Free Will

[Nanja]

I am pleased to know that God's Will is being accomplished in my life, not by anything I have done by exercising my own so-called freewill, but that He, by His Grace and Mercy alone for all His Elect chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:3-7 has accomplished by the Blood Work of Christ my Surety, all that is necessary to obtain the Eternal Inheritance promised to me before the world began 2 Tim. 1:9!

Praise the Lord!

 

[Jerry Shugart]

They are still without excuse. Their not believing in God is the result of their being vessels of God's Wrath fitted for destruction.

From what you said earlier the unbelief of the people spoken of at Romans 1:19-20 was predestinated by God according to His will and purpose:

All things are predestinated by God according to His Will and Purpose.

With that in mind let us look at the passage again:

"Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse" (Ro.1:19-20).​

Paul is saying that the people who do not believe in God are "without excuse." But if the Lord willed that they would deny the existence of God then they would have a very good excuse.

They could say that the Lord willed that I will not believe in God and who am I that can go against His will? Therefore, the unbelievers would have a very good excuse for not believing in God.

Paul's words prove that your ideas are wrong because he says that the unbelievers are "without excuse."

 

[Nanja]

From what you said earlier the unbelief of the people spoken of at Romans 1:19-20 was predestinated by God according to His will and purpose:



With that in mind let us look at the passage again:

"Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse" (Ro.1:19-20).​

Paul is saying that the people who do not believe in God are "without excuse." But if the Lord willed that they would deny the existence of God then they would have a very good excuse.

They could say that the Lord willed that I will not believe in God and who am I that can go against His will? Therefore, the unbelievers would have a very good excuse for not believing in God.

Paul's words prove that your ideas are wrong because he says that the unbelievers are "without excuse."

Wrong. God willed to create the vessels of wrath to be destroyed Rom. 9:22, and they are without excuse:

Rom. 9:20
Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

And the reason they are unbelievers is because they were already condemned.

John 3:18,36
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Wrong. God willed to create the vessels of wrath to be destroyed Rom. 9:22, and they are without excuse:

Rom. 9:20
Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

And the reason they are unbelievers is because they were already condemned.

John 3:18,36
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Again showing that it is a choice to believe or not for at least some.

You didn't answer my previous questions either, though you did post a rehearsed response with no real tie to your personal position except that is has been hollowly rehearsed.

peace

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[beloved57]

If free will of man is an illusion, are you basically saying (in regards to my post) that God created Eve to disobey him?

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Show me a scripture that says man has a freewill, or that God gave man a freewill !

 

[popsthebuilder]

Show me a scripture that says man has a freewill, or that God gave man a freewill !

It's strange how no one will answer the question.

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[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

The worm doesn't have free will the have and use arms and legs like a man. Free will means free to use whatever they're capable to do in thier own nature.
I don't buy other ridiculous explainations of free will. That comes from the root of evil that appears good.

What are the characteristics of tyranny?

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

The Will of God is Supreme over all others's will.

God does whatever He pleases Psalm 115:3!

Including impute free will before Creation and His self Saccrifice for the cost of its abuse?

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

No one is capable of choosing anything and having it come to fruition, other than what God has Willed.

Child murderers? God essentially made the pederest with that logic. He then would follow suit and be equally His own adversary.

Are you suggesting the adversary of God is God?

 

[Aetheryn]

Show me a scripture that says man has a freewill, or that God gave man a freewill !

Genesis 2:16-17*

And the*Lord*God commanded the man, saying, “You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.”

Yet the Apple was eaten.

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[Aetheryn]

Proverbs 16:9*

The heart of man plans his way, but the*Lord*establishes his steps.



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[beloved57]

It's strange how no one will answer the question.

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Its been that way for about 10yrs !

 

[beloved57]

Genesis 2:16-17*

And the*Lord*God commanded the man, saying, “You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.”

Yet the Apple was eaten.

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Theres not one word about man having a freewill in that verse !

 

[Aetheryn]

Proverbs 16:9*

The heart of man plans his way, but the*Lord*establishes his steps.



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But there is in this one.

Although it would be foolish to not follow gods way, you have the choice to follow your own way. That's the definition of free will

Proverbs 16:9*

The heart of man plans his way, but the*Lord*establishes his steps.



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[Robert Pate]

Freewill of man is an illusion.

All things are predestinated by God according to His Will and Purpose.

Dan. 4:35
And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?


God has th right to make His creatures for whatever purpose He chooses.

Job 23:13-14
13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.
14 For he performeth the thing that is appointed for me: and many such things are with him.

These scriptures prove that God does not desire all men without exception to be saved but yet they are not.

Yea, and we are just a bunch of dump robots that can't think or make decisions.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

It's strange how no one will answer the question.

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Its been that way for about 10yrs !

Theres not one word about man having a freewill in that verse !

Yea, and we are just a bunch of dump robots that can't think or make decisions.

[MENTION=17355]popsthebuilder[/MENTION] and [MENTION=9508]Robert Pate[/MENTION], I tagged you both to see that Beloved57 has been directly answered on this matter, so I guess her 10 year drought is over.

