beloved57
Well-known member
Yeah I added it because I'm supposed to , im not being dishonest and deceitful with the word.
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Free Will
- Thread starter Aetheryn
- Start date
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Shasta
Well-known member
What do you think the "flesh" means?
God's Truth
New member
We are flesh and spirit.
Hebrews 12:9, Zechariah 12:1, and Malachi 2:15.
Not all are only interested in pleasing their flesh.
So you don't think it's important for us to be able to understand what's being said, and instead just believe the literal translation?
Let me challenge you on that. If someone from a foreign country moved to the USA, and wanted to learn the english language, and as they were learning it, they hear someone say "let's hit the road."
To someone who doesn't understand the idiom, "let's hit the road" sounds like "let's go punch the road with our fist," but that's not what it means. It means to start traveling. this is why it's important to understand what's being said.
[/QUOTE]I believe what is plainly written and do not try to change what God says as you are doing.[/QUOTE]
I'm not changing God's Word. I'm using similar scripture to understand it.
You shouldn't be so superficial with your understanding of God's word. Using such a superficial interpretation of the Bible is why there are so many doctrinal issues between believers. I'm not saying learn Hebrew and Greek, I'm saying understand what is being said. A superficial understanding of God's word leads to a superficial relationship with it's Author.
That's what I said.
Calvinists teach that God predestined everything, and that inherently means that He knows the future. It's one of the founding tenets of Calvinism, and it stems from the Greek belief of "Fate."
Ever heard of Oedipus Rex? It's one of the best examples of "fate" in all of the pagan Greek beliefs.
Calvin got many of his beliefs from Augustine, who revered Aristotle and Plato, so much so that much of what he wrote was using the pagan Greek views of the Bible.
You might have noticed that not once have I referenced Greek philosophers to interpret a passage of Scripture except to show how they did, and why their interpretation doesn't match what the Bible says, and rarely at that.
As far as I'm aware, I've never argued that nothing is predestined, because you can't argue that point from the Bible. I'm arguing from the standpoint that only some things are predestined, everything else is coincidence or chance. Calvinists take it further by saying everything is predestined, which it's not, and cannot be (truthfully) argued from the Bible.
So your statement that God planned out how He would save the World before creation does not contradict my stance. However, if you use that statment to say that everything is predestined, that is wrong.
This is evidenced in Romans 9:
*For He says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion.” - Romans 9:15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans9:15&version=NKJV
And in Jeremiah 19:
*(they have also built the high places of Baal, to burn their sons with fire for burnt offerings to Baal, which I did not command or speak, nor did it come into My mind), - Jeremiah 19:5 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Jeremiah19:5&version=NKJV
Perhaps you should learn more.
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beloved57
Well-known member
*For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; *and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. - Revelation 22:18-19 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation22:18-19&version=NKJV
You are adding to Scripture.
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God's Truth
New member
We all have flesh but we do not all live only to please our flesh. There are some people who are more spiritual, they want more out of this life. They are the people on the side of truth, and they are the people who come into the light.
John 18:37 "You are a king, then!" said Pilate. Jesus answered, "You say that I am a king. In fact, the reason I was born and came into the world is to testify to the truth. Everyone on the side of truth listens to me."
John 3:21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.
Shasta
Well-known member
Define what you mean by "flesh" and "carnal mind"
God's Truth
New member
God brings His words to us, and they have been translated. We do not have to learn another language.
Your analogy is not from the Bible.
That is a false judgment.
That is not true. In fact, those who take pride in their learning Hebrew and or Greek get further from the truth.
The Bible says what it says and you should believe it instead of trying to change it.
You said God did not hate Esau.
No. God knows everything that will happen is NOT a tenet for Calvinism.
You have to be kidding to make the argument that God does not know everything.
I never said that.
You are the one who is going against me for saying God knows everything!
That is a scripture where Paul explains why He let the Gentiles have salvation too.
That scripture is about God not ever wanting them to burn their children.
Perhaps you should.
beloved57
Well-known member
Yes by nature we all walk according to the flesh and are children of wrath Ephesians 2:2-3
2*Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3*Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
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Eagles Wings
New member
As a believer, I am subject to the will of God, both in His commands and His decrees. The Fall of Man, through Adam, is all part of God's redemptive plan, in Christ.
That's all I have to say on the subject right now, JR. Take good care.
God's Truth
New member
Those scriptures are about the Gentiles who were dead in their sins because they did not get circumcised and do the other purification works.
Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,
Ephesians 2:1
As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins,
Ephesians 2:5
made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.
That is about Jesus saving us and not making us get circumcised first as the Jews were.
Grace is that we do not have to do all the purification works to be saved, we only have to repent of our sins and believe we are washed.
beloved57
Well-known member
You need to study it in scripture. I'm not your flunky.
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beloved57
Well-known member
Shasta
Well-known member
Evasions and rabbit trails
beloved57
Well-known member
Shasta
Well-known member
I know what I think. In fact, not long ago I defined the term as I understood it. I was asking what YOUR definition was in order to better communicate. So you see how it it is. I take the time to explain my terms but you will not. That makes you the lazy one.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
What a terrible picture of 'God' you have. So your 'God' is not love afterall. Your very theology is antithetical to love, fairness and justice. How terrible.
beloved57
Well-known member
I have already communicated my understanding of it in previous post, you should have paid attention.
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