Faith to believe on Christ !

beloved57

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Faith to believe on Christ is one of the Mysteries of Godliness 1 Tim 3:16

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Man cannot naturally believe on Christ for Salvation !
 

Nanja

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Faith to believe on Christ is one of the Mysteries of Godliness 1 Tim 3:16

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Man cannot naturally believe on Christ for Salvation !

Amen, before any person can believe on Christ, he must first be given New Birth by the Spirit,
by which, at that time, he is given the fruit / gift of Faith:

Gal. 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
 

beloved57

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It requires mercy to believe in Christ and the True God, its not something man can do naturally. The reason why it is necessary is because we are imprisoned in unbelief. Paul makes that clear here Rom 11:32

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

The word concluded means to be shut up in, bound to, even imprisoned. Mercy is needed when the circumstances have become hopeless. For a person to say they believed by their own freewill is a denial of the need for mercy, yet that's what it takes to be released from unbelief/disobedience.
 

beloved57

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There is simply is no other way to come to believe on Christ apart from God having mercy Rom 11:30

30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

They came to believe because they obtained mercy from God. Paul believed in Christ because he obtained mercy for being in unbelief 1 Tim 1:13

13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.
 

JudgeRightly

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It requires mercy to believe in Christ and the True God, its not something man can do naturally.

He CAN if drawn by God... As per John 6:44.

The reason why it is necessary is because we are imprisoned in unbelief.

Imprisoned DOES NOT mean that one cannot recognize that he is imprisoned and that when he recognizes such, it does not mean that he cannot seek freedom from the one offering it to him.

Paul makes that clear here Rom 11:32

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

The word concluded means to be shut up in, bound to, even imprisoned. Mercy is needed when the circumstances have become hopeless. For a person to say they believed by their own freewill is a denial of the need for mercy, yet that's what it takes to be released from unbelief/disobedience.

Romans 11:32 is talking about unbelieving Israel, who rejected her Messiah after He came to them for 3 years preaching. They shut up their own ears, and so Christ took away the light from them, as He explains in Matthew 25:29:

‘For to everyone who has, more will be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away. - Matthew 25:29 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew25:29&version=NKJV
 

beloved57

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He CAN if drawn by God... As per John 6:44.



Imprisoned DOES NOT mean that one cannot recognize that he is imprisoned and that when he recognizes such, it does not mean that he cannot seek freedom from the one offering it to him.



Romans 11:32 is talking about unbelieving Israel, who rejected her Messiah after He came to them for 3 years preaching. They shut up their own ears, and so Christ took away the light from them, as He explains in Matthew 25:29:

‘For to everyone who has, more will be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away. - Matthew 25:29 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew25:29&version=NKJV
Imprisoned means hes imprisoned in unbelief, he cant get out of it. How does a prisoner get out of prison ?
 

beloved57

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He CAN if drawn by God... As per John 6:44.



Imprisoned DOES NOT mean that one cannot recognize that he is imprisoned and that when he recognizes such, it does not mean that he cannot seek freedom from the one offering it to him.



Romans 11:32 is talking about unbelieving Israel, who rejected her Messiah after He came to them for 3 years preaching. They shut up their own ears, and so Christ took away the light from them, as He explains in Matthew 25:29:

‘For to everyone who has, more will be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away. - Matthew 25:29 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew25:29&version=NKJV
The only thing that can help a person imprisioned in unbelief is Mercy !
 

JudgeRightly

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Imprisoned means hes imprisoned in unbelief,

Not hitting the point of contention. We agree on this, what I'm addressing, however, is that you think that someone who is imprisoned in unbelief cannot recognize they are imprisoned when shown, which is simply false.

he cant get out of it.

No one said otherwise.

How does a prisoner get out of prison?

By first being freed, and then by walking out.

You seem to think that the prisoner is dragged out to free him, no?

The only thing that can help a person imprisoned in unbelief is Mercy!

Is it not merciful of God to have provided a gospel that can be preached to someone who is imprisoned in their unbelief?
 

beloved57

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Not hitting the point of contention. We agree on this, what I'm addressing, however, is that you think that someone who is imprisoned in unbelief cannot recognize they are imprisoned when shown, which is simply false.



No one said otherwise.



By first being freed, and then by walking out.

You seem to think that the prisoner is dragged out to free him, no?



Is it not merciful of God to have provided a gospel that can be preached to someone who is imprisoned in their unbelief?
A person by nature is confined , imprisoned in unbelief, until Gods have Mercy on them.
 

