Jesus is God !

[keypurr]

Colossians 1:15 is positional not biological and yes, for the other two He is the express image of God because He is God.

IT SAY QUITE CLEARLY THAT HE IS A CREATURE. Twist all you need to BR, your only fooling yourself.

 

[JudgeRightly]

IT SAY QUITE CLEARLY THAT HE IS A CREATURE. Twist all you need to BR, your only fooling yourself.

Keypurr, Christ died to save all mankind, yes?

 

[keypurr]

Keypurr, Christ died to save all mankind, yes?

Yes he did, thank God he was CREATURE AND COULD DIE FOR US.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Yes he did, thank God he was CREATURE AND COULD DIE FOR US.

If Christ was anything but God himself, his death couldn't even save Himself, let alone all of mankind.

Scripture says:

None of them can by any means redeem his brother, Nor give to God a ransom for him—For the redemption of their souls is costly, And it shall cease forever—That he should continue to live eternally, And not see the Pit. . . . But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave, For He shall receive me. Selah - Psalm 49:7-9,15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm49:7-9,15&version=NKJV

A created being's life is simply not valuable enough to ransom another created being's life.

Spoiler

The Bible teaches that humans cannot ransom one another, nor make payment for sins by their own lives, but that only God can: "Truly no man can ransom another, or give to God the price of his life, 8 for the ransom of their life is costly and can never suffice, 9 that he should live on for ever and never see the pit. ... But God will ransom my soul from the power of Sheol, for he will receive me. Selah" (Psalm 49:7-9, 15) (1) The price of a human life can never suffice as an eternal payment for one's sins, much less an eternal payment for every person in the world's sins. An eternal price is required because life after death is eternal, and sinning against an infinitely holy God incurs an infinite punishment. This means that God alone fits the requirements to pay such a price -- by death, because the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23). Jesus of Nazareth, however, promised that the price of his own life will ransom many: "For even the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” (Mark 10:45) This was accomplished through his death on the cross in Jerusalem, where he bore the sins of the world (1 Peter 2:24), and the Bible teaches that Jesus ransomed people from all over the world for God the Father by his blood: "And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. 9 And they sang a new song, saying, “Worthy are you to take the scroll and to open its seals, for you were slain, and by your blood you ransomed people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation," (Revelation 5:8-9) If Jesus were just a man, angel, or some other kind of lesser being than God, he could not have ransomed billions of sinners all over the world for the Father by his own blood, because the Bible teaches that that would be impossible. Thankfully, however, Jesus is both man and God according to the Bible. Thus, Jesus did not pay the eternal sin price of everyone in the world by giving up just his human life, but by giving up his human anddivine life: "In the beginning was the Word*, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. ... And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth." (John 1:1, 14) "waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Saviour Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works." (Titus 2:13-14) "He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world." (1 John 2:2) Anyone who believes in his atoning death and resurrection from the dead will be saved (Romans 10:9-10). They are those who accept his payment, which is a free gift that's offered to everyone (Romans 6:23). Anyone who rejects the deity of Jesus will not be saved by his atonement, because they believe in a false Christ that cannot ransom anyone (2 Corinthians 11:3-4). * In this passage, the Word refers to Jesus.

From http://redemption-of-humanity.blogspot.com/2017/09/only-god-himself-could-pay-penalty-for.html?m=1

 

[keypurr]

If Christ was anything but God himself, his death couldn't even save Himself, let alone all of mankind.

Scripture says:

None of them can by any means redeem his brother, Nor give to God a ransom for him—For the redemption of their souls is costly, And it shall cease forever—That he should continue to live eternally, And not see the Pit. . . . But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave, For He shall receive me. Selah - Psalm 49:7-9,15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm49:7-9,15&version=NKJV

A created being's life is simply not valuable enough to ransom another created being's life.

