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Does forgiveness require repentance?

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  • Theology Club: Does forgiveness require repentance?

    What say you?
    7
    yes
    28.57%
    2
    no
    71.43%
    5
    not sure
    0.00%
    0
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.

    Jim Elliot

  • #2
    No.

    Forgiveness produces repentance . . . not vice versa.
    "The immutable God never learned anything and never changed his mind. He knew everything from eternity."

    " The difference between faith and saving faith are the propositions believed."
    Gordon H. Clark

    "If a man be lost, God must not have the blame for it; but if a man be saved, God must have the glory of it."
    Charles Spurgeon

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Bright Raven View Post
      What say you?
      I say most people don't have a clue what repentance means. Repentance is a change of mind...a turning....from UNBELIEF to BELIEF. Therefore, my answer would be YES. We must turn from serving idols to serving the true and living God. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will receive forgiveness of sins (saved).
      1 Thessalonians 1:9
      For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;

      Comment


      • #4
        Shoot, both of the above

        I was thinking, as a parent, I've long ago forgiven one of my children of an offense but they don't know it until they come to me afterwards. Sometimes they wait so long I've forgotten o.O

        At any rate, I suppose it would need to be clarified what we mean by repentance and forgiveness both.

        It is in the nature of God to forgive but that such has a demand that we are in Him for such to be efficacious.
        Repentance is needed to be in Christ.

        For the most part, I'm not overtly concerned which comes first, in one's theology,as long is there is both a cart (repentance) and horse (forgiveness) for a person to be in Christ. I believe at least the willingness of God to forgive proceeds even our existence in God.
        We must be in Christ to be forgiven. I believe this honors scripture. Acts 2:38; 3:19; 20:21; 26:20
        Hebrews 10:16-25

        In Him

        -Lon
        My New Years Resolution: 1 Peter 3:15
        Omniscient without man's qualification. John 1:3 "Nothing"
        Colossians 1:17 "Nothing" John 15:5 "Nothing"
        Mighty, ALL mighty (omnipotent). Revelation 1:8
        No possible limitation Isaiah 40:25 Joshua 24:15
        Infinite (Omnipresent) Psalm 145:3 Hebrews 4:13

        ? Yep

        Now to Him who is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think... Amen. -Ephesians 3:20 & 21

        ... when I became an adult, I set aside childish ways. Titus 3:10 Ephesians 4:29-32; 5:11

        Separation of church and State is not atheism "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."

        Comment


        • #5
          Does forgiveness require repentance?
          Its the other way around, Repentance requires Forgiveness ! Before God grants Repentance, that individual must have already been forgiven because of Christ's death for them ! If Christ has not died for one and saved them by His Blood, they have no Right to repent, they are obligated to keep the whole Moral law of God perfectly without sinning in word, thought, action, their entire life ! If they sin once, they are guilty of breaking the whole law and will be judged according to their works in the day of Judgment without mercy !
          "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
          preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
          called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
          a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

          Charles Spurgeon !

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by glorydaz View Post
            I say most people don't have a clue what repentance means. Repentance is a change of mind...a turning....from UNBELIEF to BELIEF. Therefore, my answer would be YES. We must turn from serving idols to serving the true and living God. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will receive forgiveness of sins (saved).
            1 Thessalonians 1:9
            For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;
            ^This

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by beloved57 View Post
              Its the other way around, Repentance requires Forgiveness ! Before God grants Repentance, that individual must have already been forgiven because of Christ's death for them ! If Christ has not died for one and saved them by His Blood, they have no Right to repent, they are obligated to keep the whole Moral law of God perfectly without sinning in word, thought, action, their entire life ! If they sin once, they are guilty of breaking the whole law and will be judged according to their works in the day of Judgment without mercy !

              Yes. Repentance is given only to the ones Christ died for;
              not something a person performs to get forgiveness.

              God gives repentance to only His Chosen Seed.
              Acts 5:31 KJV; Is. 45:17 KJV; Eph. 1:4 KJV

              ~~~~~
              My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever;
              when shall I be brought in to see His Face? - Psalm 42:2

              Comment


              • #8
                nanja

                Yes. Repentance is given only to the ones Christ died for;
                not something a person performs to get forgiveness.
                Amen, for Christ did the performing in order to give Repentance to those on behalf He performed for Acts 5:31

                31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel[The Israel of God Gal 6:16], and forgiveness of sins.

                Acts 11:18

                18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

                Thats what a Saviour does, He gives Repentance to those He contracted to save from their sins !
                "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
                preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
                called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
                a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

                Charles Spurgeon !

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
                  ^This
                  1 Thessalonians 1:9
                  For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;
                  No one of himself can turn unless God turns him.
                  Lam. 5:21 KJV; Psalm 80:3

                  ~~~~~
                  My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever;
                  when shall I be brought in to see His Face? - Psalm 42:2

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    nanja

                    No one of himself can turn unless God turns him.
                    Lam. 5:21 KJV; Psalm 80:3
                    Amen, and thats what Jesus does by granting His Sheep Repentance, He blesses them as stated here Acts 3:25-26

                    25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.

                    26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.
                    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
                    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
                    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
                    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

                    Charles Spurgeon !

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      beloved
                      Thats what a Saviour does, He gives Repentance to those He contracted to save from their sins !

                      1 Peter 1:20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world,
                      but was manifest in these last times for you

                      Being foreordained speaks of the Everlasting Covenant of Grace for them:

                      Heb. 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus,
                      that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant

                      ~~~~~
                      My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever;
                      when shall I be brought in to see His Face? - Psalm 42:2

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Nanja View Post
                        beloved



                        1 Peter 1:20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world,
                        but was manifest in these last times for you

                        Being foreordained speaks of the Everlasting Covenant of Grace for them:

                        Heb. 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus,
                        that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant

                        ~~~~~
                        Yes, thats exactly when the contract was settled, in the Eternal Counsels of the Everlasting Covenant, wherein He was declared Surety Heb 7:22

                        22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.
                        "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
                        preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
                        called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
                        a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

                        Charles Spurgeon !

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by beloved57 View Post
                          nanja



                          Amen, and thats what Jesus does by granting His Sheep Repentance, He blesses them as stated here Acts 3:25-26

                          25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.

                          26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.

                          Amen. He turns them from their ungodliness:

                          Rom. 11:26-27 And so all Israel shall be saved:
                          as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer,
                          and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
                          For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

                          ~~~~~
                          My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever;
                          when shall I be brought in to see His Face? - Psalm 42:2

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Nanja View Post
                            Amen. He turns them from their ungodliness:

                            Rom. 11:26-27 And so all Israel shall be saved:
                            as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer,
                            and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
                            For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

                            ~~~~~
                            Right, and we see from this passage that Gentiles were included in the saving all Israel . The Israel here is not Abraham's physical descendants, but God's Elect in Christ comprised of all nations, thats Abraham's Seed Gal 3:29

                            29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

                            The Promise is Isa 45:17

                            17 But Israel shall be saved in the Lord with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.
                            "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
                            preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
                            called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
                            a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

                            Charles Spurgeon !

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by glorydaz View Post
                              I say most people don't have a clue what repentance means. Repentance is a change of mind...a turning....from UNBELIEF to BELIEF. Therefore, my answer would be YES. We must turn from serving idols to serving the true and living God. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will receive forgiveness of sins (saved).
                              1 Thessalonians 1:9
                              For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;
                              That^
                              sigpic

                              Comment

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