Right Divider
Body part
Yes, that speaks of you.
You fail to rightly divide the Word of truth.
You believe a false story.
Like JW's.
Posing .... like JW's.
The real Jesus is THE LORD from heaven. The ONE LORD according to scripture.
Are you Going to Heaven?
- Thread starter ABMF
- Start date
Saying it doesn't make it so.
You have it backwards and when God shows you, you will not like it.
False.
Right Divider
Body part
You are the one who is wrong. And when God shows you, you will not like it.
I don't see how one thing implies the other. There are many self-apointed Christian religions that do not believe that there is an immortal soul that ends up in heaven or hell.
The Bible DOES NOT TEACH that all good people go to heaven when they are resurrected.
Instead, it offers a wonderful hope for the many people who will survive the great tribulation right here on the planet, and who, along with many who will be resurrected here as well, will live forever on a restored planet (Rev. 21:3,4). Even Jesus spoke of that wonderful hope in Matthew 5:5.
You aren't entirely wrong but are making a dispensational error in that you are ignoring the different dispensations.
As for the current Dispensation of Grace and the Body of Christ....
2 Corinthians 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed with our habitation which is from heaven, 3 if indeed, having been clothed, we shall not be found naked. 4 For we who are in this tent groan, being burdened, not because we want to be unclothed, but further clothed, that mortality may be swallowed up by life. 5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
6 So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. 7 For we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.
Philippians 1:21 For to me, to live is Christ, and to die is gain. 22 But if I live on in the flesh, this will mean fruit from my labor; yet what I shall choose I cannot tell. 23 For I am hard-pressed between the two, having a desire to depart and be with Christ, which is far better.
Philippians 3:20 For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly wait for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,
Colossians 1:5 because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel,
Colossians 3 If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God. 2 Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. 3 For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. 4 When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory.
Those that survive the Tribulation, the time of JACOB'S trouble (Jeremiah 30:7), will be Jews who will have come to Christ after the current Dispensation of Grace has ended and Dispensation of Law continued unto the completion of Daniel's 70th week, which is the Tribulation. After which time, as you suggest, their fate is not Heaven. They, as all righteous Jews, have the promise of inheriting the Earth (Matt 5:5 and elsewhere) which Christ will rule, from Jerusalem, for a thousand years (Revelation 20:1-6) . After that, when there is a New Heaven and a New Earth, it will be the Jews who both rule and inhabit the New Earth and live in the New Jerusalem which will have a "great and high wall with twelve gates, and twelve angels at the gates, and names written on them, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel" and the wall will have "twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb." (Revelation 21:12-14) (Biblically, 12 is very closely associated perfected government and with Israel in particular).
Of course, that doesn't mean that those who are not Jews cannot be on Earth or visit both the New Earth and the New Jerusalem nor is there any reason I can think of why a citizen of the New Jerusalem couldn't also visit the New Heaven. Indeed, the distinctions we make today will become more and more meaningless as time goes by and it won't matter much, a million years from now, whether one finds themselves on Earth or in Heaven...
Isaiah 65:17 "For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth; And the former shall not be remembered or come to mind."
Clete
@Clete, sorry but you write too much and most of it is about some of your beliefs, but not related to the hope of eternal life on Earth.
Can you tell me if you agree that according to the Scripture many people will live forever on Earth under better living conditions, or you don't? That is my point: what the Bible says about that hope.
It teaches much more about the future, of course, but this hope of eternal life on earth was given to all people before Christ like to Daniel (Dan. 12:13), including John the Baptist. He will not be part of the kings in heaven (Matt. 11:11,12).
Today many people around the world hope to survive the great tribulation and be part of that great crowd mentioned in Rev. 7:9,10,13-17. Actually, if you read verse 9 (Rev.7) you´ll see that it says they came "out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues".
Can you tell me if you agree that according to the Scripture many people will live forever on Earth under better living conditions, or you don't? That is my point: what the Bible says about that hope.
It teaches much more about the future, of course, but this hope of eternal life on earth was given to all people before Christ like to Daniel (Dan. 12:13), including John the Baptist. He will not be part of the kings in heaven (Matt. 11:11,12).
Today many people around the world hope to survive the great tribulation and be part of that great crowd mentioned in Rev. 7:9,10,13-17. Actually, if you read verse 9 (Rev.7) you´ll see that it says they came "out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues".
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Right Divider
Body part
Clete's post was a very reasonable length.
Clete's beliefs are soundly based on scripture and logic.
That's because you do not understand the plans that God has demonstrated in His Word.
Until you learn to rightly divide the Word of truth, you will continue to be confused.
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Thanks for your opinion. It is irrelevant to me. I am not your employee.
As has already been seen, the Bible teaches that many people will live on earth forever, like Daniel:
Dan. 12:13 “But as for you, go on to the end. You will rest, but you will stand up for your lot at the end of the days.”
As has already been seen, the Bible teaches that many people will live on earth forever, like Daniel:
Dan. 12:13 “But as for you, go on to the end. You will rest, but you will stand up for your lot at the end of the days.”
Right Divider
Body part
You're welcome.
Who cares?
No clue what you're talking about. Must be more confusion on your part.
The body of Christ was unknown at that time. Once again, your ignorance God's plans is clear.
Daniel was an Israelite. They were given a kingdom on the earth. God's has other plans for the body of Christ.
