by them that asked not for me; I am found of them that sought me not: I said, Behold me, behold me, unto a nation that was not called by my name. I have spread out my hands all the day unto a rebellious people, that walk in a way that is not good, after their own thoughts; a people that provoke me to my face continually, sacrificing in gardens, and burning incense upon bricks; that sit among the graves, and lodge in the secret places; that eat swine’s flesh, and broth of abominable things is in their vessels; that say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me, for I am holier than thou. These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burneth all the day. Behold, it is written before me: I will not keep silence, but will recompense, yea, I will recompense into their bosom, your own iniquities, and the iniquities of your fathers together, saith Jehovah, that have burned incense upon the mountains, and blasphemed me upon the hills: therefore will I first measure their work into their bosom."
- **Isaiah *65:1-7
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Sonnet
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Right - on the whole Jews have rejected Christ - nevertheless, Paul tells these kinsmen of his what is required of them to be saved. No mention of any supposed sine qua non of being fore-chosen. Instead - he quotes from Deuteronomy 30:12ff with the context being v.11.
We know that Paul wasn't disingenuous.
"And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations, and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations. And strangers shall stand and feed your flocks, and foreigners shall be your plowmen and your vine-dressers. But ye shall be named the priests of Jehovah; men shall call you the ministers of our God: ye shall eat the wealth of the nations, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves. Instead of your shame ye shall have double; and instead of dishonor they shall rejoice in their portion: therefore in their land they shall possess double; everlasting joy shall be unto them. For I, Jehovah, love justice, I hate robbery with iniquity; and I will give them their recompense in truth, and I will make an everlasting covenant with them. And their seed shall be known among the nations, and their offspring among the peoples; all that see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the seed which Jehovah hath blessed."
- **Isaiah *61:4-9
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Sonnet
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You aren't addressing my point or I have misunderstood you.
Both.
But I'm a little bored with the Calvin thing for now. Nice chatting with you brother.
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Sonnet
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It is wearying.
Sonnet
New member
Unsubstantiated through non-response.
How many scriptures that explicitly teach tuLip Nang?
Sonnet
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"Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him."
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Sonnet
New member
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let them be under God’s curse!
Sonnet
New member
Now, brothers and sisters, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.
For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and that he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve. After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born.
For I am the least of the apostles and do not even deserve to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace to me was not without effect. No, I worked harder than all of them—yet not I, but the grace of God that was with me.
Whether, then, it is I or they, this is what we preach, and this is what you believed.
For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and that he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve. After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born.
For I am the least of the apostles and do not even deserve to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace to me was not without effect. No, I worked harder than all of them—yet not I, but the grace of God that was with me.
Whether, then, it is I or they, this is what we preach, and this is what you believed.
Sonnet
New member
Questions to a Calvinist:
Did Paul preach the following to unbelievers:
Christ was buried?
Calvinist: Yes
He rose on the third day?
Calvinist: Yes
He appeared to Cephas and the Twelve?
Calvinist: Yes
He appeared to five hundred people, James. all the apostles and Paul himself?
Calvinist: Yes
He died for our sins?
Calvinist: Er.......no.......
Paul -
"This is what we preach: Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, he was buried, he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve. After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born."
Did Paul preach the following to unbelievers:
Christ was buried?
Calvinist: Yes
He rose on the third day?
Calvinist: Yes
He appeared to Cephas and the Twelve?
Calvinist: Yes
He appeared to five hundred people, James. all the apostles and Paul himself?
Calvinist: Yes
He died for our sins?
Calvinist: Er.......no.......
Paul -
"This is what we preach: Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, he was buried, he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, and he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve. After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers and sisters at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born."
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Sonnet
New member
I merely disagree with you thus far, that is all.
You should put up or shut up.
Lon
Well-known member
:nono: "Yes"
More importantly, however: Has He died for your sins? You really are going to have to answer that.
Lon
Well-known member
Another quoted you or I'd never have seen this. Please do not mention me as such is showing your character and not mine. Such is for your own good. I don't deride people behind their backs (sin). You shouldn't either. Its between you and God. :wave:
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