South Carolina Cop Tosses Student Around

Huckleberry

New member
Now, how about the two of them picking up the desk and carrying it outside and dumping her there?
Because she would then be free to assault either or both, risking all three of them being injured as a result.

Look, it's a hard pill to swallow, maybe, but once it progresses to the point where you have to physically remove someone, it has to be done in a way that minimizes risk to all involved. That usually means focusing on rendering the one who's behaving badly incapable of attacking while you move them. That means grapples, joint locks, handcuffing...whatever it takes.

Now, you watch the video again and then explain to us all how the cop should have removed the girl from her desk and moved her out of the classroom with the least amount of injury to all involved.

If your way seems reasonable and accomplishes this, you might have an argument here.
 

GuySmiley

Well-known member
Shouldn't be there in the first place.
That's not his decision to make. Why aren't you blasting the teacher and school for this? It's all about the way he did it, and in this case I don't see anything wrong.

Do you understand what you're really saying?

P.S. "Set her down on her face"? And you're...against the cop. Uh-huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh. Yeah. Sure you are.
Yes :chuckle: I'm glad the cop in Colorado Springs was disciplined for slamming that girl on her face. He probably should have been fired. I'd love to know the details of the discipline but the city wont release that. I'm guessing whatever it was it was too light. If that girl was my daughter, first she'd be in big trouble with me. But I'd be very tempted to find some kind of revenge on the cop too.

I'm not lying to you. If you think so there's not much use in talking.
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
That's not his decision to make.

"I'm only doing my job" means jack and excuses nothing.

Why aren't you blasting the teacher and school for this? It's all about the way he did it, and in this case I don't see anything wrong.

Yeah, they absolutely shoulder some of the blame.

I'm glad the cop in Colorado Springs was disciplined for slamming that girl on her face.

That's better than weasel words and euphemisms.

He probably should have been fired.

Probably won't be. I'd be surprised.
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
If his history of excessive force is linked to a racial bias that is unusual and it is a big deal.

You do realize, don't you, that "excessive force" charges are par for the course when the perp is black? That is what's USUAL.

It's no secret that yelling racism will get you off as quick as "I'm a woman" did in the past. I've had friends who "borrowed" my black brother-in-law to lodge complaints against landlords etc., knowing full well a black will be heard loud and clear for fear of discrimination charges.
 

Mocking You

New member
Because she would then be free to assault either or both, risking all three of them being injured as a result.

Look, it's a hard pill to swallow, maybe, but once it progresses to the point where you have to physically remove someone, it has to be done in a way that minimizes risk to all involved. That usually means focusing on rendering the one who's behaving badly incapable of attacking while you move them. That means grapples, joint locks, handcuffing...whatever it takes.

Now, you watch the video again and then explain to us all how the cop should have removed the girl from her desk and moved her out of the classroom with the least amount of injury to all involved.

If your way seems reasonable and accomplishes this, you might have an argument here.

LOL! The way he did remove her was probably the least safe way a person could have taken. The objective was to remove her from the classroom, the cop was not called to the classroom to arrest her.

I've already said to slide her out of the room with her sitting in her desk. Call her parents and tell them to get her out of the school.
 

Rusha

LIFETIME MEMBER
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Yes :chuckle: I'm glad the cop in Colorado Springs was disciplined for slamming that girl on her face.

Agreed

He probably should have been fired. I'd love to know the details of the discipline but the city wont release that. I'm guessing whatever it was it was too light. If that girl was my daughter, first she'd be in big trouble with me. But I'd be very tempted to find some kind of revenge on the cop too.

One thing I have noticed in these cases is that there is absolutely no expectations for the students involved in these incidents.

Regardless of what happens to the cop, the student, at the very least, should be expelled.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
Lott had earlier told News19 that the student refused to leave after a teacher asked her to. An administrator was called to the room, and also asked the student to leave, Lott said, and she refused again. Finally, the school resource officer came to the room. Lott said the officer forcibly removed the student.

http://www.wltx.com/story/news/local/2015/10/26/spring-valley-high-school-incident/74645568/

she was asked to leave by the teacher and refused
she was asked again to leave by the administrator and refused
she was forcibly removed

sounds like she had plenty of opportunity to avoid what happened :idunno:
 

Mocking You

New member
http://www.wltx.com/story/news/local/2015/10/26/spring-valley-high-school-incident/74645568/

she was asked to leave by the teacher and refused
she was asked again to leave by the administrator and refused
she was forcibly removed

sounds like she had plenty of opportunity to avoid what happened :idunno:

How about the cop saying, "If you don't get out of that chair and come with me I will forcibly eject you and arrest you." Instead he said, "will you move?"

"He asked her again, 'will you move, will you move.' She said 'no I have not done anything wrong.' Then he said I'm going to treat you fairly. And she said 'I don't even know who you are.' ... And that is where it started right there."

Moments later, things turned physical.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/10/27/sc-deputy-classroom-video/74668562/
 

Huckleberry

New member
LOL! The way he did remove her was probably the least safe way a person could have taken. The objective was to remove her from the classroom, the cop was not called to the classroom to arrest her.

I've already said to slide her out of the room with her sitting in her desk. Call her parents and tell them to get her out of the school.

And I already pointed out how that leaves her free to assault the two guys sliding her desk around, leaving them wide open to such an attack.

If you were my boss, and we there to deal with this situation, and you ordered me to do what you're suggesting...I'd refuse. And have every right to. You might very well be opening yourself up to a law suit if someone were injured obeying your orders.