Spoiler

The Bible teaches that humans cannot ransom one another, nor make payment for sins by their own lives, but that only God can: "Truly no man can ransom another, or give to God the price of his life, 8 for the ransom of their life is costly and can never suffice, 9 that he should live on for ever and never see the pit. ... But God will ransom my soul from the power of Sheol, for he will receive me. Selah" (Psalm 49:7-9, 15) (1) The price of a human life can never suffice as an eternal payment for one's sins, much less an eternal payment for every person in the world's sins. An eternal price is required because life after death is eternal, and sinning against an infinitely holy God incurs an infinite punishment. This means that God alone fits the requirements to pay such a price -- by death, because the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23). Jesus of Nazareth, however, promised that the price of his own life will ransom many: "For even the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” (Mark 10:45) This was accomplished through his death on the cross in Jerusalem, where he bore the sins of the world (1 Peter 2:24), and the Bible teaches that Jesus ransomed people from all over the world for God the Father by his blood: "And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. 9 And they sang a new song, saying, “Worthy are you to take the scroll and to open its seals, for you were slain, and by your blood you ransomed people for God from every tribe and language and people and nation," (Revelation 5:8-9) If Jesus were just a man, angel, or some other kind of lesser being than God, he could not have ransomed billions of sinners all over the world for the Father by his own blood, because the Bible teaches that that would be impossible. Thankfully, however, Jesus is both man and God according to the Bible. Thus, Jesus did not pay the eternal sin price of everyone in the world by giving up just his human life, but by giving up his human anddivine life: "In the beginning was the Word*, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. ... And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth." (John 1:1, 14) "waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Saviour Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works." (Titus 2:13-14) "He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world." (1 John 2:2) Anyone who believes in his atoning death and resurrection from the dead will be saved (Romans 10:9-10). They are those who accept his payment, which is a free gift that's offered to everyone (Romans 6:23). Anyone who rejects the deity of Jesus will not be saved by his atonement, because they believe in a false Christ that cannot ransom anyone (2 Corinthians 11:3-4). * In this passage, the Word refers to Jesus.

From http://redemption-of-humanity.blogspot.com/2017/09/only-god-himself-could-pay-penalty-for.html?m=1

YOUR WRONG.
It had to be a sinless human to be the Lamb of God.
I thought you were smarter than that.

Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
Heb 10:6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.
Heb 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.

 

[JudgeRightly]

YOUR WRONG.
It had to be a sinless human to be the Lamb of God.
I thought you were smarter than that.

Once again, someone misunderstands what I said. I thought you were smarter than that, Keypurr.

Keypurr, I said:

"If Jesus was anything LESS than God..."

Use that smart brain of yours you say you have and think what that means, Keypurr.

 

[Bright Raven]

IT SAY QUITE CLEARLY THAT HE IS A CREATURE. Twist all you need to BR, your only fooling yourself.

Show me the word creature in scripture. Get yourself a good commentary and see what it says about that verse

 

[glorydaz]

YOUR WRONG.
It had to be a sinless human to be the Lamb of God.
I thought you were smarter than that.

Heb 10:3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
Heb 10:6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.
Heb 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.

Ezekiel 14:20 Though Noah, Daniel, and Job were in it, as I live, saith the Lord God, they shall deliver neither son nor daughter; they shall but deliver their own souls by their righteousness.

 

[keypurr]

Show me the word creature in scripture. Get yourself a good commentary and see what it says about that verse

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

(Bishops) Who is the image of the inuisible God, the first borne of all creatures.
(ESV) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
(ESV+) R9He is the image of R10the invisible God, R11the firstborn of all creation.
(Geneva) Who is the image of the inuisible God, the first begotten of euery creature.
(GNB) Christ is the visible likeness of the invisible God. He is the first-born Son, superior to all created things.
(ISV) The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
(KJV) Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
(KJV+) WhoG3739 isG2076 the imageG1504 of theG3588 invisibleG517 God,G2316 the firstbornG4416 of everyG3956 creature:G2937
(Murdock) who is the likeness of the invisible God, and the first-born of all creatures:
(NAS77) And He is the image of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation.
(NASB) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
(NASB+) N1He is the R1imageG1504 of the R2invisibleG517 GodG2316, the R3firstbornG4416a of allG3956 creationG2937.
(NIrV) Christ is the exact likeness of God, who can't be seen. He is first, and he is over all of creation.
(NIV) The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
(NKJV) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
(NRSV) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
(NRSVA) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
(YLT) who is the image of the invisible God, first-born of all creation,