JudgeRightly

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A person by nature is confined , imprisoned in unbelief,

Yes, we agree.

until Gods

There is only one God.

have Mercy on them.

You're still not hitting the point of contention. Stop being a hypocrite and wasting my time.

I said:

Not hitting the point of contention. We agree on this, what I'm addressing, however, is that you think that someone who is imprisoned in unbelief cannot recognize they are imprisoned when shown, which is simply false.



No one said otherwise.



By first being freed, and then by walking out.

You seem to think that the prisoner is dragged out to free him, no?



Is it not merciful of God to have provided a gospel that can be preached to someone who is imprisoned in their unbelief?
 

beloved57

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Yes, we agree.



There is only one God.



You're still not hitting the point of contention. Stop being a hypocrite and wasting my time.

I said:
If you agree then that settles it. Man by nature is imprisoned to unbelief. Nothing changes as long as he is man by nature.
 

beloved57

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Mercy on a person imprisoned in unbelief is the mercy of the regenerating and renewing work of the Spirit, giving that unbeliever spiritual life and faith to reverse their unbelief Titus 3:5-6

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

This is part of Christs work as Saviour of His People, to renew them by the work of the Spirit, for its Mercy needed and applied !
 

JudgeRightly

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If you agree then that settles it.

Not until you address my point of contention, which is not that an unbeliever is imprisoned in his belief.

Man by nature is imprisoned to unbelief. Nothing changes as long as he is man by nature.

Now move to the next logical step of that, wherein my contention lies:

An unbeliever, imprisoned in his belief, CAN, if he is shown through the gospel, recognize that he is imprisoned, and have faith that his chains will be released by God.
 

beloved57

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Not until you address my point of contention, which is not that an unbeliever is imprisoned in his belief.



Now move to the next logical step of that, wherein my contention lies:

An unbeliever, imprisoned in his belief, CAN, if he is shown through the gospel, recognize that he is imprisoned, and have faith that his chains will be released by God.
Your contention changes nothing. Men naturally are imprisoned to unbelief ! The only way to help is Gods Mercy on them Rom 11:32

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

That mercy as I have explained is New Birth. Man otherwise is spiritually dead !
 

Nanja

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Faith to believe on Christ is one of the Mysteries of Godliness 1 Tim 3:16

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Man cannot naturally believe on Christ for Salvation !
Amen indeed Brother !
 

beloved57

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If we believe that Jesus Christ died for everyone, then thats not Faith in Christ. The Christ in scripture is the One who laid down His Life for His Sheep Jn 10:11,15

11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.

15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.

Jesus Christ of scripture only died for His People Matt 1:21, a people the Father has chosen before the foundation of the world. Believing in a christ that died for everyone, and of course knowing everyone wont be saved, changes the whole dynamic of the Cross and Faith in His Blood.
 

beloved57

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Faith pleases God Heb 11:6

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

The reason why Faith pleases God is because Faith is wrought into the Elect by God, Heb 13:20-21

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.
 

marke

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Faith pleases God Heb 11:6

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

The reason why Faith pleases God is because Faith is wrought into the Elect by God, Heb 13:20-21

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.
Faith is not given to sinners who refuse to seek God and does not come in a holy gift-wrapped package from God to the unresponsive and undeserving. Faith cometh by hearing the word of God. That means before a sinner can have faith or increase faith he must be willing to hear, to accept, and to believe the word of God imparted to him by the Holy Spirit.

God does not give eternal life to those who just hear the word of God, but to those who believe the word of God they hear.

Romans 10:17
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

No sinner who refuses to believe the word of God preached can be saved by faith because refusing to believe God produces no faith.

Romans 4
21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him;

24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;


If a sinner believes God he will receive imputed righteousness just like God imputed righteousness to Abraham because he believed God.
 

beloved57

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Once again, another scripture that is indicative of Faith having been wrought in us by God, its when men come[by Faith] to the light Jn 3:19-21

19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
 

marke

Well-known member
Once again, another scripture that is indicative of Faith having been wrought in us by God, its when men come[by Faith] to the light Jn 3:19-21

19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

The sinner that believes and receives the gospel and comes to Jesus for forgiveness and salvation finds that God is helping him do what is right in spite of his sinful nature. God does not make a person do what is right but when a person responds favorably to the drawing of the Holy Spirit the Lord He helps that sinner find Him.

Song of Solomon 1:4
Draw me, we will run after thee: the king hath brought me into his chambers: we will be glad and rejoice in thee, we will remember thy love more than wine: the upright love thee.
 
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