Constitutional Monarchy

[marke]

The argument we are making is that the BEST FORM OF GOVERNMENT for ANY COUNTRY is a constitutional monarchy, BASED on the principles found in the Bible.
[/QUOTE]

I need to see some verses that leave no doubt that God favors a monarchy over a Constitutional Republic. Piecing together interpretations are not the same as clear declarations from God.

 

[marke]

Again you spout your opinions and make NO argument. You are a sorry sad sack.

I think you are wrong if you say I make no arguments for my position. What is it with people around here calling others unkind names? That is not what the Bible is encouraging when we are commanded to love one another.

 

[Right Divider]

I think you are wrong if you say I make no arguments for my position.

Again, you simply make claims. Your opinions don't impress us.

What is it with people around here calling others unkind names?

Nobody has called you names. Please go ahead and SUPPORT that claim with some evidence.

That is not what the Bible is encouraging when we are commanded to love one another.

Love is not all candy and roses.

 

[Ed Dixon]

Nobody has called you names. Please go ahead and SUPPORT that claim with some evidence.

Again you spout your opinions and make NO argument. You are a sorry sad sack.

Too easy

 

[Right Divider]

Too easy

That was an accurate assessment. That does not qualify as name calling.

 

[Ed Dixon]

That was an accurate assessment. That does not qualify as name calling.

Let me guess, you're a democrat right? I should have seen that coming...

 

[marke]

That was an accurate assessment. That does not qualify as name calling.

Here is some good advice for us all:

James 4:11
Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.

 

[Clete]

You are not a kind person. Pride comes before destruction.

"Nice."

The word you're looking for is "Nice". I am not a nice person. I do not care about your feelings. I do not care about your personal opinions and I certainly do not care whether you like me or not. I am not here to make friend and I'm not here to influence people. I am here for MY OWN benefit and no one else's. If other's are benefited by my presence then all the better but that is not my purpose.

If you say stupid things to me then you're a waste of my time and I have no qualms about treating you as the mentally deficient person you present yourself to be. If you repent and start acting like a man with a mind that he's not afraid to engage then my comments toward you will reflect that too. It's really up to you but if you want to be stubbornly stupid then you aren't going to enjoy my company any more than I enjoy yours.

You have not proven God disfavored the Constitutional Republic established by early American leaders.

This thread was started by people who already basically agree on what the most ideal government would basically look like. The intent was to hash things out over details not to present an argument for the whole thing. You come along and want to discuss it as well, which is fine but in order to do so, it is necessary for you to be brought up to speed on what we're talking about and why. You've refused to do that and now want to pretend like our case hasn't been made.

Well, how would you know whether its been made?

The fact is that it has been made but you wouldn't know that because you're too lazy to read anything that multiple people have presented to you!

How kind is that, Marke? Just how kind do you think it is to show up here and stick your nose where it doesn't belong and then when your ignorance is put on display for the whole world to see you start telling me that pride comes before destruction? Of the two of us which is it that has been practically begging the other to stop presenting mere personal opinions based on complete ignorance and to read the material that establishes the biblical support for the things we are saying?

Matthew 7:3

Your interpretations of Scripture are not irrefutable but flawed if you think God clearly wills for America to be ruled by an earthly king.

Then refute it, Marke. Just stop with making baseless claims and refute me.

You will not even try to do so.

 

[Right Divider]

Let me guess, you're a democrat right?

Wrong.

I should have seen that coming...

You should know better

 

[Right Divider]

Here is some good advice for us all:

James 4:11
Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.

Explaining to you your problem is not "speaking evil" of you.

 

[marke]

"Nice."

The word you're looking for is "Nice". I am not a nice person. I do not care about your feelings. I do not care about your personal opinions and I certainly do not care whether you like me or not. I am not here to make friend and I'm not here to influence people. I am here for MY OWN benefit and no one else's. If other's are benefited by my presence then all the better but that is not my purpose.