When the angel said these words to Daniel:
Dan. 12:13 “But as for you, go on to the end. You will rest, but you will stand up for your lot at the end of the days.”
How did he understand them? A clue: the angel told Daniel that he would rest.
So, isn't it true that the Bible teaches that many faithful people of God of old are going to receive their "lot" when they are resurrected on earth in the future? Abraham and his descendants faithful to Jehovah, including Moses, the prophets, the righteous Jewish kings, and millions more of God's servants of old will awaken from their rest in death right here on earth, and they will meet millions of survivors of the great tribulation, as Rev. 7 predicts. Isn't that wonderful?
Dan. 12:13 “But as for you, go on to the end. You will rest, but you will stand up for your lot at the end of the days.”
How did he understand them? A clue: the angel told Daniel that he would rest.
So, isn't it true that the Bible teaches that many faithful people of God of old are going to receive their "lot" when they are resurrected on earth in the future? Abraham and his descendants faithful to Jehovah, including Moses, the prophets, the righteous Jewish kings, and millions more of God's servants of old will awaken from their rest in death right here on earth, and they will meet millions of survivors of the great tribulation, as Rev. 7 predicts. Isn't that wonderful?
Right Divider
Body part
Only Paul's epistles explain God's other plan (that you seem to know nothing about).
I do know a lot of things that you don't even imagine, but I can't talk about all of them at the same time.
At this very moment and in this very thread of conversation, I have proven my point: the Bible promises eternal life on earth for millions of people (Matt. 5:5) ... However, the first post and title of this topic confuses people about that, because it implies that all good people are going to live in heaven. This is proven to be false. You do not agree?
At this very moment and in this very thread of conversation, I have proven my point: the Bible promises eternal life on earth for millions of people (Matt. 5:5) ... However, the first post and title of this topic confuses people about that, because it implies that all good people are going to live in heaven. This is proven to be false. You do not agree?
Right Divider
Body part
Learn to use the "Reply" feature here.
Nobody denied that.
Right division is the key.
P.S. The kingdom of heaven will be on the earth.
Thanks. That's all.
Good bye.
Translation:
"I'm too lazy to read even far enough to realized that every major point made was established with scripture and I sure as Hell can't be bothered to spend so much time away from my video games to actually respond with any substance anyway so don't bother writing anything in response to my posts."
My post wasn't that long at all. It wouldn't take you even five minutes to read the entire thing twice!
I've already answered that question. You'll have to read my post to know.
I quoted the bible extensively in my post. Read it.
As I pointed out in my post, you aren't entire wrong here but are making an important dispensational error. You are not a member of the nation of Israel and have a different calling and eternal fate than they do.
Not me! I have no worries at all about whether I will "survive the great tribulation". You should read my post!
Irrelevant.
Clete
Thanks, Clete, for answering.
Maybe I did not explain myself very well. I do not have to believe in what you are talking about to understand what the Bible says about the eternal life on earth for millions of people. I like to concentrate in just a few passages that talk exactly about what I am talking about ... I consider what exceeds that as superfluous, and in your post I found a lot of it.
Sorry if I bothered you; that is the way I like to explain my points: with specific texts ... not too many than can confuse others.
Now, about what you said, I do not understand exactly what you believe:
who are, according to your belief, those who will live on earth forever, the Jews or the non-Jews who are faithful to God?
Maybe I did not explain myself very well. I do not have to believe in what you are talking about to understand what the Bible says about the eternal life on earth for millions of people. I like to concentrate in just a few passages that talk exactly about what I am talking about ... I consider what exceeds that as superfluous, and in your post I found a lot of it.
Sorry if I bothered you; that is the way I like to explain my points: with specific texts ... not too many than can confuse others.
Now, about what you said, I do not understand exactly what you believe:
who are, according to your belief, those who will live on earth forever, the Jews or the non-Jews who are faithful to God?
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You don't have to believe in what I'm talking about to believe that David Koresh was a "sinning Messiah" either.
So what?
I do not believe you. You didn't read it and don't care to read it. If you want people to simply say "yes" or "no" or some other single syllable response to the things you say, you need to find a different hobby. This website is intended for discussion and debate not mindless echo-chambering. It is precisely at points of disagreement where conversation, when done with intelligence and respect, become interesting and fun. That is THE point of this website's existence.
Don't say things you don't mean. You aren't the least bit sorry for having wasted my time. You fully intend to do it again because you think you get to have control over how people respond to the things you post.
Well, it isn't clear. I know that it will be the City of Jerusalem in the Kingdom of Israel from which Christ will reign for a thousand years here on this Earth and that we, in the Body of Christ, will be occupied with other things, in Heaven, during that time. However, once the New Heaven and New Earth are created, there's very little information as to who will be where and for what purpose. It'll be an entirely different situation, entirely outside our current experience. There is, of course, no doubt, that, since there will be a New Earth, there will be people living on it. Whether you or I will be one of those people, I don't think there is sufficient biblical material to say one way or the other. What we can know is that Peter and the other Apostles are going to be reigning with Christ from the New Jerusalem, seeing as how their names are plastered all over the foundations of the city wall and all. So, that sounds pretty Jewish to me but, like I said in my first post, a million years from now, no one is going to care about much of anything that had anything to do with this Earth.
Clete
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