Annihilationism is taught in the bible

CherubRam

CherubRam

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[FONT=&quot]Annihilationism is taught in the bible [/FONT][FONT=&quot]

Annihilationism (also known as extinctionism or destructionism) is a belief that after the final judgment some human beings will be totally destroyed so as to not exist, or that their consciousness will be extinguished, rather than suffer everlasting torment in hell. Annihilationism is directly related to the doctrine of conditional immortality, the idea that a human soul is not immortal unless it is given eternal life by God.



[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Genesis 2:17[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Genesis 3:3[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "
God never said they could not examine the fruit.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Genesis 3:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. [/FONT]

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The serpent’s doctrine is that there is eternal life in Hell.
Note: The word Hell is nowhere to be found in the original bible text.




[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Deuteronomy 30:15[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
See, I set before you today life and prosperity, death and destruction.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Deuteronomy 32:39[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
"See now that I myself am He! There is no God besides me. I put to death and I bring to life, I have wounded and I will heal, and no one can deliver out of my hand.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]1 Samuel 2:6[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
"The LORD brings death and makes alive; he brings down to the grave and raises up.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Proverbs 2:18[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
For her house leads down to death, and her paths to the death of spirits.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Proverbs 8:36[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
But whoever fails to find me harms himself; all who hate me love death."

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Proverbs 11:19[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
The truly righteous man attains life, but he who pursues evil goes to his death.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Proverbs 16:25[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Proverbs 23:14[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Punish him with the rod and save his soul from death.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Psalm 56:13[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
For you have delivered me from death and my feet from stumbling, that I may walk before God in the light of life.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Psalm 118:18[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
The LORD has chastened me severely, but he has not given me over to death.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Hosea 13:14[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
"I will ransom them from the power of the grave ; I will redeem them from death. Where, O death, are your plagues? Where, O grave, is your destruction?

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 33:11[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Say to them, 'As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign LORD, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! Why will you die, O house of Israel?'

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 18:32[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent and live!

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 18:23[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I do not take any pleasure in the death of the wicked declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, I am pleased when they turn from their ways and live?

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Matthew 16:28[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death, but they will see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Mark 9:1[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
And he said to them, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death, but they will see the kingdom of God come with power."

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Luke 9:27[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death, but they will see the kingdom of God."

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]John 5:24[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
"I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Hebrews 5:7[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Hebrews 6:1[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death,…

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]James 5:20[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of his way will save him from death and cover over a multitude of sins.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Revelation 1:18[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I am the Living One; I was dead, and behold I am alive forever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades (Grave).

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Revelation 6:8[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades (Grave) was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Revelation 20:13[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and Death and Hades (grave) gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Revelation 20:14[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Then death and Hades (grave) were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

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[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Genesis 18:25[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Far be it from you to do such a thing—to kill the righteous with the wicked, treating the righteous and the wicked alike. Far be it from you! Will not the Judge of all the earth do right?”

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[FONT=&quot]Isaiah 26:14[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They are now dead, they live no more; their spirits do not rise.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] You punished them and brought them to ruin; you wiped out all memory of them.[/FONT]
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[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Matthew 10:28[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
And do not fear them which can kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both (soul / spirit) and body in (hell / Gehenna. )