If you say stupid things to me then you're a waste of my time and I have no qualms about treating you as the mentally deficient person you present yourself to be. If you repent and start acting like a man with a mind that he's not afraid to engage then my comments toward you will reflect that too. It's really up to you but if you want to be stubbornly stupid then you aren't going to enjoy my company any more than I enjoy yours.

The word I am looking for is "love." If you do not love others you are likely not saved.

1 John 4:20
If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

This thread was started by people who already basically agree on what the most ideal government would basically look like. The intent was to hash things out over details not to present an argument for the whole thing. You come along and want to discuss it as well, which is fine but in order to do so, it is necessary for you to be brought up to speed on what we're talking about and why. You've refused to do that and now want to pretend like our case hasn't been made.

Well, how would you know whether its been made?

The fact is that it has been made but you wouldn't know that because you're too lazy to read anything that multiple people have presented to you!

How kind is that, Marke? Just how kind do you think it is to show up here and stick your nose where it doesn't belong and then when your ignorance is put on display for the whole world to see you start telling me that pride comes before destruction? Of the two of us which is it that has been practically begging the other to stop presenting mere personal opinions based on complete ignorance and to read the material that establishes the biblical support for the things we are saying?

I support the Constitutional Republic form of government because I oppose governments run by one or only a few men of dubious Christian character. If I am wrong for submitting that opinion then make your case. If I am wrong to offer my opinions on a debate site then make your case.

Matthew 7:3

Then refute it, Marke. Just stop with making baseless claims and refute me.

You will not even try to do so.

Galatians 2:11
But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.

 

[marke]

Explaining to you your problem is not "speaking evil" of you.

Discussing issues and supporting one's opinions is not speaking evil. Calling people names for disagreeing with you is.

 

[Right Divider]

The word I am looking for is "love." If you do not love others you are likely not saved.

You appear to have an incorrect idea of what "love" is.

I support the Constitutional Republic form of government because I oppose governments run by one or only a few men of dubious Christian character.

Again, what does the Bible say about it?
Clete (and others) has tried to get you to answer this and you refuse.

Clete (and others) rightly point out that the only government in the Bible that God established was a constitutional monarchy and not a constitutional republic.

If I am wrong for submitting that opinion then make your case.

There is nothing wrong with "submitting your opinion". Just don't start thinking that this proves anything.

If I am wrong to offer my opinions on a debate site then make your case.

Opinions do NOTHING for a debate.

 

[Right Divider]

Discussing issues and supporting one's opinions is not speaking evil. Calling people names for disagreeing with you is.

I do not call you names because you disagree.
I call you names because you refuse to engage and YET you think that you are.
You are blind to your problem, even though it's been plainly shown to you.

 

[Ed Dixon]

Pettiness and insults won't get you anywhere here, Ed, but it will earn you a warning.

what are you warning me about? What are you gonna do? Kill me and eat me? send me home? Or are you warning me about actually subscribing to TOL? Don't worry, I have no intention of sending you 1 Penney. To be clear, I want nothing to do with TOLL anymore because of you, and your kind.

This is my 4th account here. I left years ago and I must say this place is just a shell of what it was 6 or 7 years ago. Good luck with your desolation.
Ban me and delete my account, I'll just shake the dust off and move on.

 

[marke]

You appear to have an incorrect idea of what "love" is.

Again, what does the Bible say about it?
Clete (and others) has tried to get you to answer this and you refuse.

Clete (and others) rightly point out that the only government in the Bible that God established was a constitutional monarchy and not a constitutional republic.

There is nothing wrong with "submitting your opinion". Just don't start thinking that this proves anything.

Opinions do NOTHING for a debate.

The OT Jews were ruled by an earthly king. How does that impose on us the idea that God prefers that all nations be ruled by an earthly king, especially given the long record of wicked kings in human history?

 

[Right Divider]

The OT Jews were ruled by an earthly king.

Correct.
Note that the Lord Jesus Christ will one day be the earthly King of the Jews (i.e., Israel).

How does that impose on us the idea that God prefers that all nations be ruled by an earthly king, especially given the long record of wicked kings in human history?

