Covid Vaccination: I'm getting my first dose on Thursday

ffreeloader

Well-known member
The thing is= the vaccines work. HCQ doesn't.
Have a nice day.
Oh, what a rebuttal. Your logic and data are just overwhelming. NOT!

You don't address anything substantive and just post blind assertions. Here's a list of reports that show HCQ works and works well.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16115318/ Look at the date this study was published.

Here's a list of 181 studies. Out of 181 studies, with several of them that say HCQ doesn't work are known to be fraudulent, 120 of them say HCQ works. https://c19study.com/

So here you go. One hundred and eighty two studies to read. Expand your mind for a change.
 

chair

Well-known member
Yup. The government there is doing just what the US does. They apply any death to the covid count. According to the CDC the US had .9% more deaths in 2020 than it had in 2019, which had .9% more deaths than in 2018. The numbers track like that except for some time around 2015 at which time the increase dropped to .8% and followed that trajectory for several previous years.

So, how did the US have 300,000 or so deaths from the coronavirus when total deaths were only 61,000 greater than the year before? And that included increased deaths from suicide and drug overdoses over and above 2019 levels.

Start doing some deep dives on mortality statistics rather than just swallowing whole anything the press tells you. Think and research for yourself.
You're the Big Reader, right? Have you seen the reports and footage of what the hospitals look like? In the UK? In California?
 

chair

Well-known member
Oh, what a rebuttal. Your logic and data are just overwhelming. NOT!

You don't address anything substantive and just post blind assertions. Here's a list of reports that show HCQ works and works well.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16115318/ Look at the date this study was published.

Here's a list of 181 studies. Out of 181 studies, with several of them that say HCQ doesn't work are known to be fraudulent, 120 of them say HCQ works. https://c19study.com/

So here you go. One hundred and eighty two studies to read. Expand your mind for a change.
Believe it or not, I do open some of the links you post. And I follow the references that they refer to- and discover that they misrepresent things. Consistently.

No- I did not check every one of the references. Because the pattern is clear. Take the article from 2005.

They did an experiment on "primate cells" in test tubes. HCQ had a positive effect! Do you have any idea what that means? Do you think the mainstream medical community isn't aware of this?

By the way- I don't own a TV.
 

eider

Well-known member
Yup. The government there is doing just what the US does. They apply any death to the covid count. According to the CDC the US had .9% more deaths in 2020 than it had in 2019, which had .9% more deaths than in 2018. The numbers track like that except for some time around 2015 at which time the increase dropped to .8% and followed that trajectory for several previous years.

So, how did the US have 300,000 or so deaths from the coronavirus when total deaths were only 61,000 greater than the year before? And that included increased deaths from suicide and drug overdoses over and above 2019 levels.

Start doing some deep dives on mortality statistics rather than just swallowing whole anything the press tells you. Think and research for yourself.
Wow....... that wicked Conservative UK government!
And that wicked Republican/Conservative US Government, both of them deceiving the people like that!

......... Not.....
 

chair

Well-known member
Wow....... that wicked Conservative UK government!
And that wicked Republican/Conservative US Government, both of them deceiving the people like that!

......... Not.....
I still haven't quite followed what the working hypothesis is.

Some group of people (who?) are trying to control us (why?) by...making everybody think that there is a pandemic. They are also deliberately destroying the world economy. Why? What good does this 'control' do for them?

They have among their ranks the governments of nearly every country on the planet- including countries with very different ideologies- why are they all colluding on this?

What is the secret goal of the unnecessary vaccine?
Why are they preventing us from using simple drugs that will work (to cure a...non existent disease)

Whatever the exact hypothesis- how can one test it?
To this I have an answer: If this is a control thing, then the people (or aliens- it makes no difference) will have no reason to end this. If it ends- it proves that the hypothesis was wrong.
 

eider

Well-known member
I still haven't quite followed what the working hypothesis is.

Some group of people (who?) are trying to control us (why?) by...making everybody think that there is a pandemic. They are also deliberately destroying the world economy. Why? What good does this 'control' do for them?
Hi.....
It is just senseless.....
So the UK Conservative and US Republican Governments are both conniving and deceiving in order to bring down the people ..... of their countries....

We've made mistakes. Many mistakes, because none of our specialists had ever specialised in handling any sickness like this before. It was a massive learning and if we could return to last February I do expect that both our countries would have made some different decisions than back then. But this constant obstructive nonsense punctuated with claims that various kinds of quackery are the perfect solution is just craziness.
They have among their ranks the governments of nearly every country on the planet- including countries with very different ideologies- why are they all colluding on this?

What is the secret goal of the unnecessary vaccine?
Why are they preventing us from using simple drugs that will work (to cure a...non existent disease)
I read and hear about so many European countries that are deluged with Covid cases now, their hospital systems creaking under the pressures and all rolling out various vaccines in the hope that they can stem the advancing waves of sickness.

And deluded people are trying to tell us that it's all a scam.
Whatever the exact hypothesis- how can one test it?
To this I have an answer: If this is a control thing, then the people (or aliens- it makes no difference) will have no reason to end this. If it ends- it proves that the hypothesis was wrong.

Don't bother trying to test it, is my suggestion.
Do you notice how some members are determined to rubbish the various vaccines? Our governments have ALL decided that to launch vaccines in this emergency as early as possible is the ONLY way to protect our communities from this sickness.
 

eider

Well-known member
The same governments who decided that mandatory masks were the only way to protect our communities from this sickness?
Oh, do stop being stupid!
Back in the day, masks, social distancing, constant hand cleansing, staying at home..... was all they could advise us to do.