A soul consist of both body and spirit.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Ecclesiastes 9:5[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even their name is forgotten.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Job 27:8[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
For what hope have the godless when they are cut off, when God takes away their life?[/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The Serpent's doctrine is that there is eternal life in Hell, and that God is a liar, and that people will not surly die.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Genesis 3:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Serpent’s Doctrine[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Hell is the Serpent’s Doctrine that there is eternal life in Hell. Hell being a type of heaven according to Paganism.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]A soul is a body with a spirit. A body without a spirit is dead. Spirit is the nature of a person, place, or thing. Both body and spirit cease to exist as a life force until they are called back into being by God. Every little thing about us is recorded before we die.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Spirits die with the body. If people were not called back into being by God, they would never live again.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ψυχην[/FONT][FONT=&quot] / soul, psyche, Spirit[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Soul / [/FONT][FONT=&quot]ψυχή[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Psyche / [/FONT][FONT=&quot]ψυχή[/FONT][FONT=&quot], ψυχοσύνθεση[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Spirit / [/FONT][FONT=&quot]πνεύμα, ψυχή, διάθεση, οινόπνευμα, φρόνημα, ζωή[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Gehenna / A place of destruction. In a archaeological dig, no evidence of continual burning of trash was found. However, potsherds were found; a dump for broken clay pots.[/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot]The Hebrew Ge Hinnom, literally "Valley of Hinnom." This was known in the Old Testament as Gei Ben-Hinnom, literally the "Valley of the son of Hinnom", and in the Talmud as גהנם Gehinnam or גהנום Gehinnom.[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot]2 Kings 23:10[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]He desecrated Topheth, which was in the Valley of Ben Hinnom, so no one could use it to sacrifice their son or daughter in the fire to Molek.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2 Chronicles 28:3[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]He burned sacrifices in the Valley of Ben Hinnom and sacrificed his children in the fire, engaging in the detestable practices of the nations the Lord had driven out before the Israelites.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2 Chronicles 33:6[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]He sacrificed his children in the fire in the Valley of Ben Hinnom, practiced divination and witchcraft, sought omens, and consulted mediums and spiritists. He did much evil in the eyes of the Lord, arousing his anger.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Nehemiah 11:30[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Zanoah, Adullam and their villages, in Lachish and its fields, and in Azekah and its settlements. So they were living all the way from Beersheba to the Valley of Hinnom.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 7:31[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They have built the high places of Topheth in the Valley of Ben Hinnom to burn their sons and daughters in the fire—something I did not command, nor did it enter my mind.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 7:32[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]So beware, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when people will no longer call it Topheth or the Valley of Ben Hinnom, but the Valley of Slaughter, for they will bury the dead in Topheth until there is no more room.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 19:2[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]and go out to the Valley of Ben Hinnom, near the entrance of the Potsherd Gate. There proclaim the words I tell you,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 19:6[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]So beware, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when people will no longer call this place Topheth or the Valley of Ben Hinnom, but the Valley of Slaughter.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 32:35[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]They built high places for Baal in the Valley of Ben Hinnom to sacrifice their sons and daughters to Molek, though I never commanded—nor did it enter my mind—that they should do such a detestable thing and so make Judah sin.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In Context[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Full Chapter[/FONT][FONT=&quot] | [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Other Translations[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
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CherubRam

CherubRam

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[FONT=&quot]Comments on Hell. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Whenever I have told Christians that I do not believe in Hell, and give my reasons way, they reply; but Michael, there must be a Hell; otherwise people will do whatever they want. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]My reply back to them is, but Atheist do not believe in a God or a Hell, and they still do what they want. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Furthermore, they say; I could never worship such a vile God who would torture living beings for all eternity; I'm more humane than your God is.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]In English usage the word "Hades" first appears around 1600, as a term used to explain the article in the Apostles Creed, "He descended into hell", where the place of waiting (the place of "the spirits in prison" 1 Peter 3:19) into which Jesus is there affirmed to have gone after the Crucifixion needed to be distinguished from what had come to be more usually called "hell", i.e. the place or state of those finally damned. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The word hell was not originally in the Greek, Hebrew or Aramaic text as the so called biased translators have tried to establish it as scripture; but they were not good enough to cover up the reality of what God is saying. The source of this word hell and the concept of eternal torture is not Christian, but Pagan. You can find it in Babylon, in Greece, and especially Rome. But if you dig a little bit deeper you will see that it is bad translations that have infected this doctrine of Damnation in scriptures. As a matter of fact, scripture teaches the opposite.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The introduction of the word Hell is more than a mistranslation, it a premeditated and deliberate assault on scripture to in introduce the Teutonic pagan word.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Romans 1:32 NIV[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]32[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Hell. Germanic origin: Pagan Myth. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]The word was used to transfer the Pagan concept to Christian theology. For the Judaic-Christian origin of the concept, see Gehenna. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Hell[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Old English hel, hell, of Germanic origin; related to Dutch hel and German Hölle, from an Indo-European root meaning ‘to cover, conceal, or hide.
Hell was taught in Greek philosophy by Plato between 427-347 BC.

