beloved57
Well-known member
Man is dead to God friend by nature.
Does man naturally have ability to Seek God ?
- Thread starter beloved57
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Please provide the chapter and verse that says the following, or retract the claim:
beloved57
Well-known member
Man is dead in sin, that's why he must be made alive Eph 2:1,5
Calvinists erroneously think unsaved sinners are dead in such a way that they can't reason with God like Cain, Baalam, and Judas did, to name a few.
Please provide the chapter and verse that says the following, or retract the claim:
beloved57
Well-known member
Man is dead in sin by nature.
That is not a scripture verse. Repeating yourself won't make my challenge go away.
Please provide the chapter and verse that says the following, or retract the claim:
beloved57
Well-known member
Man is dead in sin by nature.
I have given the scripture verse that man is dead spiritually in trespasses and sins.
:yawn:
You have not provided any verse that says the following:
Please provide the chapter and verse that says the above, or retract your claim. Last chance.
Was Cain dead at the time he was reasoning with God? If so, does that mean the spiritually dead can still understand God and reason with God?
Genesis 4
9 And the Lord said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?
10 And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.
11 And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
12 When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.
13 And Cain said unto the Lord, My punishment is greater than I can bear.
Nanja
Well-known member
Exactly !
Is
It possible for the spiritually dead to talk and reason with God? It must be since Cain, Baalam, and Judas did.
It appears that neither @Nanja nor @beloved57 is intellectually honest enough to acknowledge that the Bible does not say what B57 said, which is that:
Because the Bible does not say that man comes out of the womb spiritually dead, everything else that @beloved57 and @Nanja posts that has that as its foundation is called into question, and cannot take for granted that man comes out of the womb spiritually dead, meaning that they must needs prove what they say elsewhere, and cannot simply say "I explained it previously elsewhere."
Because the Bible does not say that man comes out of the womb spiritually dead, everything else that @beloved57 and @Nanja posts that has that as its foundation is called into question, and cannot take for granted that man comes out of the womb spiritually dead, meaning that they must needs prove what they say elsewhere, and cannot simply say "I explained it previously elsewhere."
beloved57
Well-known member
It doesnt say man doesnt come out of the womb spiritually dead. But it says man is spiritually dead.
Thank you for finally retracting your claim that man is spiritually dead from birth.
I agree, with the caveat that only fallen man is spiritually dead.
So if man is not spiritually dead from birth, but he IS spiritually dead, then at what point does he become spiritually dead?
beloved57
Well-known member
I didnt retract it, its in your imagination.
Then at the very least, thank you for admitting that your claim is not in the Bible.
The first question remains: So if man is not spiritually dead from birth, but he IS spiritually dead, then at what point does he become spiritually dead?
A second question now is, "Why do you promote a belief that is not supported by scripture?"
beloved57
Well-known member
Man is spiritually dead, born that way.In Adam all died.
Of course humans are spiritually dead until they are born again. Even the elect are spiritually dead until they are born again. But God speaks to the spiritually dead and the spiritually dead respond, in spite of not yet being born again.
Right Divider
Body part
So many Christians use the term "the elect" as if it is exactly equivalent to "the saved". It is not!
"The elect" or "mine elect" always has a CONTEXT and they are NOT always the SAME.