 

[Bright Raven]

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

(Bishops) Who is the image of the inuisible God, the first borne of all creatures.
(ESV) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
(ESV+) R9He is the image of R10the invisible God, R11the firstborn of all creation.
(Geneva) Who is the image of the inuisible God, the first begotten of euery creature.
(GNB) Christ is the visible likeness of the invisible God. He is the first-born Son, superior to all created things.
(ISV) The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
(KJV) Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
(KJV+) WhoG3739 isG2076 the imageG1504 of theG3588 invisibleG517 God,G2316 the firstbornG4416 of everyG3956 creature:G2937
(Murdock) who is the likeness of the invisible God, and the first-born of all creatures:
(NAS77) And He is the image of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation.
(NASB) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
(NASB+) N1He is the R1imageG1504 of the R2invisibleG517 GodG2316, the R3firstbornG4416a of allG3956 creationG2937.
(NIrV) Christ is the exact likeness of God, who can't be seen. He is first, and he is over all of creation.
(NIV) The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
(NKJV) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
(NRSV) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
(NRSVA) He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
(YLT) who is the image of the invisible God, first-born of all creation,

Do you have a commentary? Most of your translations say creation. Whats up with that? Have you read what it says about that verse because you GROSSLY misinterpret what it says.

 

[beloved57]

Think about what an image is belove57.

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Rabbit Trail continues

Sent from my LGMP260 using Tapatalk

 

[keypurr]

Once again, someone misunderstands what I said. I thought you were smarter than that, Keypurr.

Keypurr, I said:

"If Jesus was anything LESS than God..."

Use that smart brain of yours you say you have and think what that means, Keypurr.

Jesus is less than God.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Jesus is less than God.

Then His death saved ABSOLUTELY NO ONE.

 

[keypurr]

Do you have a commentary? Most of your translations say creation. Whats up with that? Have you read what it says about that verse because you GROSSLY misinterpret what it says.

I have commentaries BR, all written by men, most of which by Trins who do not know any better.

Read the scriptures for yourself BR, clear your mind of all the traditions from our forefathers and learn truth.

The words in post 2989 are not mine, not one will tell you that Jesus is God.

 

[JudgeRightly]

I have commentaries BR, all written by men,

There's your problem.

most of which by Trins who do not know any better.

Read the scriptures for yourself BR, clear your mind of all the traditions from our forefathers and learn truth.

The words in post 2989 are not mine, not one will tell you that Jesus is God.

John 1:1, 14; Psalm 49:7-9, 15; Mark 10:45; 1 Peter 2:24

All of those verses declare Jesus to be God.

 

[keypurr]

Judge, for you.

Acts 10:40 – This MAN God raised on the third day."
It doesn’t get any simpler than this. There is no way to misunderstand this verse. Okay, let’s see if your catching on.
Who did God raise? That’s right, this MAN!
Who raised this MAN? Bingo, God!
Acts 17:31 – "God has overlooked the times of ignorance, but now He demands that all people everywhere repent because He has established a day on which He will judge the world with justice through a MAN He has appointed, and He has provided confirmation for all by raising him from the dead.
Whom Did God appoint? A MAN.
Who appointed this MAN? God.
Now you’re getting the hang of it.
1 Timothy 2:5 – "For there is one God and one mediator also between God and men, the MAN Christ Jesus."
1. Who is the mediator? The MAN Christ Jesus.
2. Who is he the mediator between? God and men.
He is not the mediator between himself and men, but between God and men. You can see that Jesus is not considered in the term "God."
1 Corinthians 15: 21 –"For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man"
So wait, I think I’ve got it now. He is a MAN anointed by God. Yessirree Bob! Hallelujah! So that’s what Peter was saying in Acts.
Acts 10:38 – "How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the holy Spirit and power.
1.Who did God anoint? Jesus.
2.Who anointed Jesus? God.