Hell
Also Hell, Old English hel, helle, "nether world, abode of the dead, infernal regions, place of torment for the wicked after death," from Proto-Germanic *haljo "the underworld" (cognates: Old Frisian helle, Old Saxon hellia, Dutch hel, Old Norse hel, German Hölle, Gothic halja "hell").

The English word may be in part from the Old Norse mythological Hel (from Proto-Germanic *halija "one who covers up or hides something"), in Norse mythology the name of Loki's daughter who rules over the evil dead in Niflheim, the lowest of all worlds (nifl "mist"). Hell is a pagan concept and word adapted to Christianity.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Tar-ta-rus (tartarus) [[ Gr Tartaros ]] Gr. Myth. 1.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] An infernal abyss below Hades, where Zeus hurls the rebel Titans, later a place of punishment for the demons and devils. (mentioned only once in the Bible)

Ha-des (hadez) [[Gr Haides ]] 1 Gr. Myth. a. The home of the dead, beneath the earth. b The god of the underworld. 2. Bible: The state or resting place of the dead: name used in some modern translations of the New Testament .[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Hades[/FONT][FONT=&quot] ( /ˈheɪdiːz/; from Greek ᾍδης (older form Ἀϝίδης), Hadēs, originally Ἅιδης, Haidēs or Άΐδης, Aidēs (Doric Ἀΐδας Aidas), meaning "the unseen") was the ancient Greek god of the underworld. The genitive ᾍδου, Haidou, was an elision to denote locality: "[the house/dominion] of Hades". Eventually, the nominative came to designate the abode of the dead.

In Greek mythology, Hades is the oldest male child of Cronus and Rhea. According to myth, he and his brothers Zeus and Poseidon defeated the Titans and claimed rulership over the cosmos, ruling the underworld, air, and sea, respectively; the solid earth, long the province of Gaia, was available to all three concurrently.

Hades was also called "Plouton" (Greek: Πλούτων, gen.: Πλούτωνος, meaning "Rich One"), a name which the Romans Latinized as Pluto. The Romans would associate Hades/Pluto with their own chthonic gods, Dis Pater and Orcus. The corresponding Etruscan god was Aita. Symbols associated with him are the Helm of Darkness, the bident and the three-headed dog, Cerberus.

She-ol (sheol) [[Heb shaal , to dig]] A place in the depths of the earth conceived of as the dwelling of the dead. Note: In the KJV about half of scriptures are translated as hell, the other half as grave.

Gehenna: Mentioned twelve or thirteen times in the bible. Gehenna: Referring to the Valley of Hinnom, or Gehenna which is the city dump outside the walls of Jerusalem.

Topheth is believed to be a location in Jerusalem, in the Valley of Hinnom, where the Canaanites sacrificed children to the god Moloch by burning them alive.[/FONT]
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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People are starved for controversial subjects. And they are starved for an actual conversation. However people are committed more to their political stance than the truth. Tolerance for dishonesty in politics and religion is what we have to deal with these days. Such deep levels of dishonesty leads to "criminality," and it has done so in the past.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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Genesis 2:17
but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."


Genesis 3:4
"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman.


Those who promote the Pagan concept of Hell do so in opposition to what God says.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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Our scriptures say that people will die, but the serpent says that is not true, that we will not truly die. So therefore, the SERPENTS DOCTRINE is that God is a liar. It is a parable to reveal what the serpent seed will teach. So I ask you, is there a Hell with LIVING BEINGS in it?

I give thanks to you Heavenly Father for hearing my complaint.

The Rich Man and Lazarus
Luke 16:19. "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
Wealth, comfort, poverty, and suffering have nothing to do with a person’s salvation.

22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
The word messenger is replaced with the word angel. And assuming that this is a parable, there would be no need for Lazarus to be carried to Abraham, and before the resurrection. As for being in Hell and torment and agony; that contradicts the verse that says the dead know nothing. It also is a contradiction where scripture says that Yahwah kills the condemned. In regards to the water on the finger; that would evaporate before it even got to a person. It also contradicts where God said “you will surly die.”