Again, if you can lay out a better way this situation could have been handled that minimizes the possibility of injury for all involved, then you'd have an argument.
 

GuySmiley

Well-known member
http://www.wltx.com/story/news/local/2015/10/26/spring-valley-high-school-incident/74645568/

she was asked to leave by the teacher and refused
she was asked again to leave by the administrator and refused
she was forcibly removed

sounds like she had plenty of opportunity to avoid what happened :idunno:
You were a teacher. What do you think of this?

On one hand you could just let her look at her phone. Maybe she can still listen and do good work. Maybe she'll fail, but that's her fault. Why not just leave her alone?

On the other hand, these are children. They do need to be guided and made to learn sometimes in spite of themselves. Letting her fail the class isn't being a responsible adult or educator. That's more of a good college age policy.
 

Rusha

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How about the cop saying, "If you don't get out of that chair and come with me I will forcibly eject you and arrest you." Instead he said, "will you move?"

"He asked her again, 'will you move, will you move.' She said 'no I have not done anything wrong.' Then he said I'm going to treat you fairly. And she said 'I don't even know who you are.' ... And that is where it started right there."

Moments later, things turned physical.


How about the girl doing what she was asked to do in the first place?
 

Mocking You

New member
And I already pointed out how that leaves her free to assault the two guys sliding her desk around, leaving them wide open to such an attack.

In which case physical force is now in play. You really think a 16 year old girl is going to take down a cop and an adult assistant principal?

If you were my boss, and we there to deal with this situation, and you ordered me to do what you're suggesting...I'd refuse. And have every right to. You might very well be opening yourself up to a law suit if someone were injured obeying your orders.

Well, golly....I wonder if the girl got injured or not with the technique that was used?

Again, if you can lay out a better way this situation could have been handled that minimizes the possibility of injury for all involved, then you'd have an argument.

Use the transporter from the USS Enterprise and send her home. Satisfied?
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
You were a teacher. What do you think of this?

On one hand you could just let her look at her phone. Maybe she can still listen and do good work. Maybe she'll fail, but that's her fault. Why not just leave her alone?

On the other hand, these are children. They do need to be guided and made to learn sometimes in spite of themselves. Letting her fail the class isn't being a responsible adult or educator. That's more of a good college age policy.


i taught in three high schools with very different policies on cell phone use

in one, a rural school, the students were taught from first grade on that the students were not to have their cell phones on school property - if they had to have them after classes, they were to arrange to bring them in and leave them in the front office

we had total buy in from parents and from students and no problems

in the second, the policy was no cell phone use in the classroom - the students could have them in the school, but not during classes. we had constant struggles with this policy and very little support from parents. this was the failing urban school.

in the third, the successful suburban school, the policy was the same as the second, but we had parental support and (mostly) student compliance. We never had a student refuse direction to leave the classroom.


in my experience, when students have the cellphones out, they are distracting to the teacher and to the other students. it disrupts the classroom.




i remember having a discussion with a tenth grade business class once about expectations in the workplace, and how students - serious students - should view the classroom as their job, their workplace setting. you will never get away with disobeying your boss's directives in the workplace. why expect to get away with it in school?
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
In which case physical force is now in play. You really think a 16 year old girl is going to take down a cop and an adult assistant principal?



Well, golly....I wonder if the girl got injured or not with the technique that was used?



Use the transporter from the USS Enterprise and send her home. Satisfied?


i wouldn't have had any problem with him warning her that he'd taze her if she didn't comply


and then tazing her


but the bleeding hearts wouldn't be happy seeing that either, i suspect
 

Huckleberry

New member
In which case physical force is now in play. You really think a 16 year old girl is going to take down a cop and an adult assistant principal?
It's entirely possible. I'm sure this has even happened somewhere, at some time. But regardless, it isn't necessary for the girl to "take down" two grown men. She need only be free to injury one of them to establish your method should not be used.
Well, golly....I wonder if the girl got injured or not with the technique that was used?
Frankly, it's better for the one whose behavior required physical restraint to be injured than those forced to restrain her. It would be far better if she could be removed from the room in a way that doesn't harm either her or those moving her, but you've yet to illustrate how that's possible.
Use the transporter from the USS Enterprise and send her home. Satisfied?
I accept your concession and agree there probably isn't a better way for this to have been handled.

I'm sorry the world is such a place where people sometimes behave so badly that they need to be restrained and removed, and sometimes are injured in the course of that...but you're complaining about the treatment rather than the disease while offering no better course of treatment.
 

Quetzal

New member
You do realize, don't you, that "excessive force" charges are par for the course when the perp is black? That is what's USUAL.
We aren't talk about par for the course. We are talking about this specific instance. In this specific instance we have reason to believe that his actions are racially motivated. If you don't think so, that's fine. But in doing so you are selectively ignoring parts of the story that you disagree with. Cherry picking does not further this discussion.
 

Rusha

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
We aren't talk about par for the course. We are talking about this specific instance. In this specific instance we have reason to believe that his actions are racially motivated. If you don't think so, that's fine. But in doing so you are selectively ignoring parts of the story that you disagree with. Cherry picking does not further this discussion.

Does the student being black give her an excuse to disobey her teacher and disrupt the class?

And yes, I realize the student's refusal and cop's response are two separate issues, however, the only person who is being held blameless for the situation is the student.
 
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