From my old notes book, not my written notes.

 

[keypurr]

There's your problem.



John 1:1, 14; Psalm 49:7-9, 15; Mark 10:45; 1 Peter 2:24

All of those verses declare Jesus to be God.

I do not see it that way judge, none of them pinpoint the flesh son as a God.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Judge, for you.

Acts 10:40 – This MAN God raised on the third day."
It doesn’t get any simpler than this. There is no way to misunderstand this verse. Okay, let’s see if your catching on.
Who did God raise? That’s right, this MAN!
Who raised this MAN? Bingo, God!
Acts 17:31 – "God has overlooked the times of ignorance, but now He demands that all people everywhere repent because He has established a day on which He will judge the world with justice through a MAN He has appointed, and He has provided confirmation for all by raising him from the dead.
Whom Did God appoint? A MAN.
Who appointed this MAN? God.
Now you’re getting the hang of it.
1 Timothy 2:5 – "For there is one God and one mediator also between God and men, the MAN Christ Jesus."
1. Who is the mediator? The MAN Christ Jesus.
2. Who is he the mediator between? God and men.
He is not the mediator between himself and men, but between God and men. You can see that Jesus is not considered in the term "God."
1 Corinthians 15: 21 –"For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man"
So wait, I think I’ve got it now. He is a MAN anointed by God. Yessirree Bob! Hallelujah! So that’s what Peter was saying in Acts.
Acts 10:38 – "How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the holy Spirit and power.
1.Who did God anoint? Jesus.
2.Who anointed Jesus? God.

Thank you, Keypurr, for providing and proving HALF OF MY ENTIRE ARGUMENT!

Now, get a load of this!

None of them can by any means redeem his brother, Nor give to God a ransom for him—For the redemption of their souls is costly, And it shall cease forever—That he should continue to live eternally, And not see the Pit.But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave, For He shall receive me. Selah - Psalm 49:7-9,15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm49:7-9,15&version=NKJV

NO MAN CAN REDEEM HIS BROTHER, NOR GIVE GOD A RANSOM FOR HIM!

IF Jesus was JUST A MAN, instead of BOTH GOD AND MAN, then HE COULD NOT, EVER, SAVE ANYONE BY DYING!

So Keypurr, you assert that Jesus is not God. Because the above is true, what then is the reason you give for Christ dying on the Cross?

 

[JudgeRightly]

I do not see it that way judge, none of them pinpoint the flesh son as a God.

NOT "A GOD", Dimwit. THE GOD. THE ONLY GOD.

See my above comment.

 

[keypurr]

There's your problem.



John 1:1, 14; Psalm 49:7-9, 15; Mark 10:45; 1 Peter 2:24

All of those verses declare Jesus to be God.

Then they are all wrong.

Listen to your Lord, not men who have no idea of the words message?

(Bishops) This is lyfe eternall, that they myght knowe thee, the only true God, & Iesus Christe whom thou hast sent.

(ESV) And this is eternal life, that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.

(Geneva) And this is life eternall, that they knowe thee to be the onely very God, and whom thou hast sent, Iesus Christ.

(GNB) And eternal life means to know you, the only true God, and to know Jesus Christ, whom you sent.

(ISV) And this is eternal life: to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent—Jesus the Messiah.

(KJV) And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

(NAS77) "And this is eternal life, that they may know Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom Thou hast sent.

(NASB) "This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

(NIrV) "And what is eternal life? It is knowing you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

(NIV) Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

(NKJV) And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

(NRSV) And this is eternal life, that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.

(NRSVA) And this is eternal life, that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.

(YLT) and this is the life age-during, that they may know Thee, the only true God, and him whom Thou didst send—Jesus Christ;