25"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

Again I say to you that wealth and poverty has nothing to do with the resurrection of the righteous. There is one truth in all of this, and that there is a chasm that has been set in place; and that is called death of the condemned, which are killed by Yahwah. There is no life for them afterward.

27"He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

29"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

30" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
31"He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

These are obviously the words of a dim wit, and not the words of an ancient being. No place in these verses is credit given to Yahwah, but only to Moses and the prophets; which would be unlike Yahshua to exclude Him in matters of life and death.

Hell is a pagan belief and part of the Pagan religion. Why would Yahshua use a nonexistent biblical teaching for which he never explains afterward? Before the return from Babylon, Judaism never taught the concept of hell. After the return from Babylon, the Hellenistic and Kabbalistic Jews began to introduce Hell into Judaism.

Yahshua never identified the story as a parable, and never explained the relevance as he did in other legitimate parables.
Yahshua, being an ancient being full of knowledge and wisdom, would have had the good sense to explain the new concept. Obviously, the story of “The Rich Man and Lazarus” are the words of some man introducing the Pagan concept of Hell.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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The "Lake of Fire" is a parable. The lake represents a body of people, and the word "Fire" is parabolic for "Judgement."
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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[FONT=&quot]Pope Gregory and Paganism[/FONT][FONT=&quot]. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.” [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well. [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Pope Gregory [/FONT][FONT=&quot]540 – 12 March 604. [/FONT]
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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The word Gehenna is used as a parable to mean, destruction.

Gehenna / A place of destruction. In a archaeological dig, no evidence of continual burning of trash was found. However, potsherds were found; a dump for broken clay pots.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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musterion said:
Prove it.
Click to expand...

[FONT=&quot]The word "FIRE" used as a parable [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This is a short list of the word FIRE being used to mean JUDGEMENT.


[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Psalm 78:21[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
When the LORD heard them, he was furious; his fire broke out against Jacob, and his wrath rose against Israel,

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Psalm 79:5[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
How long, LORD? Will you be angry forever? How long will your jealousy burn like fire?

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Psalm 89:46[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
How long, LORD? Will you hide yourself forever? How long will your wrath burn like fire?

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Psalm 104:4[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
He makes [winds / spirits] his messengers, flames of fire his servants.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Isaiah 4:4[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
The Lord will wash away the filth of the women of Zion; he will cleanse the bloodstains from Jerusalem by a spirit of judgment and a spirit of fire.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Isaiah 66:15[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
See, the LORD is coming with fire, and his chariots are like a whirlwind; he will bring down his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Isaiah 66:16[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
For with fire and with his sword the LORD will execute judgment on all people, and many will be those slain by the LORD.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Deuteronomy 32:22[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot].[/FONT][FONT=&quot] For a fire has been kindled by my wrath, one that burns to the realm of sheol below.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Amos 7:4[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
This is what the Sovereign LORD showed me: The Sovereign LORD was calling for judgment by fire; it dried up the great deep and devoured the land.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Hebrews 10:27[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]2 Peter 3:7[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.




The word "fire and lightning" is often used as a parable to mean judgment. In one place the word "coal" means judgment. And where there is smoke there is fire, so the word smoke can also be used as a parable to mean judgment.



[/FONT]
Jeremiah 51:55
The Lord will destroy Babylon; he will silence her noisy din. Waves of enemies will rage like great waters; the roar of their voices will resound.

Revelation 17:15
Then the angel said to me, “The waters you saw, where the prostitute sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages.
 
musterion

musterion

Well-known member
CherubRam said:
The word "FIRE" used as a parable
This is a short list of the word FIRE being used to mean JUDGEMENT.


Psalm 78:21
When the LORD heard them, he was furious; his fire broke out against Jacob, and his wrath rose against Israel,

Psalm 79:5
How long, LORD? Will you be angry forever? How long will your jealousy burn like fire?

Psalm 89:46
How long, LORD? Will you hide yourself forever? How long will your wrath burn like fire?

Psalm 104:4
He makes [winds / spirits] his messengers, flames of fire his servants.

Isaiah 4:4
The Lord will wash away the filth of the women of Zion; he will cleanse the bloodstains from Jerusalem by a spirit of judgment and a spirit of fire.