Isaiah 61:1

The Spirit of Adonai Elohim is upon me, because Adonai has anointed me to announce good news to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted; to proclaim freedom to the captives, to let out into light those bound in the dark;

So, according to your logic [MENTION=6223]beloved57[/MENTION], God set us free from freedom of choice.

And while we are on this topic, the words free will won't be specifically used IN ANY VERSE, because it is a theological idea. This is exactly like the fact that TULIP isn't in the Bible. It is theological terminology of humanity and for you to disqualify free will from any verse because that exact arrangement of verbiage isn't present is to disqualify TULIP.

The T is for Total Depravity and this simply builds on the idea that mankind has a fallen nature..... wow.. seriously? It takes a theologian to state the obvious? I think not! And high Calvinism goes as far as to say that God elected Depravity as well as saves the Elect. The flaw in this is so obvious it needs no more addressing.

The U is for "unconditional Election", which is stated in dirty verbiage as Once saved always saved. It also sounds great until you realize that only the ones God chose can have this, and the others are out in the cold lost, no matter what they say or do.

The L is for Limited Atonement and quite frankly... the Limit part of it reveals its utter vulgarity!

The I is for Irresistible Grace.... I like this one and agree with it almost totally.

The P is for Perseverance of the Saints and again is a once saved always saved reference.

So.... There are 3 points that reassure the Calvinist that they are elected and good with God for utter salvation and 2 points that Condemn with malice the ... Non Elect, Depraved, Worthless children of God that He created with the intent of punishing for an eternity.

Now [MENTION=6223]beloved57[/MENTION], I asked you a few days ago this very question and it remains unanswered. Please tell me if you think John Calvin is infallible.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Freewill of man is an illusion.

All things are predestinated by God according to His Will and Purpose.

Dan. 4:35
And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?


God has th right to make His creatures for whatever purpose He chooses.

Job 23:13-14
13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.
14 For he performeth the thing that is appointed for me: and many such things are with him.

These scriptures prove that God does not desire all men without exception to be saved but yet they are not.

Yea, and we are just a bunch of dumb robots that can't think or make decisions.

Calvinism is the illusion. ; D

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Genesis 2:16-17*

And the*Lord*God commanded the man, saying, “You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.”

Yet the Apple was eaten.

Sent from my HTC Desire 610 using Tapatalk

Proverbs 16:9*

The heart of man plans his way, but the*Lord*establishes his steps.



Sent from my HTC Desire 610 using Tapatalk

[MENTION=17355]popsthebuilder[/MENTION] and [MENTION=9508]Robert Pate[/MENTION], I tagged you both to see that Beloved57 has been directly answered on this matter, so I guess her 10 year drought is over.

Isaiah 61:1

The Spirit of Adonai Elohim is upon me, because Adonai has anointed me to announce good news to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted; to proclaim freedom to the captives, to let out into light those bound in the dark;

So, according to your logic [MENTION=6223]beloved57[/MENTION], God set us free from freedom of choice.

And while we are on this topic, the words free will won't be specifically used. This is exactly like the fact that TULIP isn't in the Bible. It is theological terminology of humanity and for you to disqualify free will from any verse because that exact arrangement of verbiage isn't present is to disqualify TULIP.

The T is for Total Depravity and this simply builds on the idea that mankind has a fallen nature..... wow.. seriously? It takes a theologian to state the obvious? I think not! And high Calvinism goes as far as to say that God elected Depravity as well as saves the Elect. The flaw in this is so obvious it needs no more addressing.

The U is for "unconditional Election", which is stated in dirty verbiage as Once saved always saved. It also sounds great until you realize that only the ones God chose can have this, and the others are out in the cold lost, no matter what they say or do.

The L is for Limited Atonement and quite frankly... the Limit part of it reveals its utter vulgarity!

The I is for Irresistible Grace.... I like this one and agree with it almost totally.

The P is for Perseverance of the Saints and again is a once saved always saved reference.

So.... There are 3 points that reassure the Calvinist that they are elected and good with God for utter salvation and 2 points that Condemn with malice the ... Non Elect, Depraved, Worthless children of God that He created with the intent of punishing for an eternity.

Now [MENTION=6223]beloved57[/MENTION], I asked you a few days ago this very question and it remains unanswered. Please tell me if you think John Calvin is infallible.

You are correct that both of these verses denote that God is the Author of free will.

It is lunacy that the exact theological verbiage discussed has to be in a verse to support your understanding. That would pretty much tank ALL theology, if the exact verbiage had to be there to denote the idea as valid.

Even theological notation, where verse after verse is chained together throughout scripture, becomes worthless if you ask for the exact verbiage of the discussed idea.

Theology is an if this, than that concept, and claiming your verses are not acceptable destroys that entire premise.

 

[Aetheryn]

Then what would you have me do?

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[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Then what would you have me do?

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Is that a biblical reference, or a question that references an idea? I ask this because there are verses that sound like "what would you have me do".

If it is a question that references an idea, what are you referring to?

# Tolstoy reference?

# Acts 16:30?