Do stop throwing rocks at government's best efforts to protect their people.
Look around the whole World....... see what most governments are doing for their people.
Stop chucking muck at everything.

You always were a bore imo, but I think you're going to be a very sore misery for a while.

It's time to cut down on replies to you.
Now you take care, stay well, enjoy your trucking job (whatever) and look after your wife, relatives, household and self.
 

Yorzhik

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Ah- I forgot that in a Free Country like the USA, one will never get fined for crossing the street wrong. And there never has been a draft into the army. Not are people forced to pay taxes.

Other countries, being less free, have to deal with such things. We are jealous of you.
Again, the roads are owned by the government. This example has proven my point every time you bring it up. It's almost like you don't learn from your mistakes.

The army stopped the draft because it was wrong. Your argument proves my point.

But in the end, the original discussion was when you said "There are times when you have to give up on part of your liberty for the good of your community and country...

These are unusual times, and that requires unusual, though temporary means."

No, there doesn't have to be any additional liberty from the founding of the country given up to protect ourselves. These are not unusual times. There has been infectious diseases even before the country was founded! Imagine that!

Why do you keep thinking this disease is worse than any other that came before? Why should that make a difference in how much control the government has over you? Does it get you excited for the government to have control over you? Why do you think the people that have control over you will give it back, ignoring all understanding of human nature?
 
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chair

Well-known member
Again, the roads are owned by the government. This example has proven my point every time you bring it up. It's almost like you don't learn from your mistakes.

The army stopped the draft because it was wrong. Your argument proves my point.

But in the end, the original discussion was when you said "There are times when you have to give up on part of your liberty for the good of your community and country...

These are unusual times, and that requires unusual, though temporary means."

No, there doesn't have to be any additional liberty from the founding of the country given up to protect ourselves. These are not unusual times. There has been infectious diseases even before the country was founded! Imagine that!

Why do you keep thinking this disease is worse than any other that came before? Why should that make a difference in how much control the government has over you? Does it get you excited for the government to have control over you? Why do you think people having control over you will give it back, ignoring all understanding of human nature?
The army will start the draft again if there is a major war. You know that full well.
I ain't going to argue with your superior assessment about the severity of COVID. Believe what you will.

In a few months, we will see, in my country, whether the vaccine really helps, and whether the government will 'give up control' if it does. One of us will have to admit that we were wrong. See you then!
 

chair

Well-known member
“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”
― Benjamin Franklin, Memoirs of the life & writings of Benjamin Franklin
Note "essential" and "a little". And remember the context- what times he lived in.

Americans are spoiled. You haven't had a war on your soil in many generations, nor any kind of armed conflict that remotely threatened you. You forgot that a draft is sometimes needed, as is rationing. Endless freedom. Freedom, freedom, liberty, liberty- until a war really hits.

This time it's a war on a disease- and you don't know how to handle it. Some say 'epidemic? what epidemic?" others "give me liberty or give me death!- I'd rather die ( or kill my neighbor) than do social distancing or God forbid- wear a mask!" You've lost all sense of community responsibility to boot.

What will happen if the US has to go to war against China? Will you stand up to it, or will you let the CCP take over the world in the name of Freedom and Liberty?

Edit- a personal note. I am a US citizen, but I live in Israel. Our reaction in Israel to this epidemic has been far from perfect- but on the whole, here we understand that life is complicated and that there are real threats in the world- we've seen plenty of them.
 

Right Divider

Body part
Note "essential" and "a little". And remember the context- what times he lived in.
Many small businesses are closed, never to reopen again. I count that as ESSENTIAL.
This time it's a war on a disease- and you don't know how to handle it.
War on a disease that's hardly more deadly than the seasonal flu.

The hype was far more dangerous than the disease. The shut-downs will kill many more than the disease.
 

Yorzhik

Well-known member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
The army will start the draft again if there is a major war. You know that full well.
I ain't going to argue with your superior assessment about the severity of COVID. Believe what you will.

In a few months, we will see, in my country, whether the vaccine really helps, and whether the government will 'give up control' if it does. One of us will have to admit that we were wrong. See you then!
If there is another world war it will only be because people like you support government control above freedom.

In a few months COVID as we know it will be essentially gone like any other infectious disease whether there was a vaccine or not, like any other infectious disease. Whether they can scare you into believing a mutation COVID or new infectious disease requires the same government control remains to be seen.

But none of this is the point. The point is that the government destroyed a lot of people unjustly for their own pleasure. They aren't going to take the blame for what they did. That's the kind of person you are saying will give up control...

If they do relinquish control it will be because people like me were able to save people like you.
 

chair

Well-known member
If there is another world war it will only be because people like you support government control above freedom.

In a few months COVID as we know it will be essentially gone like any other infectious disease whether there was a vaccine or not, like any other infectious disease. Whether they can scare you into believing a mutation COVID or new infectious disease needs requires the same government control remains to be seen.

But none of this is the point. The point is that the government destroyed a lot of people unjustly for their own pleasure. They aren't going to take the blame for what they did. That's the kind of person you are saying will give up control...

If they do relinquish control it will be because people like me were able to save people like you.
The government destroyed people for...pleasure? Is it that evil? You honestly believe that is the motivation?

There are few people like you in some countries, including mine, and life will go back to normal without your heroics- and far sooner than it will in your Free Country.
 
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