Oh No Not Another Apocalypse Thread By Chrysostom

[chrysostom]

Irenaeus ancient copies Eusebius Victorinus

From Church History by Eusebius, Book 5 Chapter 8 has this about Irenaeus born 130 AD:

In the fifth book he speaks as follows concerning the Apocalypse of John, and the number of the name of
Antichrist:

"As these things are so, and this number is found in all the approved
and ancient copies, and those who saw John face to face confirm it,......"

Neither Eusebius, died 339 AD, nor Victorinus, died 303 AD, recognize the seven churches of the Apocalypse.
Eusebius in his Church History mentions six of the seven churches but never associates them with the Apocalypse.
Victorinus in his commentary on the Apocalypse mentions only the seven churches that Paul wrote to.

There is only one reasonable explanation for all this. The first version of the Apocalypse did not have the seven churches.

In Acts 19, Paul finds disciples of John the Baptist. John the Apostle may have found them with a version of the Apocalypse written by John the Baptist. It was the Apostle John who added Jesus and the seven churches.

 

[Clete]

Irenaeus ancient copies Eusebius Victorinus

From Church History by Eusebius, Book 5 Chapter 8 has this about Irenaeus born 130 AD:

In the fifth book he speaks as follows concerning the Apocalypse of John, and the number of the name of
Antichrist:

"As these things are so, and this number is found in all the approved
and ancient copies, and those who saw John face to face confirm it,......"

Neither Eusebius, died 339 AD, nor Victorinus, died 303 AD, recognize the seven churches of the Apocalypse.
Eusebius in his Church History mentions six of the seven churches but never associates them with the Apocalypse.
Victorinus in his commentary on the Apocalypse mentions only the seven churches that Paul wrote to.

There is only one reasonable explanation for all this. The first version of the Apocalypse did not have the seven churches.

In Acts 19, Paul finds disciples of John the Baptist. John the Apostle may have found them with a version of the Apocalypse written by John the Baptist. It was the Apostle John who added Jesus and the seven churches.

You know, it's really just too bad that God has been unable to maintain the scriptures properly and has allowed the false attribution of major parts of His word to the incorrect authors. Oops!



This is the second book of John's this week that I've seen someone try to suggest wasn't written by John! I saw some fool on Facebook try to suggest that the gospel of John was written by Lazarus and now you're here undermining the legitimacy of Revelation.

The fact is that not only does the book itself identify its author as John (i.e. by divine inspiration, I might add) but early church leaders like Justin Martyr (c. AD 150), Irenaeus (c. AD 180), and Tertullian (c. AD 200) all affirm that the author is John the Apostle, the son of Zebedee. Irenaeus, in particular, is important because he was a student of Polycarp, who was himself a disciple of John the Apostle.

 

[chrysostom]

Here we have Irenaeus in the second century talking about ancient copies of the Apocalypse. We also have Victorinus and Eusebius not aware of the seven churches of the Apocalypse in the 3rd and 4th centuries.

How would you explain that?

 

[Clete]

Here we have Irenaeus in the second century talking about ancient copies of the Apocalypse. We also have Victorinus and Eusebius not aware of the seven churches of the Apocalypse in the 3rd and 4th centuries.

How would you explain that?

I wouldn't.

Sort of like how you don't respond to my argument.

 

[chrysostom]

I wouldn't.

Sort of like how you don't respond to my argument.

My thread. I am in charge of the argument.

 

[chrysostom]

Lamb is mentioned 27 times in the Apocalypse. John the Apostle knew John the Baptist knew the Lamb of God. Who else would use the word lamb 27 times in a document?

 

[Clete]

My thread. I am in charge of the argument.

You're not in charge of me!

You want to have a discussion with me, then respond to the arguments I make. Otherwise, you can sit here and talk to yourself.

 

[Right Divider]

Lamb is mentioned 27 times in the Apocalypse. John the Apostle knew John the Baptist knew the Lamb of God. Who else would use the word lamb 27 times in a document?

Typical RCC "logic".

 

[Derf]

Irenaeus ancient copies Eusebius Victorinus

From Church History by Eusebius, Book 5 Chapter 8 has this about Irenaeus born 130 AD:

In the fifth book he speaks as follows concerning the Apocalypse of John, and the number of the name of
Antichrist:

"As these things are so, and this number is found in all the approved
and ancient copies, and those who saw John face to face confirm it,......"

Neither Eusebius, died 339 AD, nor Victorinus, died 303 AD, recognize the seven churches of the Apocalypse.
Eusebius in his Church History mentions six of the seven churches but never associates them with the Apocalypse.
Victorinus in his commentary on the Apocalypse mentions only the seven churches that Paul wrote to.

There is only one reasonable explanation for all this. The first version of the Apocalypse did not have the seven churches.

In Acts 19, Paul finds disciples of John the Baptist. John the Apostle may have found them with a version of the Apocalypse written by John the Baptist. It was the Apostle John who added Jesus and the seven churches.

What is the consequence of the assertion, assuming it is true?

 

[chrysostom]

What is the consequence of the assertion, assuming it is true?

A better understanding of what it is all about and an assurance that the good guys win in the end. You don't have to understand it but it might help if you did. According to Daniel, it will all be revealed as the end nears. With the internet the whole world can learn something overnight.

 

[chrysostom]

Otherwise, you can sit here and talk to yourself.

That is what I did in one of my more popular threads.

 

[Clete]

That is what I did in one of my more popular threads.

Someone should clue you in on the fact that 'views' are not 'reads', nor does it imply popularity.

You'll get far more out of this hobby if you'll engage in actual debate.

 

[Derf]

Someone should clue you in on the fact that 'views' are not 'reads', nor does it imply popularity.

You'll get far more out of this hobby if you'll engage in actual debate.

Like calling people "stupid" when they disagree you? That's "actual debate"?

 

[Right Divider]

Like calling people "stupid" when they disagree you? That's "actual debate"?

What a stupid post!