It doesn't.

But you've missed the point AGAIN.

God intended there to be a constitutional monarchy for His nation; the nation of Israel.

• The constitution was God's LAW.
• Christ was to be God's final and perfect KING.

God did NOT define the government for any other nation.

 

[marke]

Correct.
Note that the Lord Jesus Christ will one day be the earthly King of the Jews (i.e., Israel).

It doesn't.

But you've missed the point AGAIN.

God intended there to be a constitutional monarchy for His nation; the nation of Israel.

• The constitution was God's LAW.
• Christ was to be God's final and perfect KING.

God did NOT define the government for any other nation.

I agree that God intended for Israel to be ruled by an earthly king, although the Jewish kingdom was split and all of Israel's kings and some of Judah's kings were wicked rebels against God.

 

[Right Divider]

I agree that God intended for Israel to be ruled by an earthly king, although the Jewish kingdom was split and all of Israel's kings and some of Judah's kings were wicked rebels against God.

Again, that is irrelevant to the point of this thread.

 

[JudgeRightly]

I need to see some verses that leave no doubt that God favors a monarchy

Deuteronomy 17
1 Samuel 8
1 Samuel 16

1 Timothy 6:15
Revelation 17:14
Revelation 19:16

over a Constitutional Republic.

Over a representative form of government?

Numbers 16
Romans 13
Matthew 7:13-14
Titus 3:1

God > Government > men
NOT
God > Men > Government

Piecing together interpretations are not the same as clear declarations from God.

We're literally quoting scripture, and you have the gall to say that it's "interpretation"?

I think

You're not thinking. Please start thinking.

you are wrong if you say I make no arguments for my position.

Quote one post of yours so far in this thread that contains an argument that you have made, that has not already previously been addressed, or headed off in some way.

What is it with people around here calling others unkind names?

Again: https://kgov.com/nice

READ. IT.

That is not what the Bible is encouraging when we are commanded to love one another.

Misappropriating scripture won't help you here, marke.

It's called "rebuking your brother," something even Jesus said to do.

Here is some good advice for us all:

James 4:11
Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.

Bearing false witness is a sin, marke. This is me, rebuking you. Repent.

The word I am looking for is "love."

What about it?

If you do not love others you are likely not saved.

Why are you bringing up people's salvation here? This thread is about governments, which, last I checked, is NOT a salvific issue.

All we care about here in this thread is whether you can make the argument for your position, which so far, you have failed to do, and have only given your opinions on the matter.

I support the Constitutional Republic form of government because I oppose governments run by one or only a few men

Do you find anything wrong at all with one man leading a nation?

of dubious Christian character.

Not one of the men who ruled over Israel in the Old Testament were Christians. Believers in God, sure, some of them, but Christians they were not.

God says that the majority is evil (Matthew 7:13-14). And since the majority is evil, majority rule (eg: democracies/republics) is guaranteed, over time, to be evil.

If I am wrong for submitting that opinion

You're not. We just don't care to hear about your opinion, unless you can support that opinion by making the argument FOR it.

then make your case.

We have. You have, largely, ignored it.

If I am wrong to offer my opinions on a debate site then make your case.

Supra.

Discussing issues and supporting one's opinions

You have done neither. You have merely given your opinion multiple times.

is not speaking evil.

Duh.

Calling people names for disagreeing with you is.

Rebuke is not evil, either, which is what we're doing.

Calling people names is something even Jesus did. It wasn't evil in the slightest.

The OT Jews were ruled by an earthly king.

Yes they were.

How does that impose on us the idea that God prefers that all nations be ruled by an earthly king,

See post #158.

especially given the long record of wicked kings in human history?

Just because men are evil doesn't mean that the system is bad. There is no, repeat, NO, human system of government that will have zero flaws, because they ALL require flawed humans to work.

I agree that God intended for Israel to be ruled by an earthly king, although the Jewish kingdom was split and all of Israel's kings and some of Judah's kings were wicked rebels against God.

And how is that at all relevant?