Isaiah 66:15
See, the LORD is coming with fire, and his chariots are like a whirlwind; he will bring down his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Isaiah 66:16
For with fire and with his sword the LORD will execute judgment on all people, and many will be those slain by the LORD.

Deuteronomy 32:22. For a fire has been kindled by my wrath, one that burns to the realm of sheol below.

Amos 7:4
This is what the Sovereign LORD showed me: The Sovereign LORD was calling for judgment by fire; it dried up the great deep and devoured the land.

Hebrews 10:27
but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.

2 Peter 3:7
By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.
Click to expand...

Words mean things. Sometimes fire means fire. There are other words that could have been used if "Lake of Judgment" was meant.
 
D

Danoh

New member
CherubRam said:
The "Lake of Fire" is a parable. The lake represents a body of people, and the word "Fire" is parabolic for "Judgement."
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Nope.

Isaiah 66:20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the LORD, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the LORD. 66:21 And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, saith the LORD. 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.

Isaiah 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD. 66:24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Both are...literal.

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Both are...literal.

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Both are...literal.

Rom. 5:6-8
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

New member
Danoh said:
Nope.

Isaiah 66:20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the LORD, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the LORD. 66:21 And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, saith the LORD. 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.

Isaiah 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD. 66:24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Both are...literal.

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Both are...literal.

Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Revelation 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them. 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Both are...literal.

Rom. 5:6-8
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You do not seem to know a parable when one is being used. Besides that, you are taking sides with the Serpent against God.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

New member
This is a warning that the bible would be tampered with. [FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 8:8[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]“‘How can you say, “We are wise, for we have the law of the Lord,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1 Timothy 1:3[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]As I urged you when I went into Macedonia, stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain people not to teach false doctrines any longer[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2 Timothy 4:3[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine[/FONT][FONT=&quot]. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jude 1:4[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God,…[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Isaiah 8:12[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“Do not call conspiracy everything this people calls a conspiracy; do not fear what they fear, and do not dread it.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremiah 11:9[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]And the Lord said unto me, A conspiracy is found among the men of Judah, and among the inhabitants of Jerusalem.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 22:25[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There is a conspiracy of her prophets in the midst thereof, like a roaring lion ravening the prey; they have devoured souls; they have taken the treasure and precious things; they have made her many widows in the midst thereof.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]2 Thessalonians 2:2[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us—whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter—asserting that the day of the Lord has already come…[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Here is that letter in our bibles.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Matthew 27:51[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
51[FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]52[FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]53[FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot]They came out of the tombs after Jesus’ resurrection and went into the holy city and appeared to many people.[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

Hell, Trinitarianism, and Sunday Sabbath do not belong in scriptures. Also, the word "church" and "cross" are not correct either. The correct translation is stake or pole, and congregation or assembly.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

New member
[FONT=&quot]Pope Gregory and Paganism[/FONT][FONT=&quot]. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.” [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well. [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Pope Gregory [/FONT][FONT=&quot]540 – 12 March 604. [/FONT]
 
D

Danoh

New member
CherubRam said:
You do not seem to know a parable when one is being used. Besides that, you are taking sides with the Serpent against God.
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Either that, or you don't know the difference between a parable, and a figure of speech

Let alone, when a parable is used to hide a thing and when it is used to reveal it.

Or when figure of speech is meant to be taken as a figure of speech, and when it is to be taken literally.

:chuckle:

As for your assertion that I am taking sides with the Serpent (a metaphor for a literal Adversary, by the way) against God(a literal for The Literal God of all Creation) - how so?

I mean, not that I'll agree with your explanation, but at least I'll hear it out.

For as the Apostle Paul makes obvious in Titus 1, at least to this "follower of Paul" even the opposition can at times say something the "witness" of which "is true" and is therefore worthy of considering.

So lay out the basis of this accusation of yours - I can not take offense - for I have Rom. 5:6-8 as my lens...towards what ever any man and or circumstance might send my way.

Which leaves me free to learn what ever there might be of merit to learn from anyone, friend or foe.

O what a Saviour...indeed.

Rom. 5:6-